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Marines Out of Tank Warfare!


John Kettler
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1 hour ago, Grey_Fox said:

a cheaper tank is better than a more expensive tank, right?

Well yes... depending on its purpose.  One doesn't need a MBT with all its expensive bells and whistles if all one is trying to do is demolish buildings a couple hundred meters down an urban street (and for some reason one cannot use precision aerial munitions).  What one needs is a heavily armored "Sturmtiger" - basically a big gun on a heavily armored chassis.  And if there is no crew, the remote control bit could be a protected cable snaking back to a control unit.  

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4 hours ago, Erwin said:

Well yes... depending on its purpose.  One doesn't need a MBT with all its expensive bells and whistles if all one is trying to do is demolish buildings a couple hundred meters down an urban street (and for some reason one cannot use precision aerial munitions).  What one needs is a heavily armored "Sturmtiger" - basically a big gun on a heavily armored chassis.  And if there is no crew, the remote control bit could be a protected cable snaking back to a control unit.  

That's going to be a pretty niche use-case though, I'd guess that most people would prefer a vehicle which could fight it's way to the city and also be able to knock buildings down.

Cables in warzones tend to not last very long, and making something fully remotely-operable tends to not be cheap.

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Pull back, use a JDAM, let god sort 'em out.  ;)

PS - There's a bit of a problem when it comes to fitting whopping guns to vehicles intended to fight in an urban environment, 'Kelly's Heroes' makes play on it:

IIRC this is one of the reasons that Germany's 120mm L/55 isn't terribly widely used.

Edited by Sgt.Squarehead
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On 12/7/2020 at 9:30 PM, Sgt.Squarehead said:

 

 this is one of the reasons that Germany's 120mm L/55 isn't terribly widely used.

Not really. You never send tanks without infantry into cities so the additional meter of barrel length isnt a big problem. That the additional weight of it tends to overheat the electrical system used to stabilize it in heavy terrain on the other hand is a bigger issue. The leo2a7 new cooling system for the combat compartment isnt there for crew comfort. Its there to keep the electronics working with crew comfort simply being an incidental benefit.

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BAE Systems has presented an infographic on its light tank being created as part of the Mobile Protected Firepower project. Compared to the old M8 AGS, upgraded BAE MPF turret with widened sides for the installation of the Iron Fist. The power plant, fire control system and vetronics were also upgraded on the machine. BAE MPF is armed with a 105mm M35 cannon and a 7.62mm coaxial machine gun. The crew consists of a commander, gunner and driver. The tank is powered by a new MTU diesel engine with an Allison 3040MX transmission.

488291575-Baes-infographic-Dist-A-Army-A

Edited by HUSKER2142
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On 10/27/2020 at 9:05 PM, holoween said:

I can tell you i wouldnt want to be the guy having to launch a javelin at an mbt that can fire a 120mm+ airburst he shell, has several thermal optics equally if not more powerfull than my own. I might kill the tank but the he grenade will kill me and my buddies. And if the tank has an APS i cant even expect a kill. And since tanks arent used alone and if the one im shooting at doesnt get me another one probably will.

As for economics youre not really making fair comparisons. Every MBT will cost far more to initially acuire but the ammunition is far cheaper. Now take in mind youre not always shooting at MBTs so your cost effectiveness for missiles goes way down.

What are the economics when you throw in loitering munitions like the Harpy/Harop which proved pretty effective during the recent Armenia-Azerbaijan conflict? I am not sure if I would use a multi-million dollar (what does it cost?) Harop on a bus full of conscripts but the price point on these things is only going to come down.

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