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Gustav Kiwi Soldiers scenario: i need help


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Played as ALLIES vs the AI. on my 10th try now, and I keep getting slaughtered. Has anyone played this one as ALLIES and won? What are the proper tactics? I like these tiny scenarios, because you really learn about tactics. Obviously, I need some education here! thanks for the help

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It's one of those scenarios where you have to be very lucky or do everything exactly right (as defined by what the designer thinks is correct) with no errors.  

Lol, yeah, that one got plenty of (not necessarily good) press when it first came out.

Wow.....What a tricky little scenario, even once you know where everything is!  Quite a bit of effort went into that little map too, by the looks of things. 

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Played as US vs the AI. on my 10th try now, and I keep getting slaughtered. Has anyone played this one as US and won? What are the proper tactics? I like these tiny scenarios, because you really learn about tactics. Obviously, I need some education here! thanks for the help

After about 10 tries, my solution involved the scenario editor and an M7.

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Yup I've had the same result. ***spoiler alert****

I've tried smoking the building on the hill with MG and popping smoke. But the Para's Mgs/smgs in the train station just slaughter my men before they can return effective fire. I think my PIAT maybe the key to routing the germans. But they don't survive long enough. A tough nut to crack for sure!!

Any ideas from the tactical geniuses here would be great. I feeel sorry for my troops

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Played as US vs the AI. On my 10th try now, and I keep getting slaughtered. Has anyone played this one as US and won?

There's your main problem ;)

**SPOILERS**

As the Allied player you have numbers on your side, and time, plus the on- and off-map mortars. But you start from a really awkward position against two nicely interlocking postions, either of which would be hard enough on it's own. In general the Germans have devastating close-range small-arms firepower ... and their long-range (on this map) fire-power isn't too shabby either, with plentiful MGs.

One way to prevail is to use your smoke really well, to try and unpick the enemy positions one at a time while the other is masked. But you don't have a lot of smoke, so coordination and timing has to be spot on.

At best you're likely to take a lot of casualties securing both buildings. At worst you'll take a lot of casualties and barely get out of the compound. It's only a small scenario, but you'll really need to get your game on to win it.

(select text block to highlight and read it)

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**spoiler***

Hi JonS - you have summed up what I found extremely well. Really good timing of the smoke and a lot of luck (A devastating first hit with a PIAT would be nice!) might win the day, maybe I could wait until the germans on the hill run out of ammo... I don't think I've got the patience though.

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My first and best effort (although ultimately unsuccessful), was to prep fire the 81mm HE on the station to suppress/kill the occupants and rushing over there with a squad while the 2" used smoke to hide the enemy LOS from the hill house. Every replay I tried something else... but ended up with worse and worse massacres.

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What I like about that scenario is it's deceptively simple, which makes the player (me) careless. Its VERY unforgiving of 'bravado'. The notion "I'll just run my men over here and..." tends to not end well. You got to keep thinking every meter of ground is lethal-lethal-lethal.

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Hmm. I beat this in a couple of tries. I believe I did it without using the mortars - I forgot I had them.

Terrain was key. Also on a related note, knowing who had what ammo where, and when.

I went back to it again later when I had more free time. Thoroughly enjoyable scenario.

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I bow to Phil's abilities!! :) Can you give me a clue on how you isolated the the defender and achieved fire superiority. (Wow I'm using tactical speak!) Eg what terrain did you use as cover etc. I think I may be missing an important tactic or probably I'm really bad at assessing terrain (e.g I don't do any assessment)

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I bow to Phil's abilities!! :)

Heh, thanks, but I'd reserve any bowing for the fella that created this scenario. :) I've been meaning to congratulate him on this little masterpiece since I first played it. Frankly I'm not the best tactician in the world so I was just happy I'd beaten it!

Can you give me a clue on how you isolated the the defender and achieved fire superiority. (Wow I'm using tactical speak!) Eg what terrain did you use as cover etc. I think I may be missing an important tactic or probably I'm really bad at assessing terrain (e.g I don't do any assessment)

I don't want to say too much. Not that I'm giving away a "trick" or anything, but there are a heap of fun approaches and I'd hate to have folks think only one works.

The first time I beat it, I used dead ground heavily, tried to keep my fires short and effective, and made use of the excellent small unit leaders I'd been afforded. Plenty of careful movement. I probably looked like I was utterly crazy sending troops all over the place the way I did (including some men who'd run out of ammo and who acted as very useful sets of eyes and ears) but I had a great time. :)

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what is funny about this scenario is that even though I know exactly where the german troops are, I still cannot beat it. the closest I have come so far was suppressing fire and the piat at the machine gun on the hill (got lucky with two direct hits), plus point arty on the sniper crew (got lucky with accurate arty). feeling confident, I attempted to get the guys in the train station, under cover of smoke from my mortar - and got slaughtered. lol

"deceptively simple" indeed. this might be the most difficult scenario I've ever played in CM. I really want to see a movie of someone winning this one!

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Hey! The programmer guy wins the scenario?

Sounds like Kirk and the Kobayashi Maru.

And the S in JonS might stand for sadist with this scenario.

Bravo Jonny, Bravo.

SPOILER

Last night I am on try 4 and finally got 3 Kiwis up by the wall near the sniper.

I am trying to fire 2 inch smoke but never see anything. The rounds count goes down but no smoke and a pancake. The rail station bubbas suppressed them too much and it all came to naught.

Plus some rail station FJ guy has a double barreled sheis becker.

I swear it seems to fire 2 rounds at once or 2 guys fire at the same time.

Another go tonight laddies!

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I am trying to fire 2 inch smoke but never see anything. The rounds count goes down but no smoke and a pancake.

Have you made the classic mistake of toggling smoke off with the hotkey (alt-k? can't remember) and forgotten about it. I think everyone does that with smoke (and trees) at least once.

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Wow, alt-k, thanks, I will check it ASAP.

I have some of those ingrained in the noggin but not that one.

Hahaha, I remember I think I remember alt-C from CM1 to make your units visual size big, bigger, BIGGER, BIGGEST. I needed that to see the dang things and not forget to give one of them an order.

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I gave this one a whirl last night. I thought I was doing well until one section was utterly wiped-out and another one chopped-up. That had me pulling the plug. However, I've got some ideas for taking another shot at it.

Although one complaint is the distinct lack of any "Kiwi-ness" about this scenario. My "Kiwis" were kitted-out as members of the 49th 'West Riding' Division. Plus, I didn't really notice any Kiwi accent emanating from the pixeltruppen. (Did BF at least recycle the voices from CMAK?)

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Thank god for this thread.

I always plays the smallest scenario first time out with a new CM game (I have since CMBO). On top of it, I have felt my CM skills have slipped as I've been getting thrashed in my recent PBEM games.

With that in mind, I was a tad frustrated when my Kiwis broke and got slaughtered the first time around. I was irritated on my second go when everybody was killed before I could get them out of the compound (mild exaggeration). After the third and fourth tries, I was ready to turn in my Field Marshall's baton and find something else to do.

Kobayashi Maru, indeed, and I am no Kirk.

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