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The smoke screen was still forming so the upper floor of that building was not yet blocked by smoke when the screenshot was taken.  Below is a screenshot of the tank that won the bottle of schnapps. 

Now part two: As all that gunfire was going on with the two American half-tracks, two more half-tracks were coming up the road behind them, making four in total. Right when the first firefight wa

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2 hours ago, chuckdyke said:

It was common practice for the commander to dismount with his binoculars to have a look on the crest or on the attic of a nearby house. Something for Game Engine 5? 

You can do that now with the whole crew - Bail Out command. Are you suggesting just the TC dismount alone like a split squad for crew. That would be cool actually. But would the TC go alone on such a mission or would another crew member join them or would it be more common for the whole crew to go?

I am curious about the historical practice.

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Maybe a bit off-topic in a CMFB forums, but this feature would also be relevant in modern titles. It is not uncommon for recon sections to leave one systems operator in the vehicle (so not the driver! this means that the recon equipment, if not detached for dismounted use, can still be used) and have a dismounted patrol of 2/3 man to scout ahead.

This feature, along with the option to dismount recon kit, like the BAA system, would surely be welcomed by me.

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1 hour ago, BarendJanNL said:

...leave one systems operator in the vehicle ...and have a dismounted patrol of 2/3 man to scout ahead.

This feature, along with the option to dismount recon kit

+1  Would be a good option.  Also wish we had more options for splitting squads.  In 7 member (or less) squads, once on splits off a 2-man scout team, one is left with an unwieldy 5-man team.  Wold be nice to split 7(or less) man squads more than once.

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6 hours ago, IanL said:

You can do that now with the whole crew - Bail Out command. Are you suggesting just the TC dismount alone like a split squad for crew. That would be cool actually. But would the TC go alone on such a mission or would another crew member join them or would it be more common for the whole crew to go?

I am curious about the historical practice.

I don't know about WW2 but one of the armor field manuals specifically mentions the TC dismounting to check corners at city intersections. There's a couple of scenarios in CMSF2 where this would be very welcome if you don't happen to have any infantry nearby (for whatever reason).

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20 minutes ago, Sulman said:

I don't know about WW2 but one of the armor field manuals specifically mentions the TC dismounting to check corners at city intersections.

I don't know about city intersections, but advanced recon on foot seems to have been standard practice in WWII based on numerous accounts from both sides.

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In the 80's some of us did it routinely but I can't remember if it was a standard practice. When I was on the M60A3s I kept an extra long hand mic cable (I think it was 50') to connect my CVC to the external radio/intercom on the rear fender while I dismounted to scout things out. I missed that ability when we went to the M1's.

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6 hours ago, IanL said:

You can do that now with the whole crew - Bail Out command. Are you suggesting just the TC dismount alone like a split squad for crew. That would be cool actually. But would the TC go alone on such a mission or would another crew member join them or would it be more common for the whole crew to go?

I am curious about the historical practice.

I have seen a picture of a Russian commander on the crest of a hill inside verbal range of his vehicle. What would be cool too is have a position like hull-down that only a .50 Cal machine gun is visible. Which you can do in RL. Useful also for APC's or halftracks. Almost impossible to plot manually. The list goes on, using an immobilized vehicle for a hide etc. 

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53 minutes ago, Sulman said:

I don't know about WW2 but one of the armor field manuals specifically mentions the TC dismounting to check corners at city intersections. There's a couple of scenarios in CMSF2 where this would be very welcome if you don't happen to have any infantry nearby (for whatever reason).

And in CM infantry and Armor don't share the C2. On Iron I come to the realization not to plot area fire unless having a contact Icon. Sending 5000 .50 Cal rounds in a house at 50 yards distance and still get an infantry squad wiped out was the eyeopener. Once the tanks had the visual it was over in one turn. Testing is usually done with the Icons visible and in Hot Seat area fire is also more effective, against the AI it is definitely a different game.  I use now the Ci2 as the liaison contact. having the Comp HQ and the Armor HQ in proximity also works.  Set it up in your TLP before you start a game.

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8 hours ago, Sgt.Squarehead said:

Have the tank 'Open Up' when close to an infantry HQ.....They do communicate but it can sometimes take a minute or two.

