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M8 HMC still missing


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10 hours ago, Michael Emrys said:

Here's an odd thing or two. I checked the Armored Recon Battalion in the QB section of CMFI where it does list the company of light tanks. The strange thing is that is also shows every recon platoon having an M7 Priest. I may be misremembering, but I can't recall the Priest being part of the Cavalry line-up, at least not in 1943. Once again, I can't find the M8 HMC at all.

Michael

Interesting. Probably the US Army experimented with having the priest in recon units but decided it's lack of mobility hindered the them.  

9 hours ago, SLIM said:

The M8 isn't in the QB setup menu, I just spent time purchasing every formation and looking for it.

You can find it in the scenario editor easily enough, but not in the QB menu.

 

On 3/5/2016 at 0:41 PM, MikeyD said:

I may entirely mess up this explanation, but I vaguely recall M8 HMC being missing has something to do with the vehicle's odd location in the TO&E. Its neither fish-nor-foul. Its too much BANG for inclusion in infantry-only QBs and its too deeply embedded in infantry TO&E to show up in armor-only engagements. There's no easy game engine work-around to allow the thing to show up in one sort of QB and not in another, or to show up as an individual vehicle without it first being in the TO&E structure. I believe Steve made a conscious decision to pull the plug on M8 HMC because it was causing force balance issues in infantry QBs. I'm not 100% sure about that explanation but I think its reasonably close.

If this is true, then why not just up the rarity for it? That alone will cause players not to overload on M8 HMCs in a quick battle. I'm not sure why an M8 HMC would ever be included in infantry only engagements to begin with since it's technically a tank. Are M8 Armored Cars available in infantry only QBs?

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And the M8 HMC was definitely part of the Cav TO&E until it was replaced late in the war by the M4 105. Being in the Cav would place it in the Armored Infantry part of the QB menu, so not a threat to infantry only QBs. At this point, it seems to me that BFC's rationale for omitting it is looking weak.

Michael

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On 3/6/2016 at 11:00 AM, Michael Emrys said:

And then before the appearance of the Sherman105, [the M8 HMC] might have shown up in armored formations, although I have no firm data on that.

This is not correct. US Tank Bns used the 75mm Sherman in place of the 105mm Sherman until enough of the later showed up to replace the former.

Info out of the US Archives, courtesy of Rich Anderson from several years ago.

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M21 and M4A1 mortar HTs need a dedicated mortar team with them so placing them among 'individual vehicles' was out of the question. You need to go the long way around, find 'them in the armored infantry battalion TO&E so they'll come in with a mortar crew. Same goes for the German mortar HTs.

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2 hours ago, MikeyD said:

M21 and M4A1 mortar HTs need a dedicated mortar team with them so placing them among 'individual vehicles' was out of the question.

Sorry, I don't see the problem. Tanks come with their own crews just fine in the Individual Vehicles menu, so why shouldn't mortar halftracks? Can you offer further enlightenment?

:unsure:

Michael

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On ‎25‎/‎03‎/‎2016 at 8:27 AM, Michael Emrys said:

Sorry, I don't see the problem. Tanks come with their own crews just fine in the Individual Vehicles menu, so why shouldn't mortar halftracks? Can you offer further enlightenment?

:unsure:

Michael

Crew of the vehicle PLUS crew of the mortar.

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