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It's the overpressure generated from the blast that will kill people in tunnels by imploding their lungs or be crushed under tunnel collapse . and the like - admittedly anyone in the vicinity would be simply vaporised and further afield suffer blunt force trauma, and at best deafened.

http://uk.businessinsider.com/moab-airburst-bomb-explanation-2017-4?r=US&IR=T

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A little humor....😎

I think the Abrams in CMBS is somewhat more godly than in reality. I also think the technical aspects of armored vehicles matters less in real wars than in war games. In an actual war between NATO and

Western tanks were designed to hold the Fulda. They're heavier, bigger and designed with ergonomics in mind. They were to hold out as long as they could, focusing on the anti-vehicle role. Disable as

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Wicky,

A useful explanation provided by a somewhat clueless writer. Why clueless? He'd have us believe nuclear weapons explode an instant before impact in the top part of the piece and that they are often built to explode miles in the air at the bottom. Simply doesn't have a handle on the burst options available and instead completely contradicts himself. What I did find of immediate and compelling interest is the statement that had MOAB been dropped on flat ground, the blast radius would've been a mile wide. An odd way of expressing things, but definitely riveting--and horrifying. It would be too much to hope for, I suppose, despite the Mach stem stuff,  that we had been given some sort of overpressure plot. As it happens, though, nuclear test data are still relevant. This overpressure damage list from the excellent AtomicArchive.com. At 1 psi, windows blow out. 3 psi is when most residential houses collapse and is the threshold for injuries. At 5 psi, most buildings (using construction techniques from the early-mid 1900s) collapse. 10 psi cause reinforced concrete building to buildings to collapse and cause mass fatalities. These are without figuring in winds ranging from 70 mph at 2 psi to 294 mph for 10 psi. You don't want to see anything above that. The CDC, when looking at creating blast protective zones for miners, pulled together nuclear weapon testing data and other material in an effort to get a handle on personnel vulnerability. What it boiled down to was that 10 psi sufficed to cause mass casualties, and that 20 psi was effectively everyone dies. 15 psi is the threshold for blast lung. It is worth noting that AQ's Ayman al Zawahiri survived a direct hit by a JDAM on the house he was in, only to die a few hours later from blast lung. From memory, 1.5 psi will crush aircraft, and 4 will so badly and extensively damage the flight deck of any carrier prior, say, to the Nimitz class, it will absolutely require major rebuild and will not be repairable at sea.

Regards,

John Kettler

 

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On 4/14/2017 at 2:34 AM, John Kettler said:

 

One thing that really annoys me is our MOAB requires a highly permissive air situation in order to be usable from a C-130 series prop driven Hercules, whereas the Tu-160 can carry FOAB into battle while itself fitted with chaff, flares and jammers. Not to mention the speed differential. If you don't read the second link material, it says the area of destruction is the equivalent of nine city blocks.

Regards,

John Kettler

I can assure you that the MC-130 designed for SOF support and dropping these things has a much more elaborate defensive suite than the TU-160, of which the number of operational Blackjacks is in the single digit range. Both would certainly require a permissive environment to operate as non-standoff bombers so this is moot except for the speed issue  (which doesn't matter at the altitude both have to fly at to drop this ordnance anyway).

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4 minutes ago, John Kettler said:

Codename Duchess,

Operating from first principles, in terms of power and weight I don't see how the MC-130J ca beat the Tu-160, but I'm delighted the plane is so well protected when it comes to a defensive suite. Excellent!

Regards,

John Kettler

I never said it could. But comparing the two is apples to oranges. MOAB delivery is a secondary capability of the MC-130 whereas the Blackjack is a dedicated bomber. I'm also fairly certain if there was a need that a B-1/2/52 could be modified to carry them (B-2 can already carry MOP which is bigger by weight but not explosive content). 

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3 hours ago, John Kettler said:

Codename Duchess,

Operating from first principles, in terms of power and weight I don't see how the MC-130J ca beat the Tu-160, but I'm delighted the plane is so well protected when it comes to a defensive suite. Excellent!

Regards,

John Kettler

I don't see how any of Russia's counter terrorism forces hope to last 20 seconds in front of an armored brigade!

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13 hours ago, panzersaurkrautwerfer said:

Ahahaha.

I have watched where 17 million can go in human assistance programs, or payouts for tips, and I will tell you dropping a MOAB on Kabul would do more for the humanitarian crises of that country than 17 million in aid.  

Some hyperbole for humor sake, but there's a time for kinetic tools. The kind of target would be stupidly dangerous to do on foot, with a lot of ways for the ISIS dudes to rabbit once they'd done some damage, conventional bombing likely couldn't have gotten everyone at once.  

I'm not saying we MOAB every cave complex, but assuming we just blasted a cell or two, it was a likely a net savings overall.  