 

Yes, a minute or two is ok, but I had 4 Abrams with their .50 Cal firing at a building for at least 2 minutes with no effect. This afternoon I had the .50 cal of some Strykers breaching a wall, but they had a contact icon on their target. I don't know or this is the case with all levels. I do my testing with games I already played. If you test on the testing level with no fog of war yes you can see the effect. But my theory is no icons means you wasting your ammunition. it may also be the case of LOS issues if you plot the LOS but find the No LOS sign popping it may be there is something, but you can't shoot at it. Thanks for your attention. 

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Pieces of metal do penetrate buildings and walls in CM2 - with varying effectiveness.  AREA FIRE with no target icon can be very effective.  Experience teaches one how the game system and AI handles certain situation.  To a degree one is fighting vs the game system itself.  So, the more one understands it the better one can play.

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16 hours ago, chuckdyke said:

And in CM infantry and Armor don't share the C2. 

As @Sgt.Squarehead said.  Below is some information you might find interesting.

I did some experiments with hatches opened and closed on vehicles from different battalions (So no vertical information sharing) to observe how horizontal information sharing was affected.  The experiment was done in CMFI v2.0 Engine 4.  The following is a summary of the results followed by screenshots:

Maximum horizontal information sharing range is 32 meters (4 Action Spots)

A vehicle must be unbuttoned to horizontally share (report) information from about 9 to 32 meters.

A vehicle can be buttoned & horizontally share (report) information if it is within 8 meters of the other vehicle.

This one surprised me: If two vehicles are 9 to 32 meters apart with one buttoned & the other open the open vehicle will share (report) information to the buttoned vehicle.  However the buttoned vehicle will not share (report) information to the open vehicle.

Infantry may horizontally share (report) information to a buttoned vehicle when within 32 meters.

The post with the screenshots is linked below. 

https://community.battlefront.com/topic/119474-c2-information-sharing/?do=findComment&comment=1719467

 

Edited by MOS:96B2P
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Area fire absolutely does work. Targeting the ground right in front of a building instead of the building wall itself can be just as effective, or even more effective than direct fire -- at least for suppression (wider splash of bullets, I think).  Just recently, I posted a few screenies from a CMBN battle as the British. The whole battle was a series of identifying enemy building locations and wearing them down to the point that my infantry could get into the building to confirm clear, clear, and/or take willing survivors prisoner. To do that, I drained most of the MG ammo from two platoons of Churchills. I was up against a gaggle of low-grade LW troopers (AI random blind pick).

None of them ever retreated from the buildings (newest patch in action), but I was quite surprised to see how many were left when I entered some of them. I've never bagged so many prisoners. Like...50? Sometimes nearly whole squads threw up their hands when my dudes got close. I had no idea they were there until my men were taking the cigarettes out of their pockets.

Allowing them to get close was all about area fire. Also, lots of the buildings (Holland map, just the luck of foliage and building angles) didn't allow for direct targeting of walls, so I got as close as I could with ground targeting as per above. Worked a treat.

Edited by Macisle
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On 1/7/2021 at 12:27 PM, Macisle said:

Area fire absolutely does work. Targeting the ground right in front of a building instead of the building wall itself can be just as effective, or even more effective than direct fire -- at least for suppression (wider splash of bullets, I think).  Just recently, I posted a few screenies from a CMBN battle as the British. The whole battle was a series of identifying enemy building locations and wearing them down to the point that my infantry could get into the building to confirm clear, clear, and/or take willing survivors prisoner. To do that, I drained most of the MG ammo from two platoons of Churchills. I was up against a gaggle of low-grade LW troopers (AI random blind pick).

None of them ever retreated from the buildings (newest patch in action), but I was quite surprised to see how many were left when I entered some of them. I've never bagged so many prisoners. Like...50? Sometimes nearly whole squads threw up their hands when my dudes got close. I had no idea they were there until my men were taking the cigarettes out of their pockets.

Allowing them to get close was all about area fire. Also, lots of the buildings (Holland map, just the luck of foliage and building angles) didn't allow for direct targeting of walls, so I got as close as I could with ground targeting as per above. Worked a treat.

Ever tried a boxing barrage? I did, taking of Aleppo Airfield. The first building 120 Mortars just outside on the back, 155 mms Howitzers just outside the side walls of the complex. Had the Marder's IFV's assaulting the front and the infantry dismounting the moment the barrage lifted. The Syrians inside just surrendered. The it is the algorithm of the game. Block all the exits during a fire fight and once the casualties build up panic sets in and they surrender. It seems consistent, the game only permits exits and entrances in buildings. Block them to make the enemy surrender and your losses remain light. Aleppo airfield was extreem but this strategy in MOUT operations works. POW.jpg 

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