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Once you've lost half the RN, it's almost game over against an experienced Axis player. Italian navy plus german subs will make Sealion a sure thing. Keep your navy together as often as possible, they are much stronger that way.
The central and eastern med are hopeless to defend, so withdraw the RN from egypt ASAP. Just after France falls, there's a large chance that the Axis will invade Vichy. Put a fleet around Gibraltar. They should have high supply leftover from the western ports of france, and can wreak any italian adventure that strays too far west. Watchout for the LW in Sicily, they'll make you pay in Carrier chits and BB's, so be cautious in this area!
Other than that, your RN should be patrolling the Atlantic for subs and such, and make sure that the route is free once the US comes in. Since 90% of all Axis players attack Spain, you probably won't be able to re-enter the med later on. Use your fleet wisely after this. Often, Axis air (+ bombers) wait off the coast of france for a chance to blow away your ships. Don't let that happen. Be patient, and wait for DDAY. Even with the Italian fleet at bordeaux (or brest), your (mostly intact hopefully) RN+USN should be able to block the naval attacks against your transports. Think of it as an All-or-nothing scenario.
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Once you've lost half the RN, it's almost game over against an experienced Axis player. Italian navy plus german subs will make Sealion a sure thing. Keep your navy together as often as possible, they are much stronger that way.
The central and eastern med are hopeless to defend, so withdraw the RN from egypt ASAP. Just after France falls, there's a large chance that the Axis will invade Vichy. Put a fleet around Gibraltar. They should have high supply leftover from the western ports of france, and can wreak any italian adventure that strays too far west. Watchout for the LW in Sicily, they'll make you pay in Carrier chits and BB's, so be cautious in this area!
Other than that, your RN should be patrolling the Atlantic for subs and such, and make sure that the route is free once the US comes in. Since 90% of all Axis players attack Spain, you probably won't be able to re-enter the med later on. Use your fleet wisely after this. Often, Axis air (+ bombers) wait off the coast of france for a chance to blow away your ships. Don't let that happen. Be patient, and wait for DDAY. Even with the Italian fleet at bordeaux (or brest), your (mostly intact hopefully) RN+USN should be able to block the naval attacks against your transports. Think of it as an All-or-nothing scenario.
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Terif doesn't make mistakes because he knows this game by heart. He's definitely smart, but the game definitely has a 'finite' amount of 'good' moves. There are relatively only a few 'successful' strategies that veteran players (should) use against each other. He knows all of these, and probably then some.
He might also record your unit builds every turn, with pencil-paper/notepad. That way, he knows where real threats might come from, and not the imagined threats that the rest of us get paranoid about.
He IS patient. He thinks before he moves so he doesn't have any 'DOH!'s. He just doesn't make blatant mistakes. This does not mean, however, that he doesn't make ANY mistakes. But those mistakes are harder to 'see' because they might be long-term mistakes. He knows this too.
All this makes him nigh-invincible, and not just 'good'. To beat him, you have to THINK like him, almost EXACTLY like him. If Terif plays against himself, it's a 50/50 chance no?
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I can't believe I'm back here, but I am.... the urge to play SC isn't going away, in fact, as SC2 approaches, I getting that 'nostalgiac' feeling for SC. You know, the feeling we all get after 3+ months of SC withdrawal. Anyways, I'll be around on ICQ for anyone looking for a game. Looking for a game vs any self-proclaimed top-player... notably Terif, John J, Zapp, Dragon, etc...
Also, if anybody is into Korsun Pocket or GG's War in Russia, let me know, i'm really up for a PPEM game. Battles in Normandy (matrix/ssg) looks very very good too. Along with SC2, it's going to be a top-priority purchase in 2004-early 05.
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SoDak, you obviously know little of military history and are an amateur at best. You contend to know everything about the German Army (and Allied Armies), but have written little to show for it. You've probably read a book or two at most, and probably got whatever you know about the subject from annectodal information on the history channel. Not to brag, but I've read every major book on the subject, read dozens of manuals from every major participant of WW2, not to mention a few dozen documentaries.
