Yippeeeeeeeee

[ZPB II]

everything is correct, BF clearly define what will be in the module, and we have defined our expectations tiny (really tiny) - it is very simple, there are no significant improvements, it will not be our money - it works both ways.

and if someone does not have any expectations, you will be happy with what you get, it's simple.

They haven't even released a feature list. Yet you act like a child and flame.

Insinuating that BFC is ripping people off by selling a bridge for 35 dollars and not including a 0,000007% rarity weapons system will just get you laughed at.

Also, I wonder why someone always defends the troll brigade. Always the same pattern, someone pops up, trolls and flames, gets what he ordered and then someone chimes in and says we are all a bunch of blind BFC fanboys who try to silence criticism. I challenge anyone to provide a link to a thread where actual mature criticism gets shot down by flaming fanboys.

Being well-mannered and polite is one thing. That doesn't mean you have to swallow everything. That's called being a pussy.

[togi]

Yes. It's not exactly neurosurgery or rocket science. When the BN demo came out I had some problems with screwy behavior around bridges. But I quickly figured it out (probably with some help from other posters) and haven't had a problem since.

Michael

I have been playing since first game out - from CMBO, I'm sure that I'm better than you all the way in this game, but the paths near the bridges are always problematic , I'm sure on that.

See as below in the video from the scenario - called Avanti - from CMFI v1.10

I'm trying to click the other side of the bridges , sometime failed , sometimes creating path under the bridge. it's free to try and you can see that, Mr. Scientist

http://youtu.be/7lv4CcgfQv8

regards

[ZPB II]

There has always been a free patch associated with a new module. Every single freaking time.

Some people conveniently sidestep this fact.

Also, consider that BFC provides patches for a looong time after a game's release. Look at the patch history for Shock Force. Typical developers drop support for a game a few months after release and that's that.

[Guest]

We've delivered performance and shadow improvements in the last few releases, for you folks who say you're having problems, and most of the feedback from those was extremely positive. Maybe you have driver issues; that's a common cause for idiosyncratic performance or display problems. Especially with AMD/ATI cards... their drivers ping-pong between incredibly buggy and somewhat fixed. (We actually had to create separate shaders for ATI cards with buggy drivers, because they literally *could not compile* common GLSL instructions. Figure that one out.)

As for bridges and flamethrowers... I'll ask Steve to come comment on this. I'm just a programmer, who does indeed work very hard to try and exceed your expectations.

[waclaw]

funny, just a little more require the upcoming module, and already is offended - it's a patriotic duty? even if I wrote that I want the game physics, great graphics, uber shader dx11 etc, but I want a tiny fixes / improvements - you do not want?

[togi]

We've delivered performance and shadow improvements in the last few releases, for you folks who say you're having problems, and most of the feedback from those was extremely positive. Maybe you have driver issues; that's a common cause for idiosyncratic performance or display problems. Especially with AMD/ATI cards... their drivers ping-pong between incredibly buggy and somewhat fixed. (We actually had to create separate shaders for ATI cards with buggy drivers, because they literally *could not compile* common GLSL instructions. Figure that one out.)

As for bridges and flamethrowers... I'll ask Steve to come comment on this. I'm just a programmer, who does indeed work very hard to try and exceed your expectations.

I have latest ATI drivers catalyst 13.4

I have zero problem at other games

regards

[Vanir Ausf B]

Are those "other games" running in DirectX or OpenGL?

[Oddball_E8]

funny, just a little more require the upcoming module, and already is offended - it's a patriotic duty? even if I wrote that I want the game physics, great graphics, uber shader dx11 etc, but I want a tiny fixes / improvements - you do not want?

People (me included) are mostly annoyed because of two things:

1: you come off as verry combattive and aggressive in your statements.

2: you consistantly fail to realize that the things you ask for are things that are included in PATCHES and not MODULES.

The difference is that a MODULE is basically a DLC or an Expansion.

In most games that means they include new areas, new enemies, new weapons and new content in general, but not much in the way of bug fixes and gameplay changes.

Patches are where gameplay is changed and where bugs are fixed.

[togi]

Are those "other games" running in DirectX or OpenGL?

Good question, CM series are only games that I had running in OpenGL

regards

[togi]

People (me included) are mostly annoyed because of two things:

1: you come off as verry combattive and aggressive in your statements.

2: you consistantly fail to realize that the things you ask for are things that are included in PATCHES and not MODULES.

The difference is that a MODULE is basically a DLC or an Expansion.

In most games that means they include new areas, new enemies, new weapons and new content in general, but not much in the way of bug fixes and gameplay changes.

Patches are where gameplay is changed and where bugs are fixed.

