Hyptherical Invasion of Iran OOB, opinions?

[Boche]

Well, ill deffinatelly look into it!

I suppose in your plan, since an advance from Iraq is out so is the one from Afghanistan, since it would entail IMO even bigger problems than an advance from Iraq.

In a seaborne invasion,where would you choose to land?

[LUCASWILLEN05]

Well, ill deffinatelly look into it!

I suppose in your plan, since an advance from Iraq is out so is the one from Afghanistan, since it would entail IMO even bigger problems than an advance from Iraq.

In a seaborne invasion,where would you choose to land?

You might be able to deploy light units out of Afghanistan as was done from Turkey in 2003. You might be able to do the same from Turkey into Iran. But for military and political reasons Turkey and Iraq could well be out. Light forces fro Afghanistan would soon link up with the Baluchistan forces so, assuming that nothing goes horribly wrong their supply problems would be short lived.

In terms of exactly which beach to use this may well depend on the nature of the beach itself. One within the Persian Gulf would be highly risky. An amphibious invasion force would have to pass through thr=e Straits of Hormuz and would be highly vulnerable to Silkworm missiles etc, Easily concealed in the Zagros mountains.

Therefore I would be looking for something on the Gulf of Oman coast. This would be more easily supported by carrier air support and the amphibious landing ships would have more sea room to manouvre. I would also want somewhere reasonably close to a magor port or two with a view to their early capture to build up the mechanized forces required for the next stage of the campaign, the breakout from the lodgement area and the capture of Tehran, Linking up with the light forces from Afganistan would be an early part of that.

[Boche]

Yeah,

I was planing on inserting infantry units from afghanistan early on when I started to plan. Independant brigades such as the 170th or 173rd Airborne (the one that invaded northern iraq 2003), and units from the,10th mountain, 82nd or 101st.

Thing is, what would be their objective? Could probably copy 2003s, Operation Nothern Delay, capturing certain strategic objectives and holding them, forcing Iranians to keep divisions north.

Could also copy the operation by capturing say, for example the Mashad airport, or one nearby, then airlifting in heavy armour.

Also Irans troops have trouble with Insurgents in the area, maybe make some preinvasion raids with joint Us spec ops/insurgent on Iranian bases and convoys.

As to you opinions on the sea invasion, its exactly what I was thinking. as I said before "I suppose the main port to go for would be Chah Bahar. Probably advance both north towards Zahedan and Bandar e Abbas and liberate that port for future supply"

[LUCASWILLEN05]

[i would like to use 82nd Airborne D Day style to drop behind the invasion beaches. By the way if Chah Bahar has decent nearby beaches and more sea room it might be the better option for the initial lodgement but with a view to cappturing an securig Bandar Abbas within the first 1 - 2 weeks and expanding the bridgehead north to link up with the Afgham thrust.

This I would want to do with 101st using its airmobile capability and the independent airborne brigades you mention. 10th Mountain might do a thrust out of Afghanistan to link up with the Airmobile/Airborne type. As previously discussed the mechanized forces would be pushing north to link up with the push out of Afghanistan. I would not start the Afghanistan operation until a couple of weeks into the operaation. We would not want a repeat of Market Garden!

Once the link up is achieved the 101st can be used to mount airmobile ops to seize key terrain ahead of the mechanized forces. The Airborne and 10th Mountain to be used to help secure terrain in the rear. Perhaps with support from the European corps' lighter elements.Initially this would be a diversionary operation

If there are Iranian insurgents work with them as SOE worked with the French Resistance during Julne - August 1944. Pretty much as you suggest. Maybe something similar could be achieved with special forces working out of Turkey as in 2003. Much more politically deniable and could work with any insurgents in that area. Again this would be a diversionary operation aimed at tying Iranian units down

Capture of places like Mashad Airport and flyng armour in might be an option but you cannot fly large numbers of tanks in. Might be too risky in the early phases of the operation though. But later on it could be a good option to plan for.

A good staging area where mechanized forces can mass for the Tehran phase would need to be secured. A pause might be needed once this area is secure to build up supplies, rest and regroup.

