Lets hear about the greatest tactical game ever

[slysniper]

Here is the spot to speak up and say if you believe CMx2 is presently the greatest tactical level game ever created.

I for one cast a vote that it is.

I went through years of Avalon hill games, spending most of my time with SL & ASL, but did many others of their titles also.

Computer games were toys and it was many years before finally a game came out that captured the firefight correctly. It was the close combat series, my time then went away from board games and finally I could see that I would never be happy going back. So ASL was sold and close combat became my love.

Then I played the total war series also, fun and enjoyable but not to the realism that I craved.

CMBO game out, I tried it but it was a while before I really fell in love with it, but once I did, it has been CM ever since.

I fired up a old CMx1 battle the other day, it is the first time in over a year to touch it. Again it seems to find a place now to stay in the past and I do not want to return.

I have the best possible game available right now. And it appears it will stay that way for a while to come. Likely until BF decides to reinvent the engine again and push it to new levels

We are so negative on the this board so much, time to have a BF thread to let them know their efforts are great.

[fatehunter]

Completely agreed.

[Macisle]

I had the first SL module as a kid (still do), but could never find players for it. Though I played other games, in different genres, that game always held a special place for me.

Later, when it came out, I bought CC3. I thought it was great at first because it reminded me of SL. However, I quickly began to see gaping flaws in it. Shortly after it came out, I bought CMBO. Within 30 minutes of my first battle, the CC series seemed hopelessly obsolete to me. I bought CC4, but played only a few battles and shelved it.

After much CMx1 gaming, I rediscovered my SL game in storage and that led me to ASL. ASL ended up beating out CMx1 and I largely stopped playing CM until CMBN came out.

Well...with CMx2, ASL just doesn't seem to cut it anymore. CMx2's ability to do realistic FOW, artillery, 1:1 and a myriad of other things outweigh the advantages that ASL still has (mostly in terms of breadth).

So, yes. I'd agree that CMx2 is the best tactical wargame ever made. And likely, each new engine jump will newly win that title for the CM series.

Makes me sad for my ASL stuff, though. I've got a complete set of mostly mint-condition mounted boards. I can't decide whether to keep it or sell it.

[Col Deadmarsh]

Later, when it came out, I bought CC3. I thought it was great at first because it reminded me of SL. However, I quickly began to see gaping flaws in it. Shortly after it came out, I bought CMBO. Within 30 minutes of my first battle, the CC series seemed hopelessly obsolete to me. I bought CC4, but played only a few battles and shelved it.

CC2 was the best game of that series and next to CM, it's my favorite computer game even after all these years. Nothing can replace driving the Hetzenflammer around town and scorching everything that's in its path.

[Macisle]

The CC series is a great beer and pretzels game. It's just not even close to the level of realism in CMx1, let alone CMx2.

[Wodin]

CC2 was the best game of that series and next to CM, it's my favorite computer game even after all these years. Nothing can replace driving the Hetzenflammer around town and scorching everything that's in its path.

CC2 in it's day was the pinnicle. Loved it. APOS has taken over that slot for that kind of game I feel.

Yes CMx2 is the No1 tactical level game..still a way to go before it fulfills it's potential...The day it can do City fighting is the day I will know I need look no more for a tactical game.

@Macisle, keep it. You sell you'll regret it. Though I love CMx2...I also love the tactile experience of a boardgame. There are a few boardgames I still want. GD'42, Streets of Stalingrad, Whistling Death, Der Weltkrieg, Deathride Kursk, Fields of Fire and the Sergeants mini's game. Also Lock N Load Stalingrad is finally approaching Beta phase (Though thats a PC conversion)

[Macisle]

Thanks, Wodin.

You're right. I would regret it. There is still something wonderful about tactile nature of the boardgame medium. And, it's truly amazing how realistic ASL gets, given the limits of cardboard and dice.

[umlaut]

I agree, of course.