So where is the fix before introducing bigger bridges my friend?

I can't pass the small bridge as it can be seen at above post attached video

:-)

[Oddball_E8]

So where is the fix before introducing bigger bridges my friend?

I can't pass the small bridge as it can be seen at above post attached video

:-)

Well i couldnt tell you, because i don't know all the details of the module (much like most here). But i will give them the benefit of the doubt since this module will revolve alot around bridges, so im sure they are doing their best to fix that problem in time for the module (but it will not be part of the module, it will be in a patch in that case, so that everyone can benefit from it)

[Battlefront.com]

I've been managing these Forums since before Battlefront existed (back when it was Big Time Software). There's many, many patterns of behavior that are repeated over and over again. My "favorite" is this one:

Person A behaves like a royal arse. Deliberately abusive, disrespectful of others, not the least bit interested in rational discourse, and very often (almost always, in fact) factually incorrect.

Person B challenges Person A on tone and substance.

Person C comes out of nowhere to say "typical. Try to criticize Battlefront or CM and you get slammed for telling the truth or having an opinion".

Then you get the pile on effect of people either defending the original abusive poster as a martyr of truth, and the many more pointing out that the person is getting exactly what he deserves. And all the while we keep working on making Combat Mission and Battlefront better. Because that's what we have always done and will always do.

Rinse and repeat

All of us want CM to be better. Nobody wants it to be stagnant. The list of things which have been changed/improved over the years, many due to direct involvement with customers, is massive. Our track record, therefore, is clearly established fact. Anybody disagreeing with that has discredited himself as being out of touch with reality. Being rude about it, on top, is just more indication that the person's opinions have no relevance or value.

Psychologists could write some pretty thick multi-book works about some of the things that go on here

Steve

[togi]

I've been managing these Forums since before Battlefront existed (back when it was Big Time Software). There's many, many patterns of behavior that are repeated over and over again. My "favorite" is this one:

Person A behaves like a royal arse. Deliberately abusive, disrespectful of others, not the least bit interested in rational discourse, and very often (almost always, in fact) factually incorrect.

Person B challenges Person A on tone and substance.

Person C comes out of nowhere to say "typical. Try to criticize Battlefront or CM and you get slammed for telling the truth or having an opinion".

Then you get the pile on effect of people either defending the original abusive poster as a martyr of truth, and the many more pointing out that the person is getting exactly what he deserves. And all the while we keep working on making Combat Mission and Battlefront better. Because that's what we have always done and will always do.

Rinse and repeat

All of us want CM to be better. Nobody wants it to be stagnant. The list of things which have been changed/improved over the years, many due to direct involvement with customers, is massive. Our track record, therefore, is clearly established fact. Anybody disagreeing with that has discredited himself as being out of touch with reality. Being rude about it, on top, is just more indication that the person's opinions have no relevance or value.

Psychologists could write some pretty thick multi-book works about some of the things that go on here

Steve

yes a good way divert the topic :-)

Steve, can you explain why can't I draw a path other side of the bridge?

can you check the video uploaded above post?

how can I pass famous Holland bridges while I can't pass even a fictive village bridge?

Thanks

[Seedorf81]

I've been managing these Forums since before Battlefront existed (back when it was Big Time Software). There's many, many patterns of behavior that are repeated over and over again. My "favorite" is this one:

Person A behaves like a royal arse. Deliberately abusive, disrespectful of others, not the least bit interested in rational discourse, and very often (almost always, in fact) factually incorrect.

Person B challenges Person A on tone and substance.

Person C comes out of nowhere to say "typical. Try to criticize Battlefront or CM and you get slammed for telling the truth or having an opinion".

Then you get the pile on effect of people either defending the original abusive poster as a martyr of truth, and the many more pointing out that the person is getting exactly what he deserves. And all the while we keep working on making Combat Mission and Battlefront better. Because that's what we have always done and will always do.

Rinse and repeat

All of us want CM to be better. Nobody wants it to be stagnant. The list of things which have been changed/improved over the years, many due to direct involvement with customers, is massive. Our track record, therefore, is clearly established fact. Anybody disagreeing with that has discredited himself as being out of touch with reality. Being rude about it, on top, is just more indication that the person's opinions have no relevance or value.

Psychologists could write some pretty thick multi-book works about some of the things that go on here

Steve

It seems to me that BF fights an unwinnable battle.

The more, faster and better they produce, the higher the expectations for the next game/module/patch. And what follows are ever more demanding demands.

When I'm perfectly honest, I have to admit that BF is nearly always prepared to listen to their customers. And if they cannot deliver what is asked of them, they will explain why in most of the times.

In my fifty-plus years I cannot recall any commercial company that has such an open and direct communication channel for/with it's clients.

Maybe we should think about that just a little more often.

(BTW: come on with that schwimmwagen, da#n it!)

[Battlefront.com]

A reminder of how things work regarding features:

Significant new features are NOT put into Modules as a rule. They are reserved for Base Games (1st release of a Family) and Upgrades (which update older Families to current standards). There are exceptions, of course.

The reason for this is every person playing within a Family must be using the same version. So if something is introduced into a Module that means everybody gets it. Not only within a specific Family, but often across all Families. In other words... nobody is explicitly paying us for those improvements.

Despite that we *always* include new features, for free, with Modules and Patches. So you will see some rolled out with the Market Garden Module first, then everybody else soon after. Which is why the few people who continue to gripe about us charging people for minor feature improvements are flat out wrong.

Major feature improvements cost us significant resources (time and money) to develop. Call us selfish, but we do expect to be paid for such work. And that's why we don't release them for free, as happens to things which first appear in Modules.

Bug fixes are, of course, free for everybody all the time. Though sometimes new features "fix" old problems, but that's not the same thing.

We will release more info about what is in Market Garden very soon. Modules vary in terms of how many of this or that they might have, but we always make sure there's a balance of new things which, in total, balances it with other releases. Market Garden is not an exception. If you can't conceive of how that's possible, based on the little information we're released so far, then give us the benefit of the doubt until more information is available. That would be the sensible thing to do given our great track record of under promising and over delivering.

Steve

[Medex]

why can't I draw a path other side of the bridge?

can you check the video uploaded above post?

how can I pass famous Holland bridges while I can't pass even a fictive village bridge?

Thanks

After watching your video I got curious and loaded up that scenario and tried to do what you were doing. I didn't have any trouble at all plotting a path across that bridge. Your video is strange though something weird is going on.

[togi]

After watching your video I got curious and loaded up that scenario and tried to do what you were doing. I didn't have any trouble at all plotting a path across that bridge. Your video is strange though something weird is going on.

thanks for the trial

what is your gpu and processor?

My system is

8gb ram (2 x 4gb)

ATI Radeon 7870xt

fx8320 processor

Kind Regards

[Oddball_E8]

I've been managing these Forums since before Battlefront existed (back when it was Big Time Software).

Oh those were the days

I dont remember if i was a member back then, but i know i lurked around on the forums even then...

[Battlefront.com]

yes a good way divert the topic :-)

You mean your off-topic, thread hijacking, selfish, single minded determination to get attention? Obviously you won't let me stick to the topic at hand, so here goes...

Steve, can you explain why can't I draw a path other side of the bridge?

Can you explain why you are pretty much the only person who CAN'T draw a path to the other side of a bridge? Or do you think all the other CM players either aren't using bridges or don't care to complain about not being able to move over them?

can you check the video uploaded above post?

I did. I've never seen that problem before and it certainly doesn't happen to me. Apparently it doesn't happen to anybody else as well. The fact that this might be a problem only with you hasn't occurred to you yet, has it? Well, I guess better late than never...

Based on what I see there is obviously a bug. But that doesn't mean it's Combat Mission's bug. It could be in your card/driver combination because OpenGL mouse clicks require heavy interaction with cards/drivers. In fact, we had a major problem with ATI cards when we released CMSF. They had a serious bug (actually 4) in their drivers and they took about a year to finally fix it. Until then we had to code a special, not very good, work around for people with those ATI cards. You have an ATI card, yes? If so then maybe they broke something that.

You say you don't have any problems with other games. Unless you're using an OpenGL game which uses 2D mouse clicks in a 3D environment, that means absolutely nothing. We are one of the only games out there that has this combination of things and that matters.

My advice is to try playing the same scenario, with the same camera angles, doing the same things, on another computer. If you don't have another computer, maybe try the demo on someone elses' and see if you can replicate the problem.

how can I pass famous Holland bridges while I can't pass even a fictive village bridge?

I don't know, but I'm guessing you'll be the only one who can't.

Steve

PS. Note that my frustration with Togi is based on his behavior, not on the fact that he DOES have a legitimate technical problem. The problem isn't his choice or mine, but how he handles himself is. I have to deal with both issues and if anybody cares to notice I am.

[Oddball_E8]

PS. Note that my frustration with Togi is based on his behavior, not on the fact that he DOES have a legitimate technical problem. The problem isn't his choice or mine, but how he handles himself is. I have to deal with both issues and if anybody cares to notice I am.

I love smaller independant developers because they are not afraid to show when they are getting annoyed at someone

Most major developers would have been oh-so cautious in their response to this, which is a contributing factor in why this behavior is so wide spread nowadays (IMHO)

[togi]

You mean your off-topic, thread hijacking, selfish, single minded determination to get attention? Obviously you won't let me stick to the topic at hand, so here goes...

Can you explain why you are pretty much the only person who CAN'T draw a path to the other side of a bridge? Or do you think all the other CM players either aren't using bridges or don't care to complain about not being able to move over them?

I did. I've never seen that problem before and it certainly doesn't happen to me. Apparently it doesn't happen to anybody else as well. The fact that this might be a problem only with you hasn't occurred to you yet, has it? Well, I guess better late than never...

Based on what I see there is obviously a bug. But that doesn't mean it's Combat Mission's bug. It could be in your card/driver combination because OpenGL mouse clicks require heavy interaction with cards/drivers. In fact, we had a major problem with ATI cards when we released CMSF. They had a serious bug (actually 4) in their drivers and they took about a year to finally fix it. Until then we had to code a special, not very good, work around for people with those ATI cards. You have an ATI card, yes? If so then maybe they broke something that.

You say you don't have any problems with other games. Unless you're using an OpenGL game which uses 2D mouse clicks in a 3D environment, that means absolutely nothing. We are one of the only games out there that has this combination of things and that matters.

My advice is to try playing the same scenario, with the same camera angles, doing the same things, on another computer. If you don't have another computer, maybe try the demo on someone elses' and see if you can replicate the problem.

I don't know, but I'm guessing you'll be the only one who can't.

Steve

PS. Note that my frustration with Togi is based on his behavior, not on the fact that he DOES have a legitimate technical problem. The problem isn't his choice or mine, but how he handles himself is. I have to deal with both issues and if anybody cares to notice I am.

Steve

I have ATI card, I think that I'm not alone with this problem

but it seems that you have an approach that I have to solve this problem with myself.

I can't see a disclamer in store page about ATI cards may create some problems while buying these games.

So it is not fair to leave alone your customers because of the cases they were not warned

Regards

[Rocky Balboa]

I love smaller independant developers because they are not afraid to show when they are getting annoyed at someone

Most major developers would have been oh-so cautious in their response to this, which is a contributing factor in why this behavior is so wide spread nowadays (IMHO)

Could also be because most major software developers don't have the owner of the company handling public relations on the forums either

[Waffen_PL]

Psychologists could write some pretty thick multi-book works about some of the things that go on here

I totally agree with that but for totally different reasons

[waclaw]

I've been managing these Forums since before Battlefront existed (back when it was Big Time Software). There's many, many patterns of behavior that are repeated over and over again. My "favorite" is this one:

Person A behaves like a royal arse. Deliberately abusive, disrespectful of others, not the least bit interested in rational discourse, and very often (almost always, in fact) factually incorrect.

Person B challenges Person A on tone and substance.

Person C comes out of nowhere to say "typical. Try to criticize Battlefront or CM and you get slammed for telling the truth or having an opinion".

Then you get the pile on effect of people either defending the original abusive poster as a martyr of truth, and the many more pointing out that the person is getting exactly what he deserves. And all the while we keep working on making Combat Mission and Battlefront better. Because that's what we have always done and will always do.

Rinse and repeat

All of us want CM to be better. Nobody wants it to be stagnant. The list of things which have been changed/improved over the years, many due to direct involvement with customers, is massive. Our track record, therefore, is clearly established fact. Anybody disagreeing with that has discredited himself as being out of touch with reality. Being rude about it, on top, is just more indication that the person's opinions have no relevance or value.

Psychologists could write some pretty thick multi-book works about some of the things that go on here

Steve

but we are not out of nowhere, a regular of 10 years visiting Polish Forum CM, buying your games from the very beginning - even I have spent months working to make a sound mod http://www.battlefront.com/community/showthread.php?t=110567

so our short presence here is not a determinant of our experience / age

[Oddball_E8]

but we are not out of nowhere, a regular of 10 years visiting Polish Forum CM, buying your games from the very beginning - even I have spent months working to make a sound mod http://www.battlefront.com/community/showthread.php?t=110567

so our short presence here is not a determinant of our experience / age

Due to language barriers you are misunderstanding him.

He is not saying that YOU came out of nowhere.

He is saying that when someone makes a post that is whiny or aggressive there is always someone that "pops up from nowhere" to defend the person, despite the first person being obviously overreacting and not listening to reason.

YOU would be the first person in this case. The one overreacting.

Togi is the one "popping up out of nowhere" to defend you despite you overreacting in a very clear and obvious way.