Infantry tactics

[womble]

I didn't even know that it was possible to set a time limit for area fire! How do you do that?

You put a "Pause" command on the waypoint (including the unit's current location) that you're giving the fire command at, and then a move order away from that waypoint. At the destination waypoint of this move order you apply a different fire order (Facing, Cover Arc) which cancels the existing area fire order. So you'll be Area Firing for the time of the pause, plus whatever fire your pTruppen decide to put out while moving.

You can't set a limit on a fire order without having a movement order after the pause. Not so bad with vehicles, because you can use a very short (and fast, if ground permits) move order, but with infantry teams having to move a full AS, most of the time, it means you have to displace.

[Vinnart]

I'm surprised you get any suppression effect for a 5-10s burst. Are you finding you do?

I am finding it good for final pushes into the enemy AS. At any rate I have found it always better than just running quick in. Much depends on how many grenades hit the mark, or panic the enemy and their morale. As expected I do find 10 sec more effective than 5 sec for obvious reasons for final pushes. Now, and then 5 sec is enough to throw 1 grenade which can be enough, but more rarely. I have even gone as much as 15 sec with the trade off being more ammo spent. This is how I have been advancing after I hit something. When I do make contact I stop the team taking fire, and maintain steady fire with fire/MG teams for 1 min on that spot while a flank team pushes in on another area of the line with hopes of sweeping in on the flank of the contact if it does not hit something too. Having an MG is best, and the fire team will go through more grenades during the min. In this way the enemy has had 1 min of suppressing before a final10 sec area fire then move. The area fire with time delay, then a move order is the only way I know of in the game where you can have more control over grenades being thrown. Also, a move with a face order is needed to lift suppressing fire, or you end up suppressing your own assault teams when they move in for final assault. Area firing for 1 min can diminish the supply rapidly. I wish we cold get grenade re-supply like other ammo.

know there are enemy but don't have LOS to, say, or even just being left to the TacAI's devices). Splitting any AT teams off and sticking them way in back so they don't randomly fire off all their AT Rockets is good, too.

Area fire spreads itself one AS either side of its aim point, so if you have

Asslt - Fire - Asslt - Fire - Asslt - Fire

adjacent teams, the fire teams' suppression patterns will overlap to produce a relatively even 'suppresion front'.

Agree splitting into fire/assault team is best. That is how I am doing it too with American squads to control the Thompson ammo. With the Germans I tends to split squads evenly especially with Panzergrenadier giving 1xLMG to each team. Agree too about trying to get AT guy to limit area fire as to not go through AT rockets needlessly. Sometime though once the squad has been split into fire/assault teams the AT guy can’t be separated from the fire team. In this case it is either all area fire or not. I think it would be good if the game allowed the AT element to be split off no matter what.

[Vinnart]

I am playing Verriville right now against AI, which is easier than a human. The map has a large dense forest that must be taken. I am planning to take this area last after the town is secured. You get arty including 105mm so that may do pretty much all the work, but I will screen shot my follow up infantry advance for critique.

[womble]

I am finding it good for final pushes into the enemy AS. At any rate I have found it always better than just running quick in. Much depends on how many grenades hit the mark, or panic the enemy and their morale. As expected I do find 10 sec more effective than 5 sec for obvious reasons for final pushes. Now, and then 5 sec is enough to throw 1 grenade which can be enough....

Gah. I'm a doofus. I was confusing myself when I asked about suppression from 10s fire bursts. Yes, I agree at knife fighting range, it will usually produce good results.

I wish we cold get grenade re-supply like other ammo.

Amen. Grenades, AT Rockets for Germans (other than Fausts), 7.92K and the rest.

With the Germans I tends to split squads evenly especially with Panzergrenadier giving 1xLMG to each team.

I still split them Assault/fire, to keep the LMGs in one team and the MP40/44s and grenades in the other. I've seen assault teams with a brace of MP40 and an MP44... murderous short range firepower. When a MG42 is moving, the gunner uses his P38, so best not to have that going on if there's any chance firing will be necessary, I reckon.

Sometime though once the squad has been split into fire/assault teams the AT guy can’t be separated from the fire team. In this case it is either all area fire or not. I think it would be good if the game allowed the AT element to be split off no matter what.