But that is hardly a surprising answer - when asking on this forum

[Macisle]

Oh, just remembered...

my ebay horror story:

After rediscovering SL and before discovering and moving over to ASL, I bought a copy of COI on ebay. Unpunched and almost untouched by time...until the dude selling it packs it in, like, a thin, single-layer bubble envelope.

When it arrived, the envelope had holes in it and counters were falling out. Taking it out, it looked like an elephant had stepped right on the center of the box and twisted its foot around.

The guy was very nice and gave me a refund right away, but jeez... All those years and all the joy it could have given someone, only to meet such a pointless, preventable end.

[c3k]

Are we excluding "Crysis" from consideration?

Ken

[Lanzfeld]

Best tactical game ever? Castle Wolfenstein hands down.

[Macisle]

Best tactical game ever? Castle Wolfenstein hands down.

He-he. I remember when that was a cutting edge game...

and I was a jealous kid who wouldn't get his own computer for like...15 more years.

[altipueri]

Sid Meier's Gettysburg. Oh sorry, forgot where I was. CMx1.

Why can't my CMx2 troops stop moving like a bunch of crabs I've just hauled up onto the jetty.

[Macisle]

Hey, the punch was blue when we made it.

Why is it green now?

[Ron]

Polling here may not get impartial responses.

Occasionally and before CM, I have put some time into other WWII tactical games(I'm thinking Steel Panthers, CloseCombat, GI Combat, Panzer Command, Achtung Panzer) However, while some aspects are unique they never really come close to the tactical depth that Combat Mission offers and now with CMx2, it not even really a fair comparison anymore as they are not in the same category. So for me hands down it is CMx2.

I saw someone else mentioned Sid Meier's Gettsburg, now that was a fun game though light on the realism side. For more realism I would recommend the Scourge of War Civil War games. Another game ahead of its time was Myth by Bungie, very tense and fun.

[slysniper]

Sid Meier's Gettysburg.

Forgot about that one, not bad. But the greatest of all time, come on. You cannot even create another battle with it.

Too bad it has not progressed in the years since

[Guest]

I was a tester at EA for a couple of the games in the Sid Meier's Civil War series. They were pretty great games - even the test builds were fun as heck. CC2 was an awesome achievement as well - I still keep a copy of that lying around (actually I keep a copy of SM's Gettysburg around too).

CM delivers something that no other game does, though, in my opinion. Not exactly unbiased, I know, but I don't think it's inaccurate.

[normannobrot]

to me its the most enjoyable coolest looking ww2 experience, just wish they would polish off the small issues for which is just trying to make it run smoother and not burn out your memory quicker than coffee in my system lol....but i do have faith. :-p

[BLSTK]

Gather 'round children and I'll tell y'all 'bout the good ole days.

Grandpa cut his teeth on Avalon Hill's "Richtofen's War" (still have a copy from 1972!) I was a member of the high school History Club, which was merely an excuse to play war games during the lunch hour. We were nerds before it became trendy!

What came next is just a blur, until I emerged from the deep sleep that is a career, marriage and parenthood, into the computer age. When it came out I could not get enough of "Panzer General". This phase gave way to the online gaming experience that was War2Glory. All good fun, but something was still missing.

Needless to say, we have ALL graduated to the Big Leagues here at CM. And yes I admit I was late arriving to the party. I don't plan on missing "last call". Glad to be here with you other Grognards. Let the good times roll!

[Doug Williams]

Best tactical game(s) ever?

SSI's "gold box" series (Pool of Radiance, Curse of the Azure Bonds, Secret of the Silver Blades, Pools of Darkness), hands down.

Oh! Best WW2 tactical games? Why, the CM series of course.

[Sgt Schultz]

CM series hands down. They have the tools and the talent.

Before that it was the Panzer General and Silent Service games for my WW2 tactical fix.

Before that was Battle of Britain for DOS. Nothing like a 16-color Hurricane in my sights.

Before that was all the ASL that I still have in boxes. People with cats should never attempt any Avalon Hill game at their home.

