30 mm automatic cannon 2A42 and M929

[Peter Cairns]

Had a look at the Wiki for the Russian 30mm 2A42 used on the BMP2 amongst other and I came across the alternative Belgian Mecar M929 ammo.

I am assuming the game simulates the two Russian AP ammos, 3UBR6 and 3UBR8, but wonder if as it's a future scenario the Mecar ammo might be added particularly for the Ukrainians with Nato backing.  On the basis of the specs it could make quite a difference. Less likely the Russians could get it particularly with an arms embargo, which is just as well if your in a Bradley!!!!

Here are the specs;

3UBR6

Solid shot with blunt penetrator covered by a hollow windshield cap. Tracer burn time 3.5 seconds.

Penetration: 20mm thick plate at 60 degree impact, 700 m range, 14mm thick plate at 60 degree impact, 1500 m range.

3UBR8 

A sub-caliber discarding sabot. No tracer. Penetration: 25mm thick plate at 60 degree impact, 1500 m range.

 

M929

A sub-caliber fin-stabilized discarding sabot round with tracer from Belgian Mecar, with tungsten alloy penetrator.

 

Penetration: 55 mm steel at 1,000 m, 45 mm at 2,000 m range.

 

Peter.

[HUSKER2142]

Peter Cairns . Alas, but it is due to the fact that the 30 mm ammunition has been done on several major wars. There are design and prototypes of 30 mm ammunition, but it will need money for such a massive rearmament. When I launch into serial production "kurganets-25", about new ammunition ponder. Shooting on the turret of a tank T-72 at a distance of 1000 meters,  has to jam.

_{Увы , но это из-за того что 30 мм боеприпасов было сделано на несколько больших войн . Есть разработки и прототипы 30 мм боеприпасов , но это потребуется денег на такое массовое перевооружение . Думаю когда запустят в серийное производство "Курганец-25" , об новых боеприпасах задумаются . Стрельба по башне танка Т-72 на расстоянии 1000 метров , должна её заклинить .}

[Peter Cairns]

HUSKER2142,

Point taken, but only from a Russian perspective given it's financial difficulties and the current political climate. 

Russia would need to make a fair investment to produce a new 30mm round to match the Belgian M929 and it would need to justify that in terms of the current one , which it probably has large stocks of, not doing the job against likely targets, currently Ukrainian national forces or ISIS.

If what I think your are suggesting; that Russia has higher priorities it tough times your probably right.

An M929 would be better against Bradley's but right now Russia doesn't expect to fight them.

Although you could argue that given how ubiquitous  ex-soviet 30mm's are around the  world there would be a ready market for a round with more punch as many armies up armour based on experience in Iraq and Afghanistan and as better way to bring down helicopters and aircraft with fewer hits.

However from a game perspective and a Ukrainian one, given Nato backing and support, getting a more potent ammo from Nato Belgium to use against a Russia opponent with more and better armour might be an available and attractive offer.

Maybe in the next addition to Black Sea we could argue for things like the M929 and other "Light" Nato equipment like, Humvee's drones or even Javelin being made available to Ukrainian forces, all be it at a fairly high points cost.

I wonder what Steve's view is as he usual nows more about both whats on the ground as well as obviously where the game is going.

Peter.

 

 

[John Kettler]

Peter Cairns,

Since you're talking about upgraded auto cannon ammo, I thought you might find this, which addresses Rheinmetall's amazing terminal ballistics advances in 20 mm and larger rounds, to be of real interest. It shows what can be and has been done in terms of performance improvement.

Regards,

John Kettler