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GAGA Extrem

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Everything posted by GAGA Extrem

  1. Well, you can usually fire through the edges of light builings (guess it is because of the windows). However looking through the windows of a church 35m behind it, being able to identify a never before seen enemy completly, but being not able to shoot at him is... weird... At least for CM standards
  2. Was testing a few things in CMBB lately - hull down effects on weak turreted pannzer IV and so. While I was on that, two things occured to me: I played a bit around while testing armor sound contact detection and stepped over an interesting thing - which I would call a bug... I had some tanks moving towards a 100m thick forest in a winter battle. I got sound contact as usual, but when two of the tanks reached the edge of the forest, both were instantly spotted and fully identified, thought neither of them had LOS to each other. I thought this might be something like, "okay the commander looks out from top of the turret, so he can see tank, but the gunner can't target". But then I encountered the same problem in another scenario: 2 Panther were engageing each other (the scenario was called "high noon" ^^), one of the Panthers approached from the corner of a church. Though I had no LOS, again, the Panther was spotted at the very end of the corner and fully identified. I could even reverse the other Panther, even 45 meters away, it was completly identified... Here is a screen: The second thing that happened was a fire starting immideatly after a tank was partialy penetrated. How can that happen? Did the round pass through the tank and cause damage to the engine or something (it wasn't immobilized, though)? I can't think of any match were this has happened to me... Again, two screens, first: Translation: "front upper hull partial penetration - 1 casualty" The first one shows the Panzer IV, being penetrated by the shell from a T-34/76 M.43 (late). You might notice there are several tanks in the background, but they did not fire on this Panzer IV, rather his "friends" to the right and the left. I checked for missing shells from them, but none going even close to the tile. The second screen: Even before the hit text appears, the tile caught fire (exactly when the tank was hit and the penetration sound was played). Anyone else had this happen before? I know it from missing shells, explosions and so, but (partial) penetrating shells in the upper hull? Scary! Maybe even the optics can be hit - and we don't even notice it? ^_-
  3. As for me, I would like to make an interesting statement here... ...sorta ironic... ...because I know someone who disconvered the CM series (iirc it was cmbo) via 'the big bad donkey' and is now proud owner of original CMBO, CMBB and CMAK...
  4. Maybe its like the old CM Series and an enemy surrender still counts as all objectives (former known as "flags") are secured? [edit]Ah missed that Syrian thingy... ...maybe its a bug? :confused: ...however, finally surrendering might become useful! "I will loose my men, but not the objectives"
  5. Iirc, IS-3 comes @ 900% rarity - but if you should get one of those beasts - only the 125mm gun can scare you...
  6. Another thing i have to add: It looks like the IS2 actually CAN penetrate a hetzer in a slooped position. I have even had some results were a non fatal HE hit ("front upper hull hit - no serious damage") resulted in a KO state! (Translation: Front upper hull hit - no serious damage) So the following tanks can kill a Hetzer in a sloped position: IS-2, ISU-152, SU-100 So it looks like that CMBB does take shell diameter into account - though limited. The ISU-152 can penetrate the Hetzers upper hull with HE ammo - which usually leaves an exploding Hetzer behind, so does the IS2. Even the ISU-122 tries HE shells, though they seem to have no effect. [ July 01, 2007, 05:04 AM: Message edited by: GAGA Extrem ]
  7. I vote for selling german equipment to them... ...so we can disarm parts of our army and Schäuble can stop his endless "Bundeswehr for inner safety" requests... *laughs and runs away* "Ihihihihihi..." @Battlefront.com: Ahhh finally I understand why poor Syrians will be in the spotlights of CMSF
  8. Well, I am back... I have played around a bit and found out, that the T-70 turret also seems to be curved vertically. I have made 10 test runs, Panzer IV H vs T-70 M.43 @ 250m - and the T-70 won 7:3 (using his 4 special ammo rounds). Though the displayed kill chance was "none" when the tank was positioned properly near the hilltop, the T-70 could still be knocked out by upper hull hits (even HE ammo)*. However, all turret shots from the Panzer IV were deflected - and even 88mm ap from a Tiger in another test. So the T-70 is not invulnerable in this sloped position, but it becomes a good challenge for teh enemies Panzer III, IV and even the StuG series, considering the cheap costs (around 45 iirc?)... * edit: In another test run, the Panzer IV was set off a bit to the left, so the T-70 rotated a bit to the left and was shot 20 times with no upper hull hit - I doubt this was a lucky coincidence, so it might be able to render him immune to ~88mm caliber fire... [ June 30, 2007, 09:09 AM: Message edited by: GAGA Extrem ]
  9. Yes, you can fire for 15 minutes and hope to get a track or gun hit, so they abandon the vehicle. You can also mass your guns against him, so the crew will abandon him. But kill chance 'none' for the Hetzer means none in this position. You can make them abandon but you cannot 'kill' him. (Though the difference is probably only important for operation maps...) But I have made about 100 test runs - and except for very high caliber HE, there was nothing that killed (=destroyed) even a single Hetzer in this position. Granted, you can try from a higher elevation so the bonus is negated, but that's probably not what you mean
  10. Now you speak of it... ...have an old pic about that... ...here you go:
  11. Hm, none I guess... ...didn't mean to insult the poor StuGs... ...sry... *hugs the gunbarrel*
  12. So the early Pz IV models are somthink like an extremly bad stug? Any use for them then?
  13. Welcome to the historic war shopping channel. And here are your hosts for today, Frank and George. Frank: "Hi all!" George: "Hello folks." Frank: "So George, what do you have for us today?" George: "Well, Frank, you probably know the problem, its around mid 44 to early 45 and your enemy is buying the big gun stuf, IS2, Fireflies, (I)SU tankhunters, all the big badass stuff that keeps blowing your Tigers and Panthers up." Frank: "Oh yes George, sure. And even my StuGs, shimmering stars of the early years are chewed up by them. It's a shame." George: "Well, Frank, that's why I am here today. Let me promote something that ends all your problems." Frank: "Oh, you are probably talking about the Kingtiger and Jagdtiger, George." George: "No my friend, there is something even better." Frank: "But that is quite costly isn't it?" George: "Not at all Frank! Well, let me present you..." *Sting* Frank: "But George, that's a Hetzer..." George: "Yep Frank, this is a Hetzer, the solution of all your problems." Frank: "But he has only 60mm front armor. Thats even less than a StuG..." George: "Well, you are right, the Hetzer has only 60mm front armor. But he is curved." Frank: "So are my Panthers - but they have much better turret armor and still even a T-34/85 can penetrate them." Geirge: "Well Frank, I think you are missing something here. Your Panthers armor is curved horizontal, while the Hetzer is curved vertical." Frank: "Okay, but the T-34/85 can easily go through the Hetzers front armor, George." George: "And that's exactly were its getting tricky." Frank: "George, now, comon, don't tell me you know a secret about the Hetzer we don't know?" George: "Well, I guess some of you know, but not all. So, Frank, while I am going to build up my stuff here, how about a short commercial for our audience?" Frank: "Okay George, coming up. Well, folks, see you later!" *your ad here* *your ad here* *even more of your ads here* Frank: "Thanks for staying tuned folks, lets get back to George and his Hetzer." Frank: "So George... You just have made a little hill over here. That is your secret?" George: "Yes Frank. But let me explain it. As I said, the Hetzer's armor is curved vertical. Combat Mission considers terrain elevation when computing shots. Now we drive our Hetzer up the hill, so that only his upper hull and gun are pointing over the top. Let me show it to you." Frank: "Okay George, now your Hetzer is in a hull down position, but, seriously..." George: "Ah, Frank, you don't trust me?" Frank: "Well, you know..." George: "But no problem, look over there, I have brought some tanks with me... A T-34/85, an ISU-122 and an IS2. Get in and try if you can get my Hetzer." Frank: "You are kidding me, George, right?" George: "No Frank, get in, they have AP ammo loaded. Fire a few rounds." Frank: "Okay George, it's your Hetzer being messed up not mine..." *gunfire sound from the offstage* *more gunfire* *quite a lot of gunfire!* George: "So, while Frank is busy trying to shoot my Hetzer, let me show you how big his chances are. Don't mind the language, I am using a german version, I will translate for you." George: "See the fourth line? 'Zerstören: keine' this means: 'kill chance: none'. So our poor Frank can try to shoot all day long, he won't be able to penetrate my Hetzer. Ah, I think he finally gave up. Welcome back Frank!" Frank: "George, what is this? I fired about a hundred shells at your Hetzer, but all I did was scrapping the paint off." George: "Well Frank, remember what I said about the curved armor? Its curved vertical, so if we bring up the Hetzer to such a slope, his curved armor is getting a huge defence boost." Frank: "So that means, if I can get my Hetzer in a position like that, neither T-34/85, nor an IS2 or an ISU-122 can destroy him?" George: "Actually, he is immune to all but the russian SU-100, the 100mm/L54 and occasional destructions by extreme big HE shells." Frank: "Amazing George, but that's probably doesn't work for CMAK..:" George: "Frankly (sorry for the wordplay Frank), if you believe it or not, yes, it is working for CMAK. Not even the latest british tanks with the new 76.2mm/L55 and APDS ammo can get through our Hetzer's front armor. The only gun capable to kill him is the american 90mm/L50 AA gun - which you will almost never encounter." Frank: "Amazing!" George: "Yes Frank and the best thing: You can get the Hetzer for about 100 points." Frank: "Fantasic George, now, if you excuse me, I am going to buy some platoons of Hetzers for my next game..." George: "Oh Frank, please, please, wait a second." Frank: "So there is still somethink you want to tell me?" George: "Yes Frank, you know, what i have shown you is a rather perfect placement for your Hetzer. In a real battle, you do not get so many good slopes for a Hetzer - best ones have 2 high levels difference - and even less of them offer your Hetzer a good firing position. So don't buy Hetzer's like a mad (one could say... 'GAGA') guy. Just consider this as a good hint that may come useful some day." Frank: "I surely will, George. Well, thank you very, very much for you explanation. Hope to see you soon again on the historic war shopping channcel!" George: "Bye folks." Frank: "See you later, alligator!" PS: Sry for the bad english ^^; [ June 22, 2007, 11:59 AM: Message edited by: GAGA Extrem ]
  14. The 75mm/L24 must be a terrible gun... ...or why does my CMBB show for any Panzer IV from C to F model such a terrible accuracy despite having a good gunsight? Even the T-34 has about double hit chances percentage on longer range... First I thought, it might be that the gunsight bonuses are not shown correctly, but... ...I did 8 test runs from 1000 to 2000 meters - it was devastating. If the Panzer IV did not retreat, they were chewed up by the T-34/M40. Yes, M40, not even a "decent" T-34 model... The russian ground was full of craters from missing german shells, about twice as much than on the german site (so it was not the ROF)... Can anyone exlpain this to me?
  15. Well, as for me, i believe a unit that is hit from the side is much more likely to go prone. And from the back its even worse. I have had a few "situations" were my poor fellows were moving and an enemy manged to maneuver behind them. I can remember at least 3 times, were the unit was routed after the first salve from the back. Okay, it were some SMG from distance ~30m, but my boys were advancing in a light building! I guess it is depending if the unit is moving or not. If it is stationary, it will rotate towards the enemy. But now imagine a dozen men are running over a field and suddenly someone fires from the back... I will do a few test runs to be sure, but i am certain, yes, flanking and back shots deliever much more distress . and maybe even higher casulties - as frontal combat. As for the surrendering, imho its more important that the attack gets between the enemy and his friendly map edge. Maybe units are more likely to surrender when someone is behind them, but in general, firepower, envelopement (thats were backshots belong to) , low ammo, low morale and low experience and being out-of-command are all important for this. Edit: In my test, Inf in open ground was shot from palmes ~40m away. I made a setup for every experience level. From the front, the first salvo did often "only" pinn them, however from the back, they were panicked (or even broken / routed) in about 80% of the first salvo. Even elite infantry broke often after the second or third salvo from an unknown enemy from behind... Interesting: Quite a lot units surrendered when they were shot from the front AND the back. Mostly it were VET+ boys, 5 times even the elite squads threw their weapons away, still having 5 or 6 men! [ April 15, 2007, 01:38 PM: Message edited by: GAGA Extrem ]
  16. Of course there are some ways to "cheat" in combat mission. One way: There is a way to "hack" the game, so you can buy units for 0 point costs. However, that is only useful for larger battles, because if you play a 1000 point combined arms ME and he comes up with 2 Tiger, that would be... suspicious... Second way: Just yesterday a friend reported this to me. He was wondering why he was loosing 3 battles against the same enemy so badly. E.g. he lost 3 50mm PaK and 6 Panzerschrecks to conscript T-34s always with their first shots. Finally he found out that his enemy was able to "see" (in the PBEM file) when his tanks would hit or be hit (and when not), so he just let his machine compute the same PBEM file several times and sent back the one were he destroyed the AT gun. Unforunatly, his enemy made the mistake to (accidentally) sent 3 computed files of the same round via email to him... Well I guess he will only play TCP/IP for a while... I am sure there are more ways to cheat - wasn't there someone who complained about walking dead infantry squads some time ago? ...but thanks god this is not a FPS 16-year-old-kiddy community, so you will rarely - if ever - encounter cheaters in the CM series... As for me, I never have. I was just owned by pure tactical skill. (Like said in the post above ) [ April 15, 2007, 12:00 AM: Message edited by: GAGA Extrem ]
  17. Indeed, it does... ...but it (mostly) goes head-to-head with the enemy tank and then you loose the 15° benefit. However, I guess there are ways to prevent this. Maybe a movement order with 60sec delay can help to keep the hull direction for a whole turn. An interesting thing would be if experienced crews go on "Mahlzeit" orientation - I think I have seen this a few times - but might also have been when the tank tried to rotate its side armor away from the enemy...
  18. Hello, John. I am not new to the board (have been here since May 2004), but haven't looked into the board for about a year. Well, what i was trying to make clear with my post is: the "Mahlzeit" armor positioning is simulated in CMBB / CMAK - and you can get some nice bonuses from it, if you rotate your tanks in ~15° direction to the enemy... ...The big code body contains the information from my testrow: 100 shots from a T-34 M.43 (late) vs a Pz. III Ausf.M with detailed shot record. The first is 0° head-to-head, the 2nd 15° offset. The point: I was aware about the real historic side of the "Mahlzeit" (dunno how it is called in general, sry...) effect, but wondered if there is an in-game effect simulated somewere. Dunno if teh ingame effects are common knowledge around here, but... ...better one post too much about it, then never let anyone know... Btw: Sry for the bad english (foreign language ) edit: going to add some things to the 1st post to prevent further misunderstandings
  19. I was wondering about "Mahlzeit" armor coverage simulation in the CM series, but did not really find something useful about it, so i did a small test row with CMBB... ...the result was interesting: While your enemy is firing from about 15° at your tank, your survive chance will increase significant! In the below case of almost equal penetration / armor ratio (T-34 vs Pz III M, 100 shots), the deadly hit chance drops from 19% to 12% (Thats a -35% total!), while the hit chance for your enemy doesent seem to increase (still not completly sure since it were only 100 shots...), the number of riochets increased from 21 to 39 (about 33%, most of them would have been partial penetrations in a face-to-face combat), partial penetrations were reduced by 40% (from 44 to 26), Crew hits (due to flaking, part. penetrations etc) dropped from 28 to 21 (as hit ratio, not really clear numbers right now). This should work for front AND rear of vehicles (in the above mentioned 15° offset), though I expect the effect will be less significant if you fight with high penetration numbers, uncurved turrets and so on. But it seems quite useful for even tank battles in 41/42 with the Pz. III/IV/StuG and T-34 series... ...however, i havent found out any tactic to keep my tanks in a constant 15° postion. Maybe delayed move/reverse/hunt or arc commands can help... Maybe i will do some additional research to this (if it hasnt been done somewhere else yet)... </font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">ID #001a subject armor penetration by degree (horizontal) date 03/02/07 objects T-34 M.43 (late) (ap only) Pz. III Ausf. M (no ammo) distance 200m angle 0° hit chance 76% real hit 78% kill chance low real kill 19% hit: m h r sbu pp p pwp miss hit riochet shell broke up partial penetration penetration penetration at weak point total 22 5 21 0 44 8 0 zone: FT FUH FLH ST SUH SLH T G front turret front upper hull front lower hull side turret side upper hull side lower hull track gun total 21 46 6 0 0 0 3 2 effect: n nsd f c# i a k e b d none no serious damage flaking crew hit(count) immobile abandoned knocked out exploding burning gun damaged total 0 23 19 28 5 9 10 0 1 1 shot count: hit zone effect (crew) effect effect (status) 1 pp FUH c1 2 pp FUH c2 k 3 pp FUH nsd 4 pp FUH c2 k 5 pp FUH c1 6 r FT c1 f 7 h T i 8 r FT f 9 r FT f 10 m 11 m 12 m 13 pp FUH c1 14 r FT 15 pp FUH c2 b k 16 r FUH f 17 pp FT c2 k 18 h T i 19 pp FUH c2 a 20 pp FUH nsd 21 pp FUH nsd 22 pp FT c2 a 23 r FT f 24 r FUH f 25 m 26 pp FUH c1 a 27 pp FUH nsd 28 pp FUH nsd 29 h G nsd 30 pp FUH c1 31 r FT f 32 pp FUH c1 a 33 m 34 pp FUH nsd 35 pp FUH nsd 36 pp FT nsd 37 r FT f 38 pp FUH nsd 39 m 40 pp FUH 41 pp FUH c1 42 p FLH c1 43 r FT f 44 r FUH f 45 pp FUH nsd 46 pp FT c2 a 47 pp FUH c1 48 r FUH f 49 m 50 pp FUH nsd 51 pp FUH nsd 52 pp FT c2 k 53 r FUH f 54 r FUH 55 p FLH c2 k 56 pp FUH nsd 57 m 58 p FLH c3 i a 59 pp FT c1 a 60 r FT f 61 r FUH f 62 pp FUH nsd 63 m 64 r FUH f 65 pp FUH nsd 66 pp FUH c1 67 pp FT nsd 68 m 69 m 70 r FUH f 71 m 72 m 73 r FT f 74 pp FUH c3 a 75 pp FT nsd 76 m 77 m 78 m 79 pp FT nsd 80 pp FT c1 81 pp FUH nsd 82 p FUH c1 83 m 84 h T i 85 m 86 pp FUH i a 87 pp FUH c1 k 88 p FLH nsd 89 pp FUH nsd 90 m 91 m 92 r FUH f 93 h G d 94 p FT c1 k 95 m 96 p FLH c3 k 97 p FLH k 98 pp FUH nsd 99 r FUH f 100 m </pre>
  20. Err, the match was already over when i posted this. I lost 25%-75% w/ auto-surrender, but i was very unfortunate: -> A complete Platoon Pz Grens. annihilated by above mentioned house leaving. Sucks... -> 4 Flamethrowers KOd with one single salvo. And they were at least 15m away from each other... -> My Komp HQs were Cons without any skills, also 2 of my platoon HQs... grr... -> In addition, the big vicflag was placed in a 'backyard', sourrounded by houses, so i had no real chance to get him at high range -> He had speed superiority. He had T-34 to transport a platoon of SMGs AND he had a road while i had to crawl through open ground. In addition, it was raining and grpund condition wet, thx god no vehicle bogged... Oh, yes it was a ME, 1500 Points, random map, big city, Aug 42 Anyway, an enjoyable match with a lot off demo packing and collapsing houses 8] [ January 07, 2006, 05:24 AM: Message edited by: GAGA Extrem ]
  21. Well, i was messed up pretty bad in my last city fight. I turned up with 2 Companies of green German Pz Pios and 1 Platoon of Vet. Pz Grens (incl. 4 HTs) against 1 Kompanie crack russian MPs and 1 Komp Pios (vet). In addtion i had 2 vet Pz IIIJ, he had 2 T.34, 1 KV1, 1 BA-64 and 1 T-26s. So my question is - how could I have killed these wacky MPs? I tried blowing up the buildings, but had little success, since his MPs nailed my men pretty fast. In addition I lost my whole Pz Gren taskforce, because the entered a damaged building. After the first gren, the building turned up heavily damaged, and my men ran right in front of an enemy MP squad and died within seconds. Nasty...
  22. Now the word has fallen: How about a mod turning all snowy winter trees to 'christmas trees'?
  23. Yes! There's indeed nothing as scary as a single american star icon during dusk... Will be a pleasure [edit]grammar *splut*
  24. Maybe i got this wrong, but doesn't give 'human wave' a noticeable morale boost? Thus, if i want to assault an enemy position, aren't they more likely to get there and not just sneak back to cover?
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