Before that was Stratego. 1967 didn't have that many options for a six year old.

[MengJiaoRedux]

Best tactical game ever? Castle Wolfenstein hands down.

Ok. That's funny.

Yep. The combat mission series is the best tactical game ever.

I played a board game (Panzer Grenadier) recently. Or I tried to until I found that the PzIVs had twice the armor rating and twice the friepower of a Sherman.

CMBN has cured me of a need to relive other people's Panzer fantasties.

[Erwin]

I still enjoy "Rome: Total War" for strategy and Silent Hunter series for excellent "immersion". Other tactical greats that stayed on my HD for a looong time were Panzer Elite and Tank Platoon. (Steel Beasts was interesting but tough.) There were lots of other very good games, but they didn't last as long on my HD. Probably not that replayable.

[sburke]

The best thing ever is my toto washlet.

http://www.totousa.com/WhyTOTO/Innovation/Washlet.aspx

Waking up on a cold morning, strolling into the bathroom and sitting on a WARMED seat, which then washes your butt with WARM water and then blow dries with WARM air. The first thing I found in Japan and thought "these people are on to something."

Oh wait we were talking about tactical gaming...sorry.

[General Jack Ripper]

The very first wargame I played was Risk, back when I was a small boy of 10 years old. I remember spending an entire afternoon trying to invade Iceland from Greenland. While I eventually took Iceland, my dad had invaded South America and Asia, and completely destroyed both me and my sister's forces. We never played Risk together again.

However, a bug had bitten me and it's effects have lasted until this day. I played Risk with anyone who would, and later I turned to Axis and Allies. 17 years later I still own that box of Axis and Allies, it's sitting under my bed and hasn't been opened in years.

I was about 14 years old when we got our first computer, but an intel 486 computer wasn't much of a games machine. Hanging out with my nerd buddies after school, I learned about this great new game called Command and Conquer: Red Alert. I begged my parents to buy a new computer, but that didn't happen. Computers were expensive back then. I played Command and Conquer whenever I could, and eventually learned about other games including Starcraft, and Close Combat.

After playing Close Combat for the first time, I knew my priorities had shifted. I didn't want to just play any game, I wanted to play realistic games. In most wargames, soldiers are a disposable commodity, costing anywhere from 50-100 resources, and they train in about 5-10 seconds. In Close Combat, all you get is what you are given, and the challenge and enjoyment of the game immediately increases. As I got older, I played through the Close Combat series, and also played games such as Sudden Strike, and a hex based game called Europe in Flames. However, the was still something missing. Hex based games had the large scale of operations, but were time consuming to play, and didn't offer much in the way of action. Close Combat and Sudden Strike were entertaining, but were either limited in scope, or difficult to manage.

One day at college, I was passing time by looking up information about German halftracks. As I was browsing pictures, I came across a screenshot for a game called Combat Mission: Beyond Overlord. The shot simply showed 3 halftracks in a field, but it spoke to me. The halftracks were in 3D! Trees popped up out of the ground, and I could even see a building in the distance! I simply had to find out more about this amazing looking thing!

Needless to say, I shortly arrived at Madmatt's Combat Mission website, and then passed through to find the demo for CM:BO. After playing "Valley of Trouble" about 12 times from both sides, I ordered the CM:BO and CM:BB bundle pack, nervously waited about 2 weeks for it to arrive, then immediately uninstalled Close Combat and Sudden Strike, never to take them seriously again.

The Combat Mission series has set the standard for realism and gameplay. It has also changed my taste in computer games. The hybrid turn-based game system known as WEGO, that allows you as much time as you want to agonize over your decisions, is a huge improvement to the click fest that turned me off of Starcraft and Sudden Strike. Not to mention, the 3D environment is much more entertaining than watching sprites point red and blue lines at each other like Close Combat.

Combat Mission has become the bar which I have used to measure all other wargames I play, and few other games even come close to it.

Well, that's my story and I'm sticking to it.

- SLIM