We also need to give consideration to planning for the final thrust to and capture of Tehran. Enveloping and beseiging the place might be the best option if the placeis strongly defended., Though the destruction of Iranian regular forces should be an objective of the earlier parts of the campaign. If, as in 2003 the regular forces are destroyed or melt away then a coup de main operation to take th city similar to the 2003 capture of Baghdad may be an option.

[Boche]

Everything sounds good cheers for all the input.

Also I shall be recieving my PC again tonight so Ill be able to start on making scenarios soon.

Plus I recieved my copy of "On Point: Us Army in Operation Iraqi Freedom", which should be helpfull in describing similar operations in Iraq, especially from the 101st, 82nd and Independant brigades.

more...tonight.

[Boche]

Lucaswillen, ive decided to go with your plan of a south invasion and im working on the first scenario now.

basically a rush from the first units off the ports to relieve an airborne battalion that landed a day ago in a village (Village of Joholou).

EDIT: I might scrap that and just got for a simple company attack. Still making the map so ill have time to decide.

[LUCASWILLEN05]

I like large maps and 2 - 4 hour length games for armoured battles. For a relief scenario something similar might be best depending on what the Iranians are doing at this oint in the campaign.

They could attempt a large armoured counter attack against the Marines. This gives us a magor tank battle or two. Possibly the Iranians get some of their own air/helicopter gunship support at this point. Less likely later in the campaign except the occasional small scale attempt if you are feeling genrous enough. We will still have to consider the effects of US air superiority at this stage nd it will fast become air supremacy.

Later I see the Iranians making a fighting withdrawl towards the north. A bit like Iraqi Freedom except the regular amy puts up more of a fight. The Basij militia meanwhile stay behind to launch insurgency style attacks on US/NATO convoys. US and NATO forces must detatch troops from the spearhead or reinforcements to protect the convoys required to supply the armoured push. Operations are also undertaken to hunt down the Basij, some of whom might establish bases in the Zagros Mountains and in the cities. Plenty of scenarios there for the insurgent types.

We can also have Basij Militia fighting alongside the regular army, particularlly near towns and cities. One interestin possibility would be to base a scenario something on the An Nasiryah bridge but with more effective army nits fighting with the insurgents. There are, I am sure, suitable river crossings for such a scenario in Iran along our selected route of advance. A "Bridge too far" style battle could be a possibility wiith a US/Airmobile unit inserted ahead of the main armoured advance being cut off and hasving to face Iranian armour and militiaon their own,

[Boche]

Hey there.

And sorry Lucas, Ive gone back to the invasion mainly coming from Iraq. As unfeasable as it might be I felt I could do better scenarios this way. Ive already completed a scenario and half way on another one. I will post some pics of the scenario on the next post.

As for tank battles, western Iran is ofcourse very mountanous but has a few plains here and there, deffinatelly plan on making some armour scenarios.

Iranians will have air support from Cobras in atelast 1 or 2 scenarios.

Thing is, Iranians have quite a respectable amount of MANPADS and Air defence systems so US and NATO air will always have to be weary of batteries hidden in the mountains and groups of enemy MANPADS here and their.

As I said before I plan on making an ambushed convoy scenario, but I like your idea of hunting basij bases in the mountains, ill write that one down thanks

I have, for example Basij fighting with Regular army in the first scenario and plan to do it often.

And as to your bridge idea, man we must have very similar minds. After looking at the Nasiriyah bridgle battle I to wanted to recreate a similar battle. Ive also managed to find a good bridge that is on my battalions route.

If you wish to have a look at the first scenario, you are welcome.

Cheers

(post pictures of scenario later on)

[Boche]

Scenario pics:

Real world location

[LUCASWILLEN05]

Fair enough. Without the ability to base in Iraq an invasion attempt would be much more difficult as previously discussed although we still have to assume supply lines through Trkey or Saudi Arabi. We can still have an amphibiousinvasion by the Marines followed up by some army mechanized divisions to link up with the Afghan thrust, outflank the Zagros range and divert Iranian forces.

