nik mond Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 ...............Anyways, I like that you guys have thought about this very thoroughly and were not like "ah lets just retexture the Wehrmacht guys, that'll do it"............................ Aren't the SS infact repainted Werhmacht models? Did I miss something? I thought they were the same models. No difference. I would have preferred, and was hoping to get a single actual smock modelled SS soldier with buttoned collar and no lapel edges. I think it would have been acceptable for every SS to look like this, knowing the texture patterns could have been varied or mixed in different colors and combos for that one model. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Anyways, I like that you guys have thought about this very thoroughly and were not like "ah lets just retexture the Wehrmacht guys, that'll do it". We do try More about this below... How about a selectable customization in the Editor? So for SS-PzGr-Bn you could select their uniform with each squad or maybe platoon given the same uniform. That is part of the solution and it's the major stumbling block. Any time you open up the game to input from the user things get complicated fast. Not Earth Shattering Oh My God kinda complicated in this instance, but Charles and I probably exchanged 100 emails hammering out the design so that a) we have a system that works as expected and the end user can't frig it up I'd argue you on the composition of 12th SS, btw. I don't have any official documents that say X M42 smocks and Y pea dot tunics were delivered to the division, but I made a crude count on all pictures I could find of 12SS in the Normandy timeframe (I have the divisional history and a pictoral history). Smocks were predominantely shown in these, about 2:1 to pea dot '44 tunics. Last came the one-piece-overalls in Italian camo. I just kinda tossed that out there as an example. Usually when you see a picture of a unit in the Peas pattern you don't see soldiers in other types. These uniforms appear to have been issued more on a unit basis than an individual basis. Which is why seeing 3 Squads in a Platoon with 3 different uniforms in random quantities is... well... atypical at best. BTW, are you aware that the waffenss-gear texture is unused in the module? It is there, it looks beautiful, but it doesn't get applied Part of the larger problem with unfortunate code inflexibility. That will be fixed with a related, but different, change to how we code models. Aren't the SS infact repainted Werhmacht models? Did I miss something? I thought they were the same models. No difference. Yes, that is true. The Peas 44 tailoring is, in this context, identical. The LW Field Division jacket, on the other hand, is a new model. I would have preferred, and was hoping to get a single actual smock modelled SS soldier with buttoned collar and no lapel edges. I think it would have been acceptable for every SS to look like this, knowing the texture patterns could have been varied or mixed in different colors and combos for that one model. The point to make here is we have both models built, so we didn't cheap out on that aspect. What we had to do was make a choice between one or the other. The Peas 44 uniform is an iconic image of Normandy and in particular with the forces that the Commonwealth went up against. We have plenty of opportunities to work the Smocks in later and so I made the call that Peas 44 was the one to go with. Since neither black and white choice is defendable from a historic standpoint, it really was a coin toss. One quick note about the KT and Lynx model details. This is something that slipped through until the last minute and should have been caught. But we didn't think it was serious enough to delay the game for 2 weeks just to have better visuals for the two vehicles in question. They will be updated with the next patch. Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futon river crossing Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 One quick note about the KT and Lynx model details. This is something that slipped through until the last minute and should have been caught. But we didn't think it was serious enough to delay the game for 2 weeks just to have better visuals for the two vehicles in question. They will be updated with the next patch. Cool!! I assume the Wespe is in that list too? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akd Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 I would have preferred, and was hoping to get a single actual smock modelled SS soldier with buttoned collar and no lapel edges. I think it would have been acceptable for every SS to look like this, knowing the texture patterns could have been varied or mixed in different colors and combos for that one model. The LW Field Division jacket, on the other hand, is a new model. psst...modders take note: your SS camo smocks are but a renamed file and a new texture away from reality... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baneman Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Considering that we played with what were practically Lego-men in CMx1 for 10 years and were perfectly happy because we were driven by the game being as accurate as could be managed, I find the moaning about some missing textures to be a little over the top. Since I'm still keen for the game to be as accurate as they can make it, I'd far rather BF were working on things like tank-target-acquisition-speed or similar in the quest for accuracy than for eg. tank internals graphic representation. Opinions seem to vary, but aren't most of us after the game accuracy ? Dedicated individuals like Aris and others too numerous to mention have already raised base-game graphics to a new level - how about we let BF concentrate on the big stuff ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankster65 Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Originally Posted by Battlefront.com The LW Field Division jacket, on the other hand, is a new model. ... I love those camo schemes for the LW infantry. They are really, really immersive. Kudos to the artist. psst...modders take note: your SS camo smocks are but a texture away from reality... All I ask is we at least get those license plates on the SS vehicles changed to their proper form. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostRider3/3 Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 I love those camo schemes for the LW infantry. They are really, really immersive. Kudos to the artist. All I ask is we at least get those license plates on the SS vehicles changed to their proper form. Can you show us some pictures? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nik mond Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 .......Thanks BF for answering my previous question. psst...modders take note: your SS camo smocks are but a renamed file and a new texture away from reality... but the file renamed is associated to LW models only, or at least using LW troops as SS in that respect ...I think. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steiner14 Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 All I can say is we do understand that uniforms are an important aesthetic aspect of the game and therefore we will get it in sooner rather than later. While this is important for uniform-grogs, i think a more important aesthetic aspect and also more important for a broad custumer base are natural motions of soldiers. Motions are recognized also from greater distances and they strenghten the impression of a human-like force. Please, is it possible to use another motion for hunting soldiers? They move, as if they would have dropped something in their underpants... IMO this reduces the atmosphere of the otherwise nice and realistic motions. And please, please allow soldiers to take a rifle into one hand when running. Additional handsigns of officers or NCOs when a team is split and ordered into a direction would also be a nice atmospheric enhancement. Or a handsign of the leader to stop, after a longer movement path. How about soldiers scratching on the face or in the neck. Wiping sweat form the face if units are tired. Or how about smoking soldiers if units are not feeling threatened and not moved for a longer time? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akd Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 .......Thanks BF for answering my previous question. but the file renamed is associated to LW models only, or at least using LW troops as SS in that respect ...I think. Yeah, no simple way I can see that would not affect the Luftwaffe textures, but the smock is apparently of upmost importance to some. Luftwaffe can be sacrificed! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeFF Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 We do not have specific textures for specific ranks. That's something we want to work into the game in the future, but honestly... it's a really low priority because it is a tiny visual detail only. But we are working towards more flexibility with uniforms in general, so this is being worked into the plan. Armored Pioneers wear the Assault Gun crew uniforms. This is technically correct because they were specifically authorized to wear such uniforms by the High Command. However, due to uniform shortages this wasn't always true. We don't have the sort of flexibility we need to make this a bit more varied. See previous comment. All other forms of Pioneers should be wearing standard infantry uniforms. Sounds good, thanks! Having the uniform's rank insignia match the rank of the soldier is a small detail as you say, but it's one of those little details that makes the game look all that better. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeFF Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Opinions seem to vary, but aren't most of us after the game accuracy ? Dedicated individuals like Aris and others too numerous to mention have already raised base-game graphics to a new level - how about we let BF concentrate on the big stuff ? I'm after accuracy and fidelity. For me, that means of course things like proper bullet physics, armor penetration models, AI, etc. But it also means (in the context of this thread) good-looking, reasonably accurate uniforms and vehicle models. I know BFC isn't one to take this approach, but saying that they should "concentrate on the big stuff" implies that the developers shouldn't place as high of a priority on textures, because the modders will be along shortly to fix any problems. Like I said, I'm glad BFC doesn't take that approach. Everyone of course has their opinions on what makes for good textures, but IMO with some very small exceptions the stock CMBM are excellent. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rokko Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 psst...modders take note: your SS camo smocks are but a renamed file and a new texture away from reality... I kind hope not. Sleeves like that won't work with LW-jacket model 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sburke Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 I dont get the freaking moaners in this thread - just dont get them. Interiors of tanks - so what - who even looks at them - to be honest I dont know why BF even bothers with them. I have seen the models people seem to be complaining about and whilst they do look a bit less detailed again I hardly see it is something to be worried about - after all - any proper player of the game isnt playing with a single original skin BF did for the base game as they have likely loaded up aris' mod in any case - and even as is they are hardly CM1 throwbacks. As for the module not being worth the measly 20 quid I paid for it - personally - I sit here amazed that I get so much for so little. This game is a dream for me - there isnt another game that comes close to giving me what this one does and not another game that I return to or spend as much time with as this one. So BF please ignore the petty - OMG he has got the wrong lapel badge freak outs and add things which are important to the game. While I generally agree with you here I have to admit, the grogs are a large part of what keeps pushing this game to higher standards that make it so unique. So while I may not know that on June 15th the II Battalion of 916th IR had sent all their clothing to the French laundry (no not the restaurant) and fought in towels all day, I do really appreciate that there is a whole group of folks here who do. So now I have GIs with 1st ID badges on them stalking German troops with equally detailed uniforms and I have to say - thanks guys for all your grogginess. You'd likely bore me witless in a bar, but I love the end result. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fizou Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Thanks to Steve for the information about uniforms and unpdate on KT and Lynx. Im very happy to hear this 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karabekian Posted March 15, 2012 Author Share Posted March 15, 2012 Well, I spend as much time changing the games I play, as I spend playing them. I constantly change the markings on tanks and vehicles in different historical scenarios I try to recreate. I also spend almost as much time giving orders, as I spend watching my AT guns reload, tanks aim and move or infantry crossing a paticularly nice piece of terrain. I love the way CM:BN combines graphics with physics. Not too much eye candy or any fantastic special effects, but coherent, historically correct vehicles and uniforms. These things are not the main focus of the game, but is it too much to ask that the Addon is at least up to the quality of the original? I think the answer should be yes, before the question is asked. I never asked BF to fix it immediately (even if I am surprised they were released, when discussion on their quality started when the screenshots were released). The KT is not even the same resolution as other tanks! This thread was/is about the KT, so hardly surprising to find, well, complaints on the KT. I do not find my "demands" unreasonable. I think that the repository or GaJ`s mod warehouse shows, that CM is not only about the people who "play" the game. Gladly, we are allowed to have different opinions on this forum. Even if some people are omniscient. Its not like anyone had to answer or even read the thread. But I am glad that BF replied (Thank You! ) and that someone shows mutual interest. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Canadian Cat Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 That is part of the solution and it's the major stumbling block. Any time you open up the game to input from the user things get complicated fast. Not Earth Shattering Oh My God kinda complicated in this instance, but Charles and I probably exchanged 100 emails hammering out the design so that a) we have a system that works as expected and the end user can't frig it up Ah the classic programming problem. Show me a design that is idiot proof and I'll find you a better idiot. Of course I usually don't phrase it that way when customers are around:) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Canadian Cat Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 One quick note about the KT and Lynx model details. This is something that slipped through until the last minute and should have been caught. But we didn't think it was serious enough to delay the game for 2 weeks just to have better visuals for the two vehicles in question. They will be updated with the next patch. Good call and thanks for the update. Also, that reminded me, I read that the Lynx is not selectable in Quick Battles. If that is true is that fixable in a patch as well? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
futon river crossing Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 All I can say is - thank god I'm not a uniform grog 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stingray Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 "One quick note about the KT and Lynx model details. ... They will be updated with the next patch. Steve" BFC really cares... Please make the Lynx available in QB also...That is all I want for my birthday. Thank you Steve. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankster65 Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Can you show us some pictures? Some screenshots of this are now in the screenshot thread at top of this forum. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostRider3/3 Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Some screenshots of this are now in the screenshot thread at top of this forum. Thanks Frankster! awesome shots. Just wanted to say to those that think some of us are just nit pick crazy... LOL well like someone else said before me... most of us here are WWII Historians, enthusaists, reenactors and such... So Details do mean alot, sure sometimes our demands are crazy but its only because we want the best, and I have to say the entire Battlefront team does a pretty damg good job of making most everyone happy. So again.. my hats off to the BF team... Semper Fi. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mord Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Well, that's good news so I am hoping in that patch the gear stowage issue will also be addressed...give some variety to the vehicles. Mord. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Mord, I'd have to double check pics of the KTs that deployed in France, but IIRC there wasn't much on them. They were pretty spartan and factory fresh. Remember, these weren't tanks dragged back from the Eastern front... the crews had hardly even driven them by the time the Allies landed. But we are going to go back over this and make sure we didn't miss anything. As for the Lynx in QBs, they should be there. Both as Individual Vehicles and as Formations. But you have to be playing with Heer in an Armor type QB for them to be available. There were very few of these little buggers in Normandy. Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stingray Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Mord, As for the Lynx in QBs, they should be there. Both as Individual Vehicles and as Formations. But you have to be playing with Heer in an Armor type QB for them to be available. There were very few of these little buggers in Normandy. Steve What month do they appear? Last time I tried, I could not find the Lynx. I'll check again. Thanks 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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