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Operational wargame?


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Unity of Command or Command Ops may be what your seeking.

Also look at HPS. The have some decent operational level games.

Command Ops does not have a discrete "break" in gameflow to facilitate CMRT scenarios, nor does it have a East Front title. As far as I know at least.

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There used to be a series put out by a company called Atomic Games called "V for Victory" and "World at War"

If I recall, they were battalion level games. They also had a really nice WeGo system and great balance between complexity and playability.

The games can be found at abondonware sites these days, but it might be tough getting them to run on a modern Operating System.

Somebody needs to put together a small team to make a very similar game (sound of crickets chirping from Battlefront's direction). They were really fun.

It seems like most of the hex-based games these days suffer from horrible user interface, bad graphics, and extreme complexity. There's a few publishers out there who are still trying to sell this same old garbage at outrageous prices too.

Unity of Command is pretty good in fixing most of that, but it is just a little too simplistic.

I guess I'm just an unhappy wargamer... but isn't that our natural state?

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kuri,

Thanks for that post. I'd long had hopes for Matrix' Combined Arms over the decade plus of its development, but Command Ops may be the way to go. What kept me away from the game was the lack of eastern front representation. This appears to fix that. I think I'm going to buy this one, thanks to you.

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Hi,

Lots of ways to do this... one very simple way is to use Panzer Campaigns Minsk, as suggested above.

Don’t wish to suggest others do not have their own ways to use the series but one very quick easy way... in outline... the editor is fantastically flexible..

1) Umpire cuts say 40km by 40km map section and sets up German and Soviet units.

2) Three versions are produced and saved by the umpire. One Master copy with all units from both sides. The Umpire’s copy. Then one to send to the German players with all German units but only some Soviet units on the map as per Fog Of War rules being used. One likewise to the Soviet players.

3) German and Soviet players send back their orders for each unit to the umpire. Umpire moves units as per orders sent to him and decides where there are clashes between units.

4) He then produces three versions again. One Master copy for himself with all units on it after implementing the orders of both sides. One German version with all German units on it but only some Soviet given the FOW rules used. Likewise for the Soviets.

5) Then some clashes are resolved at the CM level with games built by umpire or someone else, results sent back to the umpire and some clashes the umpire resolves at the operational level and informs the players of the results.

6) Umpire produces three versions of the map again taking into account the results of all clashes that turn. One the Master copy with both sides units on he keeps, one German version with all German units and some Soviet according to FOW rules. Same for Soviet side.

Off you go again...

You guys will know how to do this... I realise that but some reading this thread may think it’s difficult... it’s not... but... you need an umpire or umpires with the time and commitment to do the book keeping and produce the games.

Hints...

1) Umpire has final say on all matters no matter the rules..

2) Have library, stock of CMRT maps, scenarios without units, AI stripped out to remember ;).. from which the umpires can quickly grab one and edit it for any given CM clash they are building for the players. Carve up and edit portions of the Master maps and other maps from CMRT, then edit them for battle maps. Saves huge amount of time....

If people have the time.. easily done.... :).

All very good fun,

Good luck... :) keep us informed if you give an operational game of any type a go..

All the best,

Kip.

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There used to be a series put out by a company called Atomic Games called "V for Victory" and "World at War"

If I recall, they were battalion level games. They also had a really nice WeGo system and great balance between complexity and playability.

I got their Operation Crusader game and played it with high hopes, but in the end was sadly disappointed with it. It had a lot of good ideas about how to handle logistics and airpower, but hadn't been worked through sufficiently. The movement system was awkward and tedious and if you let the game do your pathfinding for you, you'd find yourself screwed coming and going. The AI was wretched. There was no free set-up option. I could go on, but the point is the game needed at least another year of serious work to get right. It was sadly underdeveloped. And that was too bad as it could have been a thing of great beauty.

:(

Michael

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Why bother with a sim to feed your sim? A simple map exercise with CM adjudicating contacts should get after what you want. Unless you are wanting to portray all of the logistics issues that might pop up after extended play.

In my experience its way to easy to bake a giant cake and then realize about halfway through it that you and your mates just don't have an appetite for it.

Best to start small, say a division (actually, division is still considered the tactical level) attacking across a front defended by a brigade, with players down to the BN level. Twenty players or so, including your bde and div commanders. Or you could just go with three (two opponents and a referee). A referee would be essential to keep up with unit movement, contacts, fire support etc.

None of which gets after the real challenge - who is going to design all of those scenarios?

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  • 1 month later...

Very interesting......didn't realize there was a break in the flow of the RT operational aspect to the game. Will check this one out. I own them all :)

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As already mentioned by others in this thread, you might want to check out John Tiller's Campaigns, specifically his Panzer Campaigns in the East. I have practically all of them and they are superb for operational level of play.

Some people may not be aware of these... For enhancing Panzer Campaigns graphically there are these awesome mods:

MapMod for Panzer Campaigns

http://mapmod.hist-sdc.com/legend.htm

and

Available mods range from artwork enhancements, expansion packs and alternate scenarios

http://volcanomods.com/index.php?option=com_docman&task=cat_view&gid=13&Itemid=27

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Hi,

I kinda miss CMMC.

I see there are some old hands here ;).

Yup.. CMMC as masterly run by James Bailey is the finest wargame I have come across.. truly :).

My method for use of Panzer Campaigns is indeed just a scaled down, dumped down versions of the great CMMC... !

All the best,

Kip.

PS. CMMC was so fantastic I think it has somewhat intimidated some...

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