First things first, the belief that the German Army had developed some 'revolutionary' type of warfare on the outset of WW2 is total nonsense. This was Allied propaganda from the beginning as a reason for 'why' Poland, Denmark, Norway, France, etc... fell. They couldn't understand why the germans had done so well and so fast. The REASON is simple and complex: THERE WAS NO SINGLE REASON.
German Army doctrine was formulated long before even WW1. It wasn't the Tank, the Airplane or Radar that changed war, it was the TRAIN and the TELEGRAPH. The US Civil war was the first war to ever fully utilize these new technologies to the fullest, and 'total war' was the outcome. Clausewitz wrote much about this subject. The Germans won the first 2 years of the war with little bloodshed through a variety of factors, a few of which I will state here:
- Initiative: Germany invaded Poland. Germany invaded Denmark. Germany invaded Norway. Germany invaded France. Germany invaded Russia. Almost ALL their early war victories were based on complete/partial suprise on the part of the defenders.
- Luck: Germany got lucky in quite a few instances during the war, the earliest of which was the breakthru in the Ardennes in '40. They also could have easily lost in Norway if the Franco-British expedition had left earlier than it had and/or was stronger than that of which was sent. The attack on Russia was a complete suprise to Stalin in spite of information from quite the variety of sources that indicated to him that Germany would attack. Lucky. Very lucky indeed. Of course, they did have their share of bad luck as well. But overall, early in the war, luck had definitely favoured them.
- Superior Army Doctrine/Training:
Last but not least, the Germans held the advantage in ALMOST every category of a modern army. Although they lacked numbers and armaments, german training was second to none. It began from lessons in WW1 (They almost whipped the Allies in 1918, but failed on the Marne due to their exhausted/overextended supply system), and continued into the Weimar Republic with the REICHSWEHR. This 100,000 man army knew it's numbers were small, so they made up for this by taking only the best/smartest men, and training them into an elite force. Those in the Reichswehr eventually rose to take control of the Wehrmacht in terms of officers. Their professionality was unparalled, and undoubtedly led to the many successes that the Wehrmacht enjoyed in its campaigns.
And SoDak, don't believe the US Military took any of the Wehrmachts tactics into it's own books? Wrong again. The US hired/forced many ex-Nazi Generals into writing pamphlets (translated later of course) on their experiences against the USSR. The USA needed to know the best ways to combat the USSR should war between the superpowers come. By and large, almost every American general agreed that superior German leadership (not at the top top tho) had allowed them to avoid disaster multiple times when confronting vastly superior (number-wise) Soviet troops. This vast collection of pamphlets and documents were collected and published in some of the most renown US military books, and are still used today. Goodbye. Oh, and by the way, try writing something more constructive than your one-two liners. They're boring and bring nothing to the conversation. However, maybe you're just being the antagonist here and want some attention. I think that's it huh?
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Alright, how about Sunday night? I'm GMT -5, you're +1, so it's 6 hours difference. You get on ICQ at 11, i'll be there at 5. As well, you don't have to play if you're strapped for time, or no longer hold interest, BUT I do intend to give you a good game, even if it does not matter towards Ryder. Let me know.
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Dragonheart, where are you? We need to play our game. Ours is critical, because it will determine that the 2 best NA's are better than the 2 best Euro's
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My guess to the amount of cheaters on this board? Close to zero, possibly 1. I'll admit to cheating on my first PBEM game. I realized that if you simply save over your original game, you could use the FOW sniffer (never realized for TCP/IP tho) and simply wait for the best turn. It's boring, it's a non-challenge, and it douses the satisfaction i'm going to feel if I win a game. I truly don't think anyone, ANYONE on this site has cheated (regularly?) with the method Rambo described. Your fears are groundless. We aren't playing for MONEY people. There is zero, absolutely ZERO reason for this tourney to be canceled.
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invasion of Sweden begins...
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Game has resumed! It was too good this game, Zapp just had to come out of retirement for this one.
July 42: Battle of Spain in doubt for Allies. 1 Italian army killed last turn, but American air knocked out this turn. Eisenhower taken a beating too. Russian's are strengthening up for another big push across into southern poland.
