ETA on version 3.0?

[Placebo]

Can't wait for this, i need all those great extras I see in RT.

Any news on how air support will work, will it change in line with RT? I hope it does as it seems easier and more realistic than the spotter method.

[Macisle]

Can't wait for this, i need all those great extras I see in RT...

Same here!

[MOS:96B2P]

Can't wait for this, i need all those great extras I see in RT.

Any news on how air support will work, will it change in line with RT? I hope it does as it seems easier and more realistic than the spotter method.

I agree. I am also curious to see if tank riding is brought over from RT.

[Placebo]

I agree. I am also curious to see if tank riding is brought over from RT.

I do not think i would use it much as the maps tend to be smaller but would be good to have the option. I am guessing all the german armour is already there so the additional work would be updating the Allied Armour.

[Holman]

Can't wait for this, i need all those great extras I see in RT.

Any news on how air support will work, will it change in line with RT? I hope it does as it seems easier and more realistic than the spotter method.

BTS hasn't announced anything, I believe.

One issue is that the allies were getting pretty good at communication between ground units and air support, something the Russians and Germans never did as well.

I think the most realistic solution would be to allow allied (only) spotters to call air support (keeping the status quo possibility of misidentified targets) but to limit them to one mission at a time. Air support takes longer than artillery, and the spotter would be realistically occupied with communicating and bringing in the strike.

[womble]

I think it wouldn't be unrealistic to also have the Allies capable of having air support that can't be controlled by an FO, but is "opportunistic" in the same way as all RT air is.

[Broadsword56]

I think it wouldn't be unrealistic to also have the Allies capable of having air support that can't be controlled by an FO, but is "opportunistic" in the same way as all RT air is.

That's very realistic -- In Market Garden, for example, the Allied air support roamed the corridor and hunted for ground targets on its own. Near Son Bridge, for example, the 101st Abn benefited from the timely arrival of aircraft who spotted and destroyed some German tanks. The FOs on the ground didn't call this in on spotted targets -- the aircraft were roaming around the LZs to clear out any threats they saw , especially AT guns and armor.

I wanted to replicate this in a HTH Son scenario I made and played using CMBN Market-Garden last fall. I gave the 101st an air asset as a reinforcement, with an arrival so randomized that it might or might not show up at some point in the battle. During the fight, some German Mark IIIs were making life miserable for the paratroops. They could loiter with impunity in the open around Hell's Highway and the periphery of Son town, peppering the infantry from standoff range as the troopers tried to make their way to the bridge. Then, late in the battle, the Allied aircraft appeared. IRL the planes would have been looking for German tanks and been able to quickly deal with any armor out in the open. But, due to the way the game worked at the time, I had to have an FO with eyes on the tanks and able to call in targets to the planes. My FO team was already dead. So the planes were useless. It just would have been much better and more realistic if the planes had been able to hunt on their own (for better or worse, since there's no guarantee they would have spotted the armor or managed to kill it if they did). If I'd protected the FO as I should have, then he wouldn't have been in a position to spot for the planes.

One point when the Allies really did use imbedded tactical air controllers a lot, and quite effectively, was in the late summer '44 Cobra breakout and dash across France. I've read that the ground attack planes flew cover right along with the advancing ground columns and were in close communication with them.

But in Market-Garden, IIRC, it was only at battalion HQ and above that the Americans had the right radios and personnel to communicate with the Air Corps. So that's above the scope of many CM scale battles, and even the battalion HQ might not necessarily have be located close enough to the action to have the real-time intel to call in tac air strikes in response to fast-changing circumstances up front. The v2 game is giving players way too much pinpoint power and instant control of this aspect, IMHO.

I'd like it if the upgraded CMBN gave the player setting up a scenario or battle the option of whether to allow user-controlled air support or air support that's not subject to user control once the battle starts. But if it has to be one or the other, I'd vote for no user control.

[Placebo]

That's very realistic , due to the way the game worked at the time, I had to have an FO with eyes on the tanks and able to call in targets to the planes. My FO team was already dead. So the planes were useless. It just would have been much better and more realistic if the planes had been able to hunt on their own (for better or worse, since there's no guarantee they would have spotted the armor or managed to kill it if they did).

Agree totally - air support 'feels' much more realistic in RT, no need to get eyes on target with a FO, and the random nature of there arrival instead of 10+mins wait when you have a observer setup ready to call them in.

[Jack Ration]

Somewhere on the forum Battlefront put together an interesting article about air support and their view about how it applies in game. If memory serves me right, basically that it doesn't, but they have it in the game!

At CM time scale impromptu/on demand air strikes are theoretically possible at the larger scenario time frames. In Normandy the response rate was around one to two hours. Which was pretty good considering how new Ground-Air cooperation was at this stage.

Targeting was another issue, with some allied veterans saying they were just as scared of allied aircraft as the Germans must have been! Certainly not knocking the allied airmen, this was a relatively new mission in the complex argument on how to effectively apply air power to the entire war effort - always a prickly subject between air and army boffins at this time.

Remembering we are talking about air/ground cooperation within the restricted timeframe of a CM scenario, there is little scope for impromptu requests for air support unless you are willing to call a mission in one to two hours in advance!

Of course, preplanned attacks on formations/fortification is a separate issue.

[LongLeftFlank]

As a hack, I replicated aerial (heliborne) observers in CMSF by sticking them atop a doorless walled off 8 story building in a corner of the map. If they came under suppressive ground small arms fire, well then so be it... helos and C-5s are vulnerable platforms. If enemy ordnance is a threat, schedule a reinforcement spotter to appear to replace the original.

[Haggard Sketchy]

Amen to Broadsword's post. I've been playing the Nijmegen campaign. It takes a long time to use up air support, and all the while you can't move anywhere near the strike circles, which means doing nothing for like half the allotted time and then rushing at the last minutes.

[Placebo]

Any news on 3.0 release date ????