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Brit army grogs or vets - whats the deal with the warrior


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5 hours ago, Sgt.Squarehead said:

LOL, those were great! I say we should give them something real to complain about. Bring back C-rats. They've got Beans and Frank's, and Spagetti W/meatballs. They're very rare though, cause Supply usually scarfed them up for themselves or to sell because they about the only edible ones in the cases. The Beef Slices W/Potatoes and the Ham and Lima Beans( or as we called them, Ham and Mother#%*^#%s) were only editable if you were starving. You can heat them with heat tabs, and the fats would melt, but you are always moving so you ate them cold. The instant coffee is saved for nighttime because it's actually the caffeine that they take out of the decaf coffee. One packet per canteen cup, and you're wired for the night.

So, if they don't like MRE's, let them eat Rats!

@Sublime, sorry about hijacking your thread.

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Sorry guys, I'll preface all future 'duffel-links' with a suitable warning.....I just put one in my Afghanistan thread.  ;)

As for the comments on MRE.....I believe DB is staffed by veterans?  They would know a great deal more about MREs than me, therefore as far as I'm concerned, their comments are gospel!  :P

PS - Going back to the original subject, Warrior is pretty much what Bradley was originally intended to be, before 'history' intervened.....Parodied here:

 

Edited by Sgt.Squarehead
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I saw that movie when it first came out back when it was on HBO IIRC. It was before the 1991 Gulf War too so like many weapons at the time Apache, M1 tank there were plenty of doubters. I would venture to guess the Bradley has performed ok in real life?

At least in Black Sea and SF2 they seem to rule over the Russian equivalents if that counts for anything. At least I don't have to worry about sticking scouts or vehicle crews from destroyed vehicles into my Bradleys to get better spotting like the BMPs of BTRs.

Still the movies does illustrates things in a way. After years in the private and government sector, yes there are way things gets done can sometimes make one scratch their head.

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On the Warrior's armament, the predecessor FV430 series did have an ATGM variant, but that system (the Swingfire) was phased out. Right now the British Army basically only fields the Javelin as its ATGM, if I am not mistaken (except for the Hellfires on AAC Apaches).

There are proposed FV510 variants with a turret that will launch Javelins, but I don't believe any have been produced.  I would guess the main reason for the lack of an ATGM version is a combination of the lack of a suitable ATGM option at the time of adoption (suitable for cost and policy reasons I mean) and now the lack of budget to adopt the Javelin-based variant, based on what was said above! 

 

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On ‎12‎/‎27‎/‎2018 at 8:32 PM, db_zero said:

At least in Black Sea and SF2 they seem to rule over the Russian equivalents if that counts for anything.

Based on my CMBS experience:

1) With the advent of APS, if an IFV tries to duke it out with a modern MBT it will lose and lose badly.  Ergo, to get best use out of the thing it is probably best to revert to the battle taxi /infantry support role.

2)  What CMSF/CMBS do NOT simulate (for reasons of playability) is the game of musical chairs that results with Warrior and Bradley due to small (7 pax) passenger capacity.  Inevitably, this results in more of the things being needed to transport either a British or US infantry platoon.

3)  Comparisons may well be odious, but the BMP3 carries three more troops than Warrior or Bradley, has a better gun, lower silhouette AND is fully amphibious. 

4)  If a Bradley goes toe to toe with BMP3 it is probably likely to prevail, but arguably that  misses the point.  Provided IFVs don't get ideas above their station and are kept out of the way of serious opposition, then surely BMP3 does the job best.

5)  If I am wrong, I would be delighted to be shot down in flames over this provided the person doing it explains WHY.  🤔

SLR

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1 hour ago, SelfLoadingRifle said:

Based on my CMBS experience:

1) With the advent of APS, if an IFV tries to duke it out with a modern MBT it will lose and lose badly.  Ergo, to get best use out of the thing it is probably best to revert to the battle taxi /infantry support role.

2)  What CMSF/CMBS do NOT simulate (for reasons of playability) is the game of musical chairs that results with Warrior and Bradley due to small (7 pax) passenger capacity.  Inevitably, this results in more of the things being needed to transport either a British or US infantry platoon.

3)  Comparisons may well be odious, but the BMP3 carries three more troops than Warrior or Bradley, has a better gun, lower silhouette AND is fully amphibious. 

4)  If a Bradley goes toe to toe with BMP3 it is probably likely to prevail, but arguably that  misses the point.  Provided IFVs don't get ideas above their station and are kept out of the way of serious opposition, then surely BMP3 does the job best.

5)  If I am wrong, I would be delighted to be shot down in flames over this provided the person doing it explains WHY.  🤔

SLR

I was comparing Bradleys vs BMP or BTR-2. In my h2h as well as test QB's the Bradley comes out on top the majority of the time. I agree against MBTs any ICV is generally outclassed especially if the MBT has APS. I haven't seen it enough to really know, but from the few times I've seen the top attack TOW against MBT's it seems to be effective. I don't ever recall seeing a Javelin stopped by APS

What I see quite a bit of in h2h2 games is the pairing of an IFV or 2 with an MBT. The IFV is the sacrificial lamb to draw fire or spot. Occasionally you can also just aggressively maneuver the IFV to get side or rear shots with the auto cannon where is it effective against MBT. You can get a tank to turn and expose itself.

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59 minutes ago, db_zero said:

I don't ever recall seeing a Javelin stopped by APS

I have seen it once. The T90 with aps was on a slope such that the javelin came down inside the aps envelope. I should have captured it because it was a cool surprise - even for me the side that launched the missile.

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12 hours ago, IanL said:

I have seen it once. The T90 with aps was on a slope such that the javelin came down inside the aps envelope. I should have captured it because it was a cool surprise - even for me the side that launched the missile.

I have atop down picture of the new Russian Armata tank. It has a cluster of devices on top of the turret. Some say its smoke launchers. Others think it might be an APS system designed to deal with Javelins.

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The UK fields Brimstones ( upgraded hellfires ) on their apaches.

I certainly think itll be a looong time before APS is prevalent enough for me to warrant taking ATGMs off IFVs and despite what sputnik news says Javelins are real and largely fielded. Aps isnt largely fielded and the only proof we have it can KO javs or kinetic rounds is the Russ govts word

Ps from what I read on ARRSE the swingfire was just as dangerous to the operator

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