Jump to content

Recommended Posts

Playing "Rolling on the River" against the AI. 

Here's my question....I am well familiar with the much discussed "issue" of javelin teams remaining prone when you REALLY need them to be kneeling/ready to fire. Especially in wheat fields, high grass, etc. But...does any know if Stryker scout squads(not snipers) are coded/able to fire Javelins? 

In this case, I decided to equip my scout squads with Javelin launchers & missiles b/c I was planning on pushing them well forward and I wanted something more powerful then the .50 cals and Mk19s that their Strykers come with. To do so, I had to "strip" the weapons out of the infantry stryker vehicles. But...no matter what they spot (tanks, BTRs, AFVs) they won't seem to use those javelins!! :angry:

Am I assuming too much in thinking that, although not specifically given an AT gunner in the squad, no one knows how to use the javelin??

I'm interested in hearing everyone's opinion... 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 61
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

1 hour ago, sburke said:

Anyone who will pick it up will use it, just make sure they have ammo

That's what I thought, but...the team has 3 rounds and the the thermal sights. I'm beginning to think US "regular" infantry and cavalry troops are trained to use...but maybe not scouts. The first two carry it as part of the regular loadout. Don't remember US scouts ever having any in the game. It certainly isn't in any of their "scout version strykers".

Link to post
Share on other sites

No to my knowledge there is no "training" factor in CM for AT weapons. If  pixeltruppen can acquire the weapon via acquire or buddy aid they can use it.  A scout is not typically assigned one simply because they are a scout.  That is a ToE issue not a factor of capability. HQ units aren't assigned one either, but they can use it. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
59 minutes ago, sburke said:

If  pixeltruppen can acquire the weapon via acquire or buddy aid they can use it.

Not necessarily disagreeing with you but I have seen examples in game where this is not the case. For example...I had a situation in game where my lone FO (I was playing as Russia) got killed, but his assistant(I think they are usually radio operators) did  a "medic" on him and somehow recovered his laser designator. Hooray for me I thought! Especially since he was my only FO and we all know that the Russians NEED their FOs if they want to get any sort of timely artillery support.

But...No...the assistant was "X'd out" from calling any artillery. I thought to myself..."Then WHY did he bother (and the game allow him?) to recover the laser designator??? <_<  Only time I ever seen that(recover a designator) happen though...

Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, cbennett88 said:

Playing "Rolling on the River" against the AI. 

Here's my question....I am well familiar with the much discussed "issue" of javelin teams remaining prone when you REALLY need them to be kneeling/ready to fire. Especially in wheat fields, high grass, etc. But...does any know if Stryker scout squads(not snipers) are coded/able to fire Javelins? 

In this case, I decided to equip my scout squads with Javelin launchers & missiles b/c I was planning on pushing them well forward and I wanted something more powerful then the .50 cals and Mk19s that their Strykers come with. To do so, I had to "strip" the weapons out of the infantry stryker vehicles. But...no matter what they spot (tanks, BTRs, AFVs) they won't seem to use those javelins!! :angry:

Am I assuming too much in thinking that, although not specifically given an AT gunner in the squad, no one knows how to use the javelin??

I'm interested in hearing everyone's opinion... 

Is it possible that you are just dealing with MT-LBs for now and the soldiers are just sparing the missiles for juicier targets?  What happens if you order to target the vehicle?

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Stefano Z said:

Is it possible that you are just dealing with MT-LBs for now and the soldiers are just sparing the missiles for juicier targets?  What happens if you order to target the vehicle?

I have experienced that before, so I understand what you are talking about...but I am already half through the game (well past the appearance of the MBTs *spoiler alert!;)) and these squads just let the MBTs roll by. I watched them during the turn. They just stay in "spotting" status the whole time. None of them change weapons to the javelin (watching the side info box). In fact...even looking at the individual soldiers, I see their AT-4...but no sign of the javelin being carried... :o

1 hour ago, sburke said:

Maybe you gave it to Gomer Pyle

Lol! But these are listed as "crack" troops! 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, cbennett88 said:

I have experienced that before, so I understand what you are talking about...but I am already half through the game (well past the appearance of the MBTs *spoiler alert!;)) and these squads just let the MBTs roll by. I watched them during the turn. They just stay in "spotting" status the whole time. None of them change weapons to the javelin (watching the side info box). In fact...even looking at the individual soldiers, I see their AT-4...but no sign of the javelin being carried... :o

Lol! But these are listed as "crack" troops! 

I see, how far are the MBT?

Link to post
Share on other sites

What you are reporting is strange. I recently had a game with lots of Scouts armed with Javelins and they all seemed to use them quite fluently. And in many other games I have had Scout units use Javelins quite handily. So their mere scoutness can't be the issue.

Are they in tall grass or is there any other kind of intervening terrain that might block their LOS? I once had a very frustrating game where Scouts were advancing in tall grass. As long as they were moving they had LOS towards targets, but as soon as I ordered them to stop and fire their weapons, they would drop to their knees and lose LOS. Infuriating.

