Recrewing vehicles

[JulianJ]

I went back to one of my earliest QBs from CMBS, where I didn't do particularly well.  Strykers and Hummvees v. Russian infantry.

I restarted it from the beginning and did much better.

But I took a lot of vehicle crew casualties, especially Stryker gunners - that's a job I wouldn't want, along with those Roman guys who spent their days up to their knees in urine; I forget why - tanning leather?  Anyway, I obviously had functioning vehicles with no gunners, and ones with their weapons smashed, but crew OK, or just a driver, so I wanted to recombine them to have some to return to the fray, and a LMTV which had no M2 gunner. But it didn't seem to work, bit puzzled, hope someone can throw some light on this.

Obviously we have solved the issue of Russian BMP/BTR dismount - by having a Strela guy mount up as leader - I do like this multi-tasking :-), which works. (Although it's an exploit, which purists may abhor).

I was also slighly puzzled by the damage inflicted on the 'armoured' HMMVs - basically the gunner gets killed or the weapon is knocked out, but no other casualties seem to be suffered by small arms fire. There's no vehicles immobilised by tyre or engine damage, no other crew casualties caused by penetrating fire. I don't know, but I find that unlikely.

[Chibot Mk IX]

3 hours ago, JulianJ said:

 

But I took a lot of vehicle crew casualties, especially Stryker gunners - that's a job I wouldn't want, along with those Roman guys who spent their days up to their knees in urine; I forget why - tanning leather?  Anyway, I obviously had functioning vehicles with no gunners, and ones with their weapons smashed, but crew OK, or just a driver, so I wanted to recombine them to have some to return to the fray, and a LMTV which had no M2 gunner. But it didn't seem to work, bit puzzled, hope someone can throw some light on this.

 

I guess most of your Stryker gunners casualty happened during reloading process, caused by small arms fire. They have to expose themselves outside the vehicles to reload the MG or GL.

I don't quite understand the second part.  You want to combine the crew?  How? Crew teams are individual teams, they cannot be combined.  If you lost the gunner on the APC or IFV, you can mount a squad or a team (or another driver who lost his gunner mate) onto the vehicle, someone will occupy the gunner position.

[JulianJ]

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 If you lost the gunner on the APC or IFV, you can mount a squad or a team (or another driver who lost his gunner mate) onto the vehicle, someone will occupy the gunner position.

No,  that doesn't seem to work. Soldiers just appear to be in the "passengers" section of the vehicle.  And, as I explained, no-one is manning the LMTV mg - I added the driver and gunner from a Stryker that had its weapon destroyed, and they just sat in the back.

[JulianJ]

Yes, that definitely seems to be the case, I have "recrewed" a couple of Strykers with other Stryker drivers and they do not take the gunner position. Otherwise I've been taking remarkably light casualties, lost my first vehicle with only 5 minutes to go timewise.

[domfluff]

On 4/27/2019 at 6:23 PM, JulianJ said:

But I took a lot of vehicle crew casualties, especially Stryker gunners - that's a job I wouldn't want, along with those Roman guys who spent their days up to their knees in urine; I forget why - tanning leather?  Anyway, I obviously had functioning vehicles with no gunners, and ones with their weapons smashed, but crew OK, or just a driver, so I wanted to recombine them to have some to return to the fray, and a LMTV which had no M2 gunner. But it didn't seem to work, bit puzzled, hope someone can throw some light on this.

Obviously we have solved the issue of Russian BMP/BTR dismount - by having a Strela guy mount up as leader - I do like this multi-tasking :-), which works. (Although it's an exploit, which purists may abhor).

A couple of comments here - Strykers (and humvees) aren't combat vehicles. If your gunners are getting shot at, they're probably unbuttoned, or in situations which are not conducive to their continuing health. They can provide support from range, or hull down, but those are not their first intended use.

