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Artillery suicide run bug is back.


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So I just updated to the latest CMBN version, thinking the bug had been solved where troops would immediately start to get up and run when artillery was incoming. Turns out it's still happening.

I'm having a team in a hedgerow. Morale +1 OK

Enemy spotting round hits on the other side of the hedgerow. The team gets suppressed and "nervous". They cower for a bit but stay where they are. They are not panicked.

15 seconds later, the enemy barrage is incoming. The whole team suddenly gets up and runs through a bocage gap towards the enemy. The barrage lands and kills the running team in open ground.

Savegame available, of course.

Edited by Bulletpoint
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I noticed one going in front, under small arms fire !!!
however this one is coming in a particular context (mixed wood of hedge) and once in hundreds of cases
honestly I find the setting of the AI very successful and for a strangeness I noticed hundreds of consistent behavior

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2 hours ago, Howler said:

I'm also not seeing it when *my* artillery is blasting foxholes...

How often are you seeing it?

I don't know if it happens with foxholes. I noticed it happen with a team in a hedgerow with a small opening in it. Doesn't seem to happen all the time.

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There was a thread about this recently. but I can't remember the title. My experience re artillery was that infantry only ran through a gap towards the enemy if arty rounds landed right behind them and cut off any route back to hard cover. And that only happened once through an entire campaign. 

Sadly, infantry getting stuck whilst moving through gaps in a hedgerow, or even moving away from a hedgerow into open ground happened more often than I would have liked.

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9 minutes ago, Warts 'n' all said:

There was a thread about this recently. but I can't remember the title. My experience re artillery was that infantry only ran through a gap towards the enemy if arty rounds landed right behind them and cut off any route back to hard cover. And that only happened once through an entire campaign. 

Sadly, infantry getting stuck whilst moving through gaps in a hedgerow, or even moving away from a hedgerow into open ground happened more often than I would have liked.

The chorus of this may be appropriate for your CMBN song thread then ...

https://history.wiltshire.gov.uk/community/getfolk.php?id=942

Oh and I know - zero or minus points.

 

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We would have to see the save game to see what happened. I have been playing a lot of CMBS games lately with infantry under attack by artillery, both in and out of foxholes and all my troops stay put, even when they suffer casualties and/or are shaken.

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1 hour ago, Sgt Joch said:

We would have to see the save game to see what happened. I have been playing a lot of CMBS games lately with infantry under attack by artillery, both in and out of foxholes and all my troops stay put, even when they suffer casualties and/or are shaken.

It might be a bocage thing. I have a savegame if anyone is interested.

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On 9/14/2020 at 4:30 PM, Bulletpoint said:

It might be a bocage thing. I have a savegame if anyone is interested.

Could be. They also could not be running in panic towards the enemy but instead trying to get on the other side of the bocage to get cover from the artillery. Granted that's a bad idea if there are enemy MGs pointed at them but still that might be what they are trying to do. The artillery evade AI is supposed to find cover rather than stay and get blown up. So, important information is how aware are they of the enemy they are running towards and what other options do they have?

But game saves would be need.

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23 minutes ago, IanL said:

They also could not be running in panic towards the enemy but instead trying to get on the other side of the bocage to get cover from the artillery. Granted that's a bad idea if there are enemy MGs pointed at them but still that might be what they are trying to do. The artillery evade AI is supposed to find cover rather than stay and get blown up. So, important information is how aware are they of the enemy they are running towards and what other options do they have?

The important part here is not the direction they evade, but that they evade at all. I thought the artillery evade behaviour had been simply removed from the game?

Edited by Bulletpoint
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13 hours ago, Bulletpoint said:

I thought the artillery evade behaviour had been simply removed from the game?

Oh no not at all. It introduced several side effects the last to get fixed was the running towards the enemy in the bocage when fired on by small arms.

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1 hour ago, IanL said:

Oh no not at all. It introduced several side effects the last to get fixed was the running towards the enemy in the bocage when fired on by small arms.

OK, then I guess they are only supposed to evade if they are caught by artillery in the open?

In that case, I guess what's happening in this case is that somebody forgot to tell the engine that the small-bocage-with-opening-tile is to be considered cover, and that troops are not supposed to run away from it if artillery falls.

Because in the same scenario, arty also fell on other squads that were close to small bocage, and they didn't run.

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They are still supposed to proactively avoid HE fire.
 

Baseless speculation, but if they were getting HE fire from the rear, then the bocage is doing nothing to protect them, so there would be some logic in a panicked run through.

I've shelled the near side of bocage with direct fire HE (e.g., infantry guns) since the patch, recreating the scenario where I was reliably able to replicate this, and they do not evade forward now.

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51 minutes ago, domfluff said:

Baseless speculation, but if they were getting HE fire from the rear, then the bocage is doing nothing to protect them, so there would be some logic in a panicked run through.

They took a single spotting round on the other side of the bocage. Got pinned. 10 15 seconds later they got up immediately when the barrage was incoming, ran through the gap in the bocage and into the open field where there's no cover. There's no real logic to that.

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