 

Well I am betting every ISIS cadre hiding out in a cave complex that he previously thought was pretty safe is wondering how soon he is gonna see those virgins.   That is as soon as he finishes changes his britches.   Net bonus for your average Afghan if it causes those guys to pull back to a different safe haven - like Pakistan.

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An Afghan official is saying the MOAB killed 94, that there were no civilian deaths and that among the dead were leaders of an ISIS affiliate. I imagine Putin's people are watching all this with keen interest. going back to the blast generated winds, they cause what are called translational injuries. this is fancy language meaning the blast picks up the victim and slams that person into whatever is inn front of the axis of the pressure wave. Such injuries, by their nature, can actually be worse than primary effects. For example, someone in a trench might be protected from direct effects, but the Bernoulli Effect could well suck that person clean out of the trench and fling him or her into any number of things. Anyone doubting this should understand my father worked on a program called Pave Fire III in which the result of the optically directed flak detection was to put either CBUs or a laser guided 3000 pound Fat Albert smack on the director's position. The suction effect of the shattering blast triggered by a fuze extender pulled the deeply dug in S60 57 mm AAGs clean out of their pits and flung them about like toys. Toys weighing around 5000 kgs! Dad saw the strike footage and described the results to us. Fat Albert didn't seem all that bad compared to the CBUs, where he said you could see a line after line of explosions marching to the guns, whose gunners were chained to their weapons. One way to ensure combat stability!

http://www.latimes.com/world/la-fg-afghanistan-moab-20170415-story.html

The Pentagon has released the (very poor quality) MOAB strike video. Believe it's thermal. KABOOM!!!
 

Regards,

John Kettler

Edited by John Kettler
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Virtual tour of the military base "Arctic shamrock" the Franz Josef Land Archipelago.

Виртуальная экскурсия по военной базе «Арктический трилистник»  архипелаг  Земля Франца-Иосифа .

http://mil.ru/files/files/arctic/Arctic.html

 

 

Unmanned aerial vehicle of heavy class "Altair"

Беспилотный летательный аппарат тяжелого класса «Альтаир»

4109687_original.jpg

 

 

 

Edited by HUSKER2142
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For Comrade John Kettler.

Interior of T-14/15.

http://btvt.info/6photos/armata_bmp/armata_bmp01.html

 

http://btvt.info/6photos/armata/armata01.html

 

A sapper shovel is needed to repair CPU =). Where a special department is looking, good times were when soldiers had only phones like Nokia 3110.

Edited by HUSKER2142
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On ‎2017‎-‎04‎-‎14 at 11:03 AM, John Kettler said:

Armorgunner,

If nine city blocks are devastated by a MOAB, burst (why couldn't they have reported it as a radius?), I wonder what the lesser damage figures might be? Would imagine there are lots of deaf ISIS fighters in the area to a great distance, magnified by the funneling effect of declivities and reverberation off rocks everywhere. While obviously not the same as applying an omnidirectional effect, it would, in fact, be much worse on certain axes as a function of the terrain. Have some familiarity myself with echoes in various canyons in the American Southwest, and I shudder to think how horrendous a crack of doom would be in a similar environment.  

Regards,

John Kettler

Yeah, they probably put the big bomb where there was a lot of activity? I am though amazed, how quick they were to go throw all the crushed tunnels. In the middle of ISIS territory, to tell us that 36 of the IS democracy hating jihadists was killed.  

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Interesting suggestion on the subject here:

Quote

But America dropping the MOAB on an Islamic State tunnel network could be a brilliant piece of military theater. If Moscow really is reaching out to the Taliban to help fight Daesh—while making life complicated for NATO forces—the first use of a giant fuel-air bomb is a big showy counterargument.

https://warisboring.com/by-the-way-russia-is-supporting-the-taliban-in-afghanistan-now/

Distinct lack of tangible evidence beyond limited hearsay, but that's nothing new of course.  :mellow:

Edited by Sgt.Squarehead
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2 hours ago, Armorgunner said:

The suplyforce looks evenly mismatched though :D

Also note the new camo uniforms worn by the gunners on the right - designed to be darker so that in time it fades to the ones worn by the gunners on the left.  Another example of Brit pioneering ingenuity recently stolen by the Yanks (re their new camo schemes).   :o

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55 minutes ago, Michael Emrys said:

Those aren't the supply force, but tractors for the guns. The supply force is prudently taking cover behind that hill in the background.

Michael

Yeah, i understand that now :D. I just cant belive that i was so stupid from the beginning, to think that a few horses and elephants to be the supplyforce :lol:

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HUSKER2142,

Pretty cool video. Imagine that's at Alabino and isn't for Victory Day, but the May Day Parade on May 1st. Believe Putin's intent on sending a strong message regarding Russia's willingness to defend her interests in the Arctic.

Michael Emrys,

You are somewhat indirectly describing Parkinson's Law.

Artkin,

Those huge SPHs are the new Koalitsya-SV.

Regards,

John Kettler

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