Using a anti-air asset for spotting is not only an "exploit", it's also a waste of a BMP. The BMPs *are* fighting vehicles, and achieve their protection through a combination of range (they can engage effectively from 1km away) and excessive firepower. Typically you'll dismount later with BMPs than you would with Strykers, or even Bradleys. Javelins certainly overmatch them, but aside from that you want the infantry to be mounted and manning the forward MGs, until they're ready to assault the target. "Ready" in this case is usually when the target is fully suppressed - it's not about having a fair fight.

The other issue with using AA assets in this context is that it takes room that could be used for more useful supporting fires - ATGMs, RPOs, AGL, MMGs, Engineers, whatever. It you're taking space with an additional squad member, then you're wasting space that could be used for something more productive.

[JulianJ]

To put this in context, this is a game. Many of the CMBS battles take place at fairly close range, and due to the nature of the QB, (which is the one where there are 3 objectives one behind each other in a very forested rectangular N-S battlefield in 45 mins), I have no other choice than to commit them to close combat. Because so many Strykers have been rendered ineffective, I am using ATGM HMMVs by using them in a flanking movement then dismounting their crews to fight as infantry. Which I recognise is bizarre.

Two points: 1. as a notional military commander I have been ordered to take these three objectives - I can't really say "no, I haven't got the force mix" to my imaginary superiors. The battlefield constrains what is possible.
2. There'd be no point playing this particular QB otherwise.  This is the second playthrough and things have gone a lot better than the first. I am still not convinced that the way that the gunner cops his whack all the time is realistic, given that he's under armour except while reloading and still has a gunshield.

  

Quote

The other issue with using AA assets in this context is that it takes room that could be used for more useful supporting fires - ATGMs, RPOs, AGL, MMGs, Engineers, whatever. It you're taking space with an additional squad member, then you're wasting space that could be used for something more productive.

No, it's because the single-man Strela operator can function as the BMP commander with the cheapest use of points. He could be armed with large wet fish for all I care.

[Sgt.Squarehead]

It would be good if it were possible to merge vehicle crews from the same platoon/company, especially in a campaign format.....Maybe one day. 

[Chibot Mk IX]

On 4/27/2019 at 5:41 PM, JulianJ said:

No,  that doesn't seem to work. Soldiers just appear to be in the "passengers" section of the vehicle.  And, as I explained, no-one is manning the LMTV mg - I added the driver and gunner from a Stryker that had its weapon destroyed, and they just sat in the back.

follow up on this topic,   this is a test on Stryker, 

 

A private took gunner position 

 

and they have a staff sergeant do the dangerous reloading work

[JulianJ]

Thanks for your test. What I was saying is not that infantry can crew the weapons, but that you often have functional Strykers and other vehicles which have lost crewmembers. Getting drivers, gunners etc out of other vehicles to recrew and return to battle at least some of them does not seem to work.

[Erwin]

LAV's are another example of vehicles that have dedicated crews and no one else seems to be able to embark if the original crew disembarks.  In addition vehicles like LAV's have 5.56mm ammo that seems to be usable by troops, but no one can embark to acquire it.

There are other vehicles like Humvees with 50 cals, AGL's etc that also will not accept other troops as new crews.  (However, troops can embark these Humvees to acquire extra ammo.)

PS:  Just realized that this is for CMBS.  My experience with this issue has been mostly with CMSF1 and 2.  So, CMBS may have different issues.  The only thing that's certain is that it's all rather confusing.

Edited July 19, 2019 by Erwin

[sburke]

5 hours ago, Erwin said:

PS:  Just realized that this is for CMBS.  My experience with this issue has been mostly with CMSF1 and 2.  So, CMBS may have different issues.  The only thing that's certain is that it's all rather confusing.

yeah and that does apply.  There are vehicle issues that are somewhat inconsistent.  For example in CMSF2 you can dismount the 240 mg and GL hummv and mount other units and use the heavy weapon, you can't do that with the M2 mg.