Bunker knocked out too easily?

[weapon2010]

yes bunkers are knocked out to easily, I feel all defensive works don't give enough protection and need to be tweaked in favor of the defender, that goes for trenches, foxholes, and sandbags

[chuckdyke]

5 hours ago, weapon2010 said:

yes bunkers are knocked out to easily, I feel all defensive works don't give enough protection and need to be tweaked in favor of the defender, that goes for trenches, foxholes, and sandbags

 

Too easy to spot even on Iron, if you study the map you already see geometric outlines on the terrain. You can't use foxholes for a listening or standing patrol. As they are supposed to be constructed prior a scenario, I would assume their camouflage would give them a fog of war bonus. I don't have a problem that they are easy to knock out, it is their visibility I have an issue with. 

[mjkerner]

chuckdyke, that may be an issue with your comp. I’m not certain, but there is a thread here somewhere where others noted that same thing about seeing the outlines of fortifications, but I don’t have that issue. I thought it was suggested that it might have to do with video cards or something. But I have CRS, so who knows?

[Sgt.Squarehead]

I've always been able to spot fortifications, they leave a whopping dent in the terrain (I spent a while messing with this in H&E, trying to use uneven base terrain & jungle to hide it).

[chuckdyke]

On 1/7/2021 at 1:06 AM, mjkerner said:

chuckdyke, that may be an issue with your comp. I’m not certain, but there is a thread here somewhere where others noted that same thing about seeing the outlines of fortifications, but I don’t have that issue. I thought it was suggested that it might have to do with video cards or something. But I have CRS, so who knows?

I agree with @Sgt.Squarehead Also I think it has to do with FOW the longer the game progresses the more obvious it becomes.

[Sgt.Squarehead]

14 hours ago, chuckdyke said:

Also I think it has to do with FOW the longer the game progresses the more obvious it becomes.

Nope, AFAIK it's there from setup.....It can take a while to spot it, especially if the designer goes to some effort to hide it (I am doing this right now on a variant of my Delta map for CM:H&E), but it's thre right enough, if you know where to look.

On 1/6/2021 at 5:06 PM, mjkerner said:

thought it was suggested that it might have to do with video cards or something. But I have CRS, so who knows?

@mjkerner  Simple test mate.....In CM:SF2 flick the editor into Red vs. Red then lay down a half a dozen empty bunkers & a few dozen trenches in a nice trenchy pattern, for each side on a small map.....Give 'em a Spy each too.

Save it as a scenario, then start it up in the game.....As soon as you click 'Big Red' you should see the terrain deform where your opponent's fortifications are and you should be able to discern the trenchlines by going to Height 1.

[chuckdyke]

10 hours ago, Sgt.Squarehead said:

Nope, AFAIK it's there from setup.....It can take a while to spot it, especially if the designer goes to some effort to hide it (I am doing this right now on a variant of my Delta map for CM:H&E), but it's thre right enough, if you know where to look.

@mjkerner  Simple test mate.....In CM:SF2 flick the editor into Red vs. Red then lay down a half a dozen empty bunkers & a few dozen trenches in a nice trenchy pattern, for each side on a small map.....Give 'em a Spy each too.

Save it as a scenario, then start it up in the game.....As soon as you click 'Big Red' you should see the terrain deform where your opponent's fortifications are and you should be able to discern the trenchlines by going to Height 1.

Ok explain this in Edge of Darkness the snipers get LOS on the Bunkers but the TAC just next to him (any closer and they would be gay). Doesn't and he is the guy I need for the plotting. With the sniper I could plot on the Icon with the TAC I plot the area. They both have night vision, and both have lasers. I have some theories but no hard evidence. 

[Sgt.Squarehead]

That doesn't seem to relate to what we are discussing.....What I was attempting to describe/demonstrate is the way Fortifcation Units deform the 3d terrain model when the game starts, it's very obvious if you lay them out in a clear pattern on a small otherwise featureless map. 

I don't want to make a test & screenshots myself as it's time consumng and I already know the outcome, plus I've got plenty of better things to do, both in the editor and in the real world.

Edited January 18, 2021 by Sgt.Squarehead