Michael

Link to post
Share on other sites

I may be entirely off-base on this but I seem to recall complaints back-in-the-day about Troops using valuable Javelin too frequently on low-priority targets. So the behavior got adjusted so they're more likely to save them for tanks. I do recall Javelin is usage  different in old CMSF than it is in CMBS.  This'll give be an excuse to go back and play a few battles to see what pops up. -_- 

Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, MikeyD said:

I may be entirely off-base on this but I seem to recall complaints back-in-the-day about Troops using valuable Javelin too frequently on low-priority targets. So the behavior got adjusted so they're more likely to save them for tanks. I do recall Javelin is usage  different in old CMSF than it is in CMBS.  

Yes, but that was Javelin teams blowing up infantry teams in the open - which was considered a bad idea in an environment where enemy armour is very likely near by.

 

18 minutes ago, MikeyD said:

This'll give be an excuse to go back and play a few battles to see what pops up. -_- 

Sounds like a plan. :D

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Michael Emrys said:

Are they in tall grass or is there any other kind of intervening terrain that might block their LOS? I once had a very frustrating game where Scouts were advancing in tall grass. As long as they were moving they had LOS towards targets, but as soon as I ordered them to stop and fire their weapons, they would drop to their knees and lose LOS. Infuriating.

Yup! I know this "issue" all too well! But...no, I made sure to put them(stationary) in a tree line that had no vegetation(just low grass/no bushes) rather than in the wheat fields across which the tanks arrive. I even gave them Hunt commands over short distances to see if I could "trigger" them.

Honestly...with so many games under my belt, I'm beginning to think that on rare occasions  there is an unexplained  random glitch in how things happen in game. Maybe somehow a single line of code was skipped...and now in this one instance...my scouts "possess" the javelins...but the game engine doesn't "see" them with it. Kinda like the assistant FO picking up the laser designator example I mentioned above. Only ever happened that one time.

2 hours ago, MikeyD said:

So the behavior got adjusted so they're more likely to save them for tanks.

Yes...don't AT-14 teams do the same?  I notice they will ignore even BRDMs & BTRs to wait for tanks. I had to manually Fire them b/c I knew that the battle had no tanks.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, cbennett88 said:

...I'm beginning to think that on rare occasions  there is an unexplained  random glitch in how things happen in game.

I believe you are right about that. At least, on rare occasions I've come across something that doesn't seem right and I can't think of a reasonable justification for. I usually just shrug it off as the fortunes of war, but sometimes the whole game turns on something like that, which does get up my nose.

Michael

Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Michael Emrys said:

What you are reporting is strange. I recently had a game with lots of Scouts armed with Javelins and they all seemed to use them quite fluently. And in many other games I have had Scout units use Javelins quite handily. So their mere scoutness can't be the issue.

Are they in tall grass or is there any other kind of intervening terrain that might block their LOS? I once had a very frustrating game where Scouts were advancing in tall grass. As long as they were moving they had LOS towards targets, but as soon as I ordered them to stop and fire their weapons, they would drop to their knees and lose LOS. Infuriating.

Michael

Have you tried that trick of giving a PAUSE while they are moving?  Am curious if that enables them to maintain LOS and shoot.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Erwin said:

Have you tried that trick of giving a PAUSE while they are moving?  Am curious if that enables them to maintain LOS and shoot.

think I did (although this was in WEGO), but if I did, it didn't work. The only thing that worked was if another unit at the end of the turn had stopped at a place that it had LOS from at the end of a turn, I then moved my Javelin unit to the same spot.

Michael

Link to post
Share on other sites

That is puzzling since we all had a discussion about LOS being measured from a unit's "eyes".  So, if the unit is upright (ie: it is ordered to PAUSE when in the middle of a movement) it should have as good LOS as when moving.  Or, am I interpreting those findings wrong?

Am also assuming this is true for the WW2 CM titles as well as CMBS.  When I tried this in CMSF (in WEGO), it didn't seem to matter if the unit was paused or not.  Individual soldiers were either lying down or kneeling - but at random.  I couldn't see any pattern or reason for all lying, all kneeling, or some in each stance.  No one was standing.

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Erwin said:

That is puzzling since we all had a discussion about LOS being measured from a unit's "eyes".  So, if the unit is upright (ie: it is ordered to PAUSE when in the middle of a movement) it should have as good LOS as when moving.  Or, am I interpreting those findings wrong?

There may be something you're not understanding. In WEGO, I don't believe there is any way to give a unit a Pause order while it is actually moving. You can give a Pause order at any point along its movement path in the Command Phase as long as it is at a Waypoint. If you know something else, please tell me.

Michael

Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Erwin said:

Ah.  It doesn't work in WEGO.   Didn't get that bit.  (I thought they meant if a unit is moving at the end of a WEGO turn one could then give it a PAUSE so it has an upright stance for the next WEGO minute.)

In that case, I wouldn't give the unit a Pause, but would just cancel any further movement in the next Orders Phase. Just a difference in playing style, I suppose.

Michael

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...