If the team has AT elements (including rifle grenades) Target Light will allow area fire without those resources being applied. It's just a monumental PITA to have to remember to use Light for those teams. I tend to think that if a team's too small to split twice, just splitting the AT team off and using the remainder as if it were one team works better. Really small teams seem to just evaporate without either giving the enemy away or doing much damage back; losing 2 from a team in the same minute is fairly common; 3 less so.

[Vinnart]

I still split them Assault/fire, to keep the LMGs in one team and the MP40/44s and grenades in the other. I've seen assault teams with a brace of MP40 and an MP44... murderous short range firepower. When a MG42 is moving, the gunner uses his P38, so best not to have that going on if there's any chance firing will be necessary, I reckon.

As deadly as the pistols are in the game at present that might not be a bad thing . I dread going up against those guys. I always lose at least one dude to pistols. I am sure next patch should address the pistol accuracy. I just hope BF doesn’t go overboard, and make them totally useless at close range such as in rooms. I know there was a big thread about it so I am sure it has been addressed thoroughly already.

If the team has AT elements (including rifle grenades) Target Light will allow area fire without those resources being applied. It's just a monumental PITA to have to remember to use Light for those teams. I tend to think that if a team's too small to split twice, just splitting the AT team off and using the remainder as if it were one team works better. Really small teams seem to just evaporate without either giving the enemy away or doing much damage back; losing 2 from a team in the same minute is fairly common; 3 less so.

Ah yes, I had forgotten that one since I am so used to associating, and using target light with armor. Good point to remember. Not sure, but will target light limit hand grenade throwing too? If yes, I see a good benefit for conserving them for longer suppression times.

[mjkerner]

Not sure, but will target light limit hand grenade throwing too? If yes, I see a good benefit for conserving them for longer suppression times.

Yes, from my recent experience in a FGM Campaign game, where grenade use was necessary in order to ensure capturing a hedgerow I needed to shelter my assault squads from punishing enemy fire. I searched the forum for grenade info, and experimented alot in a mock up I made in the editor of my objective--practice makes perfect! "Target Light" for infantry will conserve grenades. "Target" from one AS away and the P-truppen will use grenades.

[theFightingSeabee]

What I usually do in the situation where I need to "manually" clear out some woods is to line up several squads (hopefully available) and "Hunt" forward. Make sure they are somewhat spread out. Once an enemy unit is spotted, try to open fire on that unit and/or use area fire to try to pin them down. Then try to flank them with your other squads.

If they run into another enemy unit, try to pin them down as well. Keep trying to flank with any units you have available, but if you can't for whatever reason, you can try to disengage one of your squads, drop back, and move up behind your squad that is still engaged. Bring the moving squad up adjacent to the engaged squad and try to move up on the (hopefully) pinned enemy, targeting while moving. If you can get within grenade range, your men moving closer should be able to take them down using grenades and gunfire.

If you are not able to pin down an enemy squad or are pinned down yourself, use any available squad to toss smoke and/or shoot at the enemy until your other squad is un-pinned and can drop back. Don't be afraid to drop back to reposition your squads for another whack at it.

Basically, you never want to do this with one squad unless you are confident you can win with brute force, which is tough to do if you're going up against a German unit with an MG. More often than not, you'll be the one who is pinned.

One more tip is that you can fire into the woods where you think an enemy unit may be even though you cannot see them. You just might pin them down long enough for your flanking squad to bring the pain.

[Vinnart]

Yes, from my recent experience in a FGM Campaign game, where grenade use was necessary in order to ensure capturing a hedgerow I needed to shelter my assault squads from punishing enemy fire. I searched the forum for grenade info, and experimented alot in a mock up I made in the editor of my objective--practice makes perfect! "Target Light" for infantry will conserve grenades. "Target" from one AS away and the P-truppen will use grenades.

Thanks for the intel. It's in the bank now about remembering target light options for infantry beyond using it more for armor.

I will not be able to screen shot my forest battle from Veirville. The Germans surrendered after I took the town, and dumped a heavy 105 barrage on the forest. Oh well, on to the campaigns which I have not played yet.

[womble]

I will not be able to screen shot my forest battle from Veirville. The Germans surrendered after I took the town, and dumped a heavy 105 barrage on the forest. Oh well, on to the campaigns which I have not played yet.

Yeah, doing everything else possible to induce the enemy to concede is probably still the best way of clearing out a forest