As for tank battles these are more likely in the Marine sector as they face counter attacks early in the campaign, Also as NATO forces get closer to Tehran that is the probable point where the major tank battles could be expected. If your campaign extends that far you can still do a big tank battle or two to finish off your campaign maybe including Marine and/or European elents linking up with your units. I think magor tnk battles should use the largest possible maps. After the tank battles the final attack on Tehran would be a good way to end if you don't want to end with the tank battles

Nice looking maps by the way

[Boche]

Roger, if I ever expand the campaign ill make one with Marines/NATO in the south.

the present campaign will most likely face static tank defenses hidden in between the mountains.

I dont know if I will get to tehran, we will see.

and cheers on the map

[LUCASWILLEN05]

I just happen to like a big tank battle using a 4000 x 4000m map and was thinking a couple of those would be a great way to end your campaign, No problem with static defences but maybe you could do some smaller scale Iranian armoured counter attacks earlier in the campaign so the tankies have someting to do :-) During the final battles of course you get to face the best Iranian armour defending the approaches to Tehran even if you don't want to do a big city fight fot Tehran. But a southern campaign in the future would be great as would a campaign dealing with the thrust out of Afghanistan.

[Apocalypse 31]

To the original post....

2ID doesn't fight as a division. 2-2, 3-2, 4-2 are all Stryker Brigades under I CORPS

[Golf]

Hi, just discovered this thread.

The issue with invading from Iraq is the Zagros mountains will be near impossible to cross on the way to Tehran. This effectively prevented Saddam Hussein from advancing any further than he did back in 1980. The direct route from Afghanistan to Tehran would cross the Dasht-e Kavir which would not be practical. Looking at the map it would seem an amphibious invasion from the Gulf of Oman and then heading east of the Dasht-e Lut and south of the Dasht-e Kavir is about the only route to Tehran without crossing deserts or mountains. An invasion from Iraq I think would be most effective as a Blitzkrieg operation to secure the oil fields of Khuzestan although you could maybe push south to secure a port which would make landing in the Gulf of Oman easier ahead of the main offensive towards Tehran.

[LUCASWILLEN05]

Hi, just discovered this thread.

The issue with invading from Iraq is the Zagros mountains will be near impossible to cross on the way to Tehran. This effectively prevented Saddam Hussein from advancing any further than he did back in 1980. The direct route from Afghanistan to Tehran would cross the Dasht-e Kavir which would not be practical. Looking at the map it would seem an amphibious invasion from the Gulf of Oman and then heading east of the Dasht-e Lut and south of the Dasht-e Kavir is about the only route to Tehran without crossing deserts or mountains. An invasion from Iraq I think would be most effective as a Blitzkrieg operation to secure the oil fields of Khuzestan although you could maybe push south to secure a port which would make landing in the Gulf of Oman easier ahead of the main offensive towards Tehran.

This is very similar to my thoughts. The only way to tackle the Zagros and Dasht-e-Lut would be to use vertical envelopment by helicopter. The trouble with Iraq is that, to use this nation as a base you need agreement fro the Iraqi Government and either Turkey or Saudi Arabia to give you the required land supply lines. If this is not forthoming then the main invasion would have to be via the Gulf of Oman. Sea supply routes would not be a big problem for the use of a sea supply route as no likely combatant in this war could contest US naval dominence. Thre most Iran could do is contest the Persian Gulf and the Gulf of Oman.

[Boche]

Update on missions:

3rd mission done

Overview

Trench system with trees

Trench system without trees

Us advance route

Real life photo of location

[Praetori]

As both Georgia and Azerbaijan are US friendly wouldn't a push down along the coast of the Caspian Sea be the simplest route to Tehran?

Combined with a large amphibious operation from Bandar Abbas to split the country in half?

The problem with both Afghanistan and Iraq are the logistics side. The nations are too unstable to ensure sufficient supply for some 10+ divisions. Turkey although a NATO member would probably be VERY hard to sway unless they EU provides a signed and stamped membership into the union.

[Erik Springelkamp]

I don't think these nations would want to spoil their relations with Iran for the next century for some imperial crusade of the USA.

There are a lot of Turkish people - related to the Azeris - in the North West of Iran.