Lost Cats (MG) - MAJOR SPOILERS

[rocketman]

I've played this scenario as Allies vs. AI and has seen some silly cases of über tank crews, or should I say crews with a death wish as well. If you have played the scenario read on, otherwise quit RIGHT now.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

As you know the rail line is highly contested in this scenario and the AI approach it with a lot of tanks. Most of the tanks got knocked out, with crews bailing and making a run for it - which makes sense. They had a tank knocked out from under them, killing some of the crew and they know there are a lot of enemies on the other side of the rail ridge. And still, several turns later a lot of them charge back right to the ridge, with their puny pistols picking a fight. Needless to say they get slaughtered. What makes the AI do this? Is it simply because the crew isn't panicked? I would gladly see all crews that bail in the game simply run away, out of control of the player and the AI. Rather that this death wish über pistol toting crews thing.

[ASL Veteran]

AI crews are still associated with the AI plan and all crews will go where the tanks would go if the crews were still inside the tanks. At present, the AI crews are not separated from the AI plan so that's what you are seeing. The crews just keep following the AI plan to conclusion.

[rocketman]

Would it be possible to automatically set all bailed crews as panicked/broken? Then, hopefully, they will stay out of harms way and not engage the enemy the way they do now.

[ASL Veteran]

Would it be possible to automatically set all bailed crews as panicked/broken? Then, hopefully, they will stay out of harms way and not engage the enemy the way they do now.

All units eventually follow the AI plan to completion. That includes broken units. Panicked units will continue to follow the AI plan as soon as they are no longer panicked. There is currently no way around it because the AI plan groups are permanently assigned to units in the editor when the scenario is made.

[Paper Tiger]

There is currently no way around it because the AI plan groups are permanently assigned to units in the editor when the scenario is made.

Well, we could have them fall into a null AI group so that they don't continue to follow the AI group's orders. This is what happens to AT guns in the game. You can place them in AI groups, have them set up in different locations from plan to plan but not follow any orders that the group is given after the mission begins. Of course, the ammo bearers will follow the plan but the gun and its immediate crew will stay in place.

[umlaut]

In general, I think this is a wonderful scenario. But I had one problem with it:

The german platoon of Panthers "beaming in".

When they arrived, I had dealt with all the other german armor - and my platoon of Cromwells were busy trying to flush out the remaining infantry from the farm objective - with the help of one of the AA tanks.

And then - all of a sudden - a platoon of Panthers materializes in their midst! Needless to say the result was a very, very (much too) entertaining turn. Luckily, I still had my Hellcats in overwatch, so in the end the Panthers were all knocked out.

But it wasn´t a very realistic situation. In my view a designer should design the map in a way that ensures that this kind of reinforcements arrives away from the main fighting area - and preferably out of LOS.

But again: I really enjoyed the scenario nevertheless.

[ASL Veteran]

Well, we could have them fall into a null AI group so that they don't continue to follow the AI group's orders. This is what happens to AT guns in the game. You can place them in AI groups, have them set up in different locations from plan to plan but not follow any orders that the group is given after the mission begins. Of course, the ammo bearers will follow the plan but the gun and its immediate crew will stay in place.

My mistake. Immobile units do not follow the AI plan to completion - that's true. There are no 'null' AI groups. If an AI group hasn't been assigned then the default is group A1. I'm not exactly sure what happens with AT gun crews, but they function differently than tank crews because guns are considered heavy weapons. If the gun is considered immobile, then my guess would be that a bailed gun crew is also considered to be immobile by the game for AI purposes.

However, there is no way to get around the fact that tank crews will continue to follow the AI plan without one of the programmers making some sort of an adjustment to the game code as currently written.

[Jaws]

In general, I think this is a wonderful scenario. But I had one problem with it:

The german platoon of Panthers "beaming in".

When they arrived, I had dealt with all the other german armor - and my platoon of Cromwells were busy trying to flush out the remaining infantry from the farm objective - with the help of one of the AA tanks.

And then - all of a sudden - a platoon of Panthers materializes in their midst! Needless to say the result was a very, very (much too) entertaining turn. Luckily, I still had my Hellcats in overwatch, so in the end the Panthers were all knocked out.

But it wasn´t a very realistic situation. In my view a designer should design the map in a way that ensures that this kind of reinforcements arrives away from the main fighting area - and preferably out of LOS.

But again: I really enjoyed the scenario nevertheless.

Thanks for remarks.

I had never thought you would get that fast on the other side of the railroad when I created the scenario. Also other testers didn’t bump into that problem. Normally I always bring reinforcements out line of side or on the map edge.

Will keep this in mind anyways

[slysniper]

In general, I think this is a wonderful scenario. But I had one problem with it:

The german platoon of Panthers "beaming in".

When they arrived, I had dealt with all the other german armor - and my platoon of Cromwells were busy trying to flush out the remaining infantry from the farm objective - with the help of one of the AA tanks.

And then - all of a sudden - a platoon of Panthers materializes in their midst! Needless to say the result was a very, very (much too) entertaining turn. Luckily, I still had my Hellcats in overwatch, so in the end the Panthers were all knocked out.

But it wasn´t a very realistic situation. In my view a designer should design the map in a way that ensures that this kind of reinforcements arrives away from the main fighting area - and preferably out of LOS.

But again: I really enjoyed the scenario nevertheless.

Really, you are some type of player. That is a amazing feat. (well if you are playing through for the first time on a challenging level anyway.

I sure had no chance of having my forces that far forward on the objectives playing it. I felt the AI was placing enough pressure and had enough troops that being over aggressive was a bad way to get bad results.

It is also one of them scenario's you really cannot play more than once because it is easy to see how the AI reinforcenents come and approx when and where. So it would be way to easy to take advantage of that after one playing. But the timing of the AI reinforcements was pretty good in my opinion.

But as mentioned, Bringing them on map where no enemy unit would ever likely be present is always a good design decision.

But really after 10 years of playing these game I recall only once having my unit sitting right on the spot the enemy reinforcements came on at. And no, it is not a good thing to have happen in a battle. Beaming units on the map like we are in star trek is not a good feeling as to realism. But you are playing a game and it is just a fact that it is a possibility.