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I'm in, sign me up
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Truly amazing job guys. You put the rest of the AAR's to shame. Rambo's right, you guys should be on the History Channel. I think they're hiring....
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My summary of events:
- Lost 80-90% of navy, US and UK
- Small US/UK air force
- US has AT3 also, and fighting like a bitch in Spain. Have a feeling LW is weak weak.
- Russia on full offensive gear. Not 1 russian city fallen yet, and pushing soon into Polish border. 5 german armies destroyed in 3 turns. Russian losses just as heavy, but his armies cost more. Red Airforce very strong and LVL2 jets.
If either Spain holds out with American aid (at least for awhile), and/or Russia keeps the heat on, Axis will lose for sure. If Spain falls soon, Russia will be in a very tough position.
Super game tho. wish i didn't throw away the RN so soon though, would be really key right now
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Nice AAR Zapp, you do a good job
June 41, Brits praying island won't be invaded, very little military resources left except tank on London, and corps around manchester. London Harbor under constant attack. Malta, Egypt taken..
Vichy however, has not been attacked, neither Spain. We'll see what happens once USSR is in.
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May 40: Line hasn't moved after earlier territory losses. square SW of Brussels occupied by corp. So far, 2 German Armies, 1 Pz, 2 Corps destroyed.
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Allies Turn 2:
LC falls previous turn, Denmark holds out, but is reduced to 4. British corp lands on Denmark, cuts off Germans assault on Copenhagen. Poland decides to go down fighting and attacks with the remainder of their forces around warsaw.
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Big AAR here. I'm #1 in World League for some reason. Why the hell isn't Dragon #1? Anyways, Zapp is challenging me here for my supremacy. We'll see about that....
I'm Allies (as usual. Axis is too easy, no fun)
[ May 05, 2004, 07:26 PM: Message edited by: Avatar ]
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Read what Terif writes. He speaks the truth. More importantly, I'm speaking the truth by saying I don't cheat, and never have. Can't stoop that low. No, no, I really just do play aggressively in France. I've played overly aggressive in the past, and lost my fair share, believe me. Rambo's diced me more times than i can know.
Anyways, my secret Liam? A new allied strategy. it worked, didn't it?
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April 40. Line still not budging on LC border. 1 army, 2 corp destroyed so far. Fr Fighter suffered many losses. Fleet coming back to LC coastline
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Poland survives Turn 2. Axis sub attacked BB from Anterp Harbor... French Fighter making life annoying for LW. Fr HQ also in the works. got suprised by german sub... BB damaged in NA. 2 attacks failed as sub dove
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DoW on Ireland. Hunting the subs.
Poland struggles on to possibly turn 3 this time??
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USSR has been at war 3 turns now. Got Lvl 1 Jet, but losing in the north. Axis very strong there, and a panzer managed to breakthru and kill my air. not good. Suprisingly, Egypt is still holding out with aid of british air. Luftwaffe making attacks, but at what cost? On western Front, Allied air, mostly US is damaging the mine in france
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It's July, Axis about to capture Paris next turn (maybe). RAF looking strong with 3 units and Monty. Carriers have each taken a hit, but destroyed german army.
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Straightening the Front. Ardennes Forest was lost. Will early Irish plunder help? No one knows, except me, and yes, it does help.
Broken Allied Strategy, 100% certified
in Strategic Command 1
Posted
Well, I guess I need Terif to give the final stamp on this, but I will give those who wish to try it the complete strategy. It is indeed broken, there is no hope for the Axis to capture Paris before 1941 with this strat. 100%, no joke. I've tested it 10 times, there is absolutely nothing the axis can do. I invite you to test this out in hotseat against yourself, or against anyone else. This is assuming you give yourself the 200 bid points as UK. You need those points to pull this off. Perhaps not, but everything i did is with these extra pts.
Turn 1, Axis:
Polish Breakthru, ping Denmark down to five, move over regular forces to invade LC (1 arm, 1 army, 3 air, 2 corps, of course) note: very standard opening for axis
Turn 2, Allies:
Invade LC. Transport UK corps, ping Brussels. Attack Brussels from S hex with