Questions about command chain...

[MisterMark]

I get that in order for subordinate units to perform at their best they need to be in some form of communication with their commanders.... But I'm a little unclear how things work under the following situations (assuming all units are in communication):

-Say the commander of a battalion or company HQ gets killed but the rest of the HQ are fine. Does that mean every man in every subordinate HQ and subordinate platoon take some kind of moral/performance hit? Or does moral/performance stay intact for all the subordinate men as long as there is *some* member of the senior HQ still alive?

-At the platoon level, does the platoon take a performance/moral hit if the 'leader' of the platoon gets killed even though all commanders of superior HQ's are alive and well?

Also, regarding command bonuses... Do those bonuses only apply to the particular HQ or do they have some kind influence all the way down to each man of each platoon?

With CMx1 chain of command and command bonuses seemed pretty straight forward and easy to understand... There just seems to be a lot of ambiguity, confusion and lack of information with how it all works with CMx2.

Any definitive thoughts on the matter are welcomed.

Thank you,

Mark

[womble]

-Say the commander of a battalion or company HQ gets killed but the rest of the HQ are fine. Does that mean every man in every subordinate HQ and subordinate platoon take some kind of moral/performance hit? Or does moral/performance stay intact for all the subordinate men as long as there is *some* member of the senior HQ still alive?

The important guy is the one in charge. Usually labelled "Commander", or maybe "Leader", I'm not sure how consistent it is (or what rules are consistently applied to the naming). If he cops it, the HQ unit becomes irrelevant apart from:

- if there's an "Executive Officer" in it (depends on command tier and specific formation TOs), they'll take over command in a (usually short) while.

- if the radio remains intact, it might be able to share it with an XO that's got his own element. <== anyone got any firm info either way?

-At the platoon level, does the platoon take a performance/moral hit if the 'leader' of the platoon gets killed even though all commanders of superior HQ's are alive and well?

Yep. Unless a higher echelon HQ is within range (sight and/or hearing - doesn't work at distant sight or over radio) and can take over.

[A Canadian Cat]

-Say the commander of a battalion or company HQ gets killed but the rest of the HQ are fine. Does that mean every man in every subordinate HQ and subordinate platoon take some kind of moral/performance hit? Or does moral/performance stay intact for all the subordinate men as long as there is *some* member of the senior HQ still alive?

I think @womble gave you good answers I'll just clarify one thing. Some HQ units have a commander and an executive officer in the same unit (typical of Platoons but not all) and some have two separate units one the HQ and one the 2IC or XO or HQ support (typical of Battalion and Company but again not all) depending on the organization.

In the case of the CO and XO are in the same unit if the CO is hit the XO will take over in short while. Assuming any radio operator is still OK not much will change in terms of C2 but the unit's leadership factor will change - because a new guy is in charge. You can see the name and leadership value will change in the UI.

In the case of the CO and XO being separate units if the CO is hit the XO will take over at some point. Now the Company, Battalion etc. is commanded by a new guy and his leadership ability will apply. The XO in this case could have additional communications challenges because that unit often does not have a radio organic to the unit. The issue @womble alluded to is that it is not clear if an intact radio operator from the HQ unit will offer his services to the XO to maintain the Comms for him. I believe he will but have not tested to verify that. I base that belief on experience with mortars and radios (if a radio equipped unit is nearby the mortar will be available to FOs for calling indirect fire) and Tank HQ crews that have lost their tank (who if they get into a radio equipped vehicle their tanks come under their command again).

[Erwin]

Does the Company or higher HQ being alive or having C2 to sub units actually have any leadership/morale etc effect on those sub units? Or, does a Co HQ exits purely for aesthetic reasons.

[A Canadian Cat]

I have no idea. After reading your question I was thinking about how to test it and so far I have come up blank. There are so many other variables in the game it think it would be difficult to see what effect the company HQ's might have on the members of a fire team from 3 squad of 2 platoon conducting an assault.

[womble]

Does the Company or higher HQ being alive or having C2 to sub units actually have any leadership/morale etc effect on those sub units? Or, does a Co HQ exits purely for aesthetic reasons.

I've always assumed they do, but it was asserted by, I think, and apologies if I'm incorrectly attributing something, Vanir Ausf B who is (also, I think) part of the beta team, and might have some insider knowledge, that they do not.

Like Ian, I can see no good way of testing this... Maybe run a "shoot a squad til they break" test a hundred times with them having an intact +2 leadership all the way up the C2 chain (make sure the C2 elements aren't going to get shot at), then do it again with just the platoon HQ involved. I think you'd need to have the Coy and Bttn HQs on-map in both cases otherwise you get the "automatic" connection to the top echelon thing getting in the way. So it's probably easiest to test with Platoons that don't have radios, so the PltHQ can be in voice-and-sight C2 with the Company Actual for the first test, and then just move the position of the CoyHQ for the second condition. Whether the incoming is consistent enough for that setup to give any indication is difficult to ascertain.

[Vanir Ausf B]

I do think that the command moral boost only applies to units under that HQs direct command. So a company HQ would affect the moral recovery of the platoon HQ units under his command but that would not percolate down to the squads except indirectly in that a routed platoon HQ isn't going to be in C2 with his squads. I have a vague recollection of someone testing this shortly after CMBN came out but it's been long enough I don't remember for sure.

[postfux123]

I think to remember that C2 is also connected to (BORG) spotting. Is this also affected by leader loss or has the radioman some use in that regard?

[Vanir Ausf B]

? There is no borg spotting in CMx2. Unless you play on the lowest difficulty. I think it's called "basic training".

[postfux123]

I for some reason always thought that spotted enemies get handed through C2 so another friendly unit who could see them but has not spotted them already gets a contact. May be completly wrong.

[A Canadian Cat]

I for some reason always thought that spotted enemies get handed through C2 so another friendly unit who could see them but has not spotted them already gets a contact. May be completly wrong.

The information about enemy locations is transmitted through the C2 chain. But no one that cannot personally see the enemy gets full contacts. So *no* borg spotting (with the exception of Basic Training mode). However it is an advantage because if a unit has ? contacts because of the C2 chain and moves to a location where they do have LOS then the will spot the enemy quicker - presumably because they are looking in the right location.

[A Canadian Cat]

I do think that the command moral boost only applies to units under that HQs direct command. So a company HQ would affect the moral recovery of the platoon HQ units under his command but that would not percolate down to the squads except indirectly in that a routed platoon HQ isn't going to be in C2 with his squads. I have a vague recollection of someone testing this shortly after CMBN came out but it's been long enough I don't remember for sure.

Sure, seems reasonable however the Company HQ can offer command support to platoons which have lost their HQ and even to squads that are separated from their HQs. However I'm not contradicting you really, just saying that the influence could also apply to units that are "in command" under the Company HQ's not just to those connected on the org chart.

[postfux123]

So *no* borg spotting (with the exception of Basic Training mode).

Found it in the manual (p. 98). Its called "relative spotting".

[YankeeDog]

The information about enemy locations is transmitted through the C2 chain. But no one that cannot personally see the enemy gets full contacts. So *no* borg spotting (with the exception of Basic Training mode). However it is an advantage because if a unit has ? contacts because of the C2 chain and moves to a location where they do have LOS then the will spot the enemy quicker - presumably because they are looking in the right location.

Yep. Units will also react to the presence of enemy units whose location they learn about via the C2 chain, but have not actually spotted yet. For example, tanks will rotate their turrets to face a known, but as yet unspotted threat. This can be a huge advantage in certain situations.