A Canadian Cat Posted October 4, 2013 Share Posted October 4, 2013 Nice summary @Penry. I think that shows how this scenario is balanced on a razor's edge. Which means it creates that I'm going to win, I'm going to loose back and froth. Which is good. But I also think there is an opportunity for the defenders to push the game over the edge. My opponent, who is bar none the toughest opponent I have played against, read the situation exactly right (like he always does) and hit me hard right from the get go. He brought everything to bear as soon as possible. That allowed him to totally wipe out my initial force. That sets up the battle to basically start over again each time the US reinforcements come in because my first group could not get a toe hold. They come in totally blind and exposed. He was then able to just destroy everything as it arrived. I am not sure if you can tweak that possibility out of the game or not. I have not looked at the Italian side but if they had perhaps just a few things come in slightly later. For me it was the Tankettes that did me in. With the range they were able to stay at bazookas were useless and that gave them free rein. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
womble Posted October 4, 2013 Share Posted October 4, 2013 For me it was the Tankettes that did me in. With the range they were able to stay at bazookas were useless and that gave them free rein. Those little obsolete Renaults are spiffy infantry support until fighting armour [of pretty much any weight] shows up. Any time you have some, keep them out of the way of the enemy AT assets and you've got MG-proof field guns/MG nests (if you set them to Target Light). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penry Posted October 4, 2013 Author Share Posted October 4, 2013 I'm really looking forward to reading BDs side of events, and really hope he gets the time to continue and finish his AAR. I appreciate that his RL circumstances have changed somewhat recently and I'm glad he still has the time to at least return the save. I'm particularly interested in seeing where his setup zones were. I can't help feeling he set up too deep in the forests and should have been hurting me badly from the very first seconds. Most of all I'm looking forward to part two, to see how well I can defend the valley from his counter attack...... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penry Posted October 5, 2013 Author Share Posted October 5, 2013 Turn 56 Sloppy, sloppy, sloppy! That's what you get for being to relaxed and casual when you think you've got everything sewn up! I sent my left flank Sherman into the northern forest, by way of the forest road, and didn't check to see if it was buttoned up. I managed to take out a few of BDs defenders, but it wasn't long before my tank commander was on the wrong end of the bullets! To make matters worse BDs men threw a ton of grenades at my Sherman and managed to immobilise it. I won't be making that mistake again! I was too confident and thought that I wouldn't need any infantry support. Thought I'd bag myslef some more kills, even if I didn't take the barn objective. WRONG!!! Other than my stupid eagerness to inflict more pain on BD there was very little of note. Orders: Withdraw the two other Shermans at the other end of the northern forest and stick to consolidating the valley bottom and the three associated objectives. I have neither the time, nor the men in suitable condition to make a last gasp assault on either forest barn. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penry Posted October 6, 2013 Author Share Posted October 6, 2013 Turn 57 Towards the end of last turn my stricken Sherman popped a few smoke grenades as the sudden downturn in their fortunes caused them to panic. This behaviour continued again at the beginning of this turn, but at least they were still able to fight back, when the opportunity presented itself. I wonder if BDs men are similarly rooted to the spot and are unable to capitalise on the situation or flee to safety...... Another couple of infantry contacts presented themsleves, so I will spend the next turn trying to liquidise them, without putting my Shermans in danger! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penry Posted October 7, 2013 Author Share Posted October 7, 2013 Turn 58 Little of note, except BDs men in the northern forest look to have slipped away into the smoke laid down by my injured Sherman. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComradeP Posted October 8, 2013 Share Posted October 8, 2013 The Axis defensive line collapsed rather quickly when your second batch of Shermans showed up. What keeps surprising me when reading AAR's is how attacking tanks, which are driving somewhere and don't know precisely where the enemy is, often get the first shot in on stationary enemy vehicles positioned to cover a certain area that the enemy tank is driving into, even when the defenders are hull down. I guess it might've been caused by poor spotting rolls in most instances, but it does seem to be happening far more often than I would've expected. I didn't expect your second batch of Shermans to remove the StuGs from the game this easily. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penry Posted October 9, 2013 Author Share Posted October 9, 2013 Turn 59 BDs men visible in the southern forest were soon blow to pulp, with my hunting Sherman going well over board, firing numerous main rounds into their position. I meant to ask them to target light, so it was my fault, but poor BD must be cursing my heavy handedness! Right at the end of the turn my immobilised Sherman, in the northern forest, received a penetrating hit in its side hull armour. No idea where the round came from, but if I'm not careful I might lose it before the game ends...... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penry Posted October 9, 2013 Author Share Posted October 9, 2013 ComradeP - I see your point, but I did make sure that I had a fire arc over the STuGs. I've no explanation for the success of my assault and was as shocked to see such a comprehensive vistory as you! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penry Posted October 11, 2013 Author Share Posted October 11, 2013 Turn 60 And there was me thinking BD had all but thrown the towel in, but he is still trying to cripple my Sherman in the northern woods. First my Sherman spotted a German with, I presume, a rifle mounted grenade. It wasn't long before he was mown down with my Shermans machine gun. Then I spotted at least one, probably more, Italians towards the northern barn. A main round from the Sherman was followed up by more machine gun fire, resulting in one visible kill, possibly more hidden ones. Everywhere else was quiet, and with the clock ticking into overtime, I ordered my boys to dig in and hold tight. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penry Posted October 17, 2013 Author Share Posted October 17, 2013 Turn 61 First minute of overtime - nothing to report..... Turn 62 Second minute of overtime - nothing to report, except...... VICTORY! And the final positions..... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
womble Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 Were there really no VPs assigned to units? Or is it just they're not showing? That seems a bit rough in a scenario that appears to be built around throwing more and more allied assets into the valley until the axis defenders are thoroughly overmatched and overrun. The see-saw nature of "staggered" reinforcements changing the ebb and flow of the battle is interesting, but overall, it seems to me that the defender has to do significantly better than the attacker to get a draw. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penry Posted October 18, 2013 Author Share Posted October 18, 2013 Womble, I checked the final save and reviewed the end screen and briefing screen and both indicate that points are awarded for victory locations only. I'd previously noted the VP allocation and knew the barns weren't worth much, hence my decision to concentrate on the three valley locations. Reading through BDs AAR, it seems to me that he might have placed too much importance on holding the barns, especially when it must have been obvious that I was holed up in the valley and wasn't going anywhere near them anytime soon. Just look at how many men he has around the northern barn at endgame! I've obviously only got my experience of the scenario to go on, but it would seem that ian.leslie had a much worse time of it than me, getting creamed by his opponent in his play through. It will be interesting to see what forces we each get in Avanti and whether BD can make any sort of impression on my defences. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penry Posted October 18, 2013 Author Share Posted October 18, 2013 I've spent a couple of hours before starting work this morning reading through the whole of my AAR again, re-absorbing the advice and suggestions made by everyone involved and trying to ram them home so they stay fresh in my mind. I'm back on the defensive next game, as BD tries to retake the valley. I'm going to take my time on the setup for Avanti, I think it is the most important phase of each battle and goes a long way to determining how the rest of the game plays out. A huge thanks to everyone who contributed to this AAR and my CM education. I'm more than glad I reposted it from our quiet little corner of the web over at WPC. I hope you find round two as interesting and more than hope you continue to chip in with your invaluable 5c worth as you see fit. Cheers once again! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
womble Posted October 18, 2013 Share Posted October 18, 2013 ...points are awarded for victory locations only. Hey ho. I guess you both knew that going in. I'd previously noted the VP allocation and knew the barns weren't worth much, hence my decision to concentrate on the three valley locations. The barn locations were also the most difficult to assault, being deep in woods, and therefore largely un-artilleryable, and in unfavourable ground for your Shermans. Reading through BDs AAR, it seems to me that he might have placed too much importance on holding the barns... I think that's at least partly because the valley was exposed. Putting that extra infantry in the valley would just have meant your mortars got more kills. I've obviously only got my experience of the scenario to go on, but it would seem that ian.leslie had a much worse time of it than me, getting creamed by his opponent in his play through. Yes, this is definitely a scenario where the defender could, if they get the correct feel for the tempo and what's going to be needed when, do very well, but I think that takes more finesse than what the US needs to do against someone who just uses their assets competently. It will be interesting to see what forces we each get in Avanti and whether BD can make any sort of impression on my defences. Indeed. I'm looking forward to it. When you're done, there's another (?video?) AAR of that battle, out there somewhere... The only trouble reading your exploits is that the scenario is now spoiled for my own play. Worth it though. Good work. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigDork Posted October 18, 2013 Share Posted October 18, 2013 Reading through BDs AAR, it seems to me that he might have placed too much importance on holding the barns, especially when it must have been obvious that I was holed up in the valley and wasn't going anywhere near them anytime soon. Just look at how many men he has around the northern barn at endgame! Two reasons for the importance on BN. A big part was I knew that I would have reinforcements showing up there and it would have been disastrous if you had full control of it. Also, at one point I was convinced that you were going to make a big push for BN before moving on the farm so I moved my men from the back bridge up to the farm. As womble pointed out, more men in the valley would have just led to more death from your mortars. With the exception of the farm there wasn't a lot of cover down there. I should have put men in the woods back more from BS. They would not have been necessarily near a VP but they could have caused some pain to your guys. I think my biggest failing in this battle was not using my armor well enough. If I'd kept my STuGs more in the battle I could have stopped you from dominating the valley with your Shermans. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penry Posted October 19, 2013 Author Share Posted October 19, 2013 @womble Indeed, my one foray into the woods with my Sherman's didn't turn out very well! I realised it was a mistake going in without infantry support, my confidence was sky high and I felt invincible, but even with my broken troops, I don't think it would have made a difference. Finesse has never been my strong point! When my Sherman's turned up, especially the second lot, I had a very vivid mental picture of bullying my way down the valley. Thankfully that visualisation proved effective! Thanks once agin for all your help and input! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penry Posted October 19, 2013 Author Share Posted October 19, 2013 BD - as soon I read 'two reasons' I remembered that BN was one of your entry points.ining I never had any intention of going for your barns, so I'm glad you misread my thoughts. I did plan on getting my mortar team up on the top of the hill, but we all know what happened there..... Indeed, I think the STuG / Sherman matchup was the defining factor in this game. Once I started to dominate then it was plain sailing. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackcat Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 A vote of thanks to Penry and BD for taking the time to provide a most entertaining AAR. Cheers chaps and well done. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penry Posted October 22, 2013 Author Share Posted October 22, 2013 Thanks and no worries Blackcat. At least half the enjoyment I get out of playing CM is doing the AAR! That I also get a healthy dose of advice from better players is the icing on top of the cake. Check out BDs counter attack down the same valley in our Avanti AAR threads! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigDork Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 Glad you enjoyed it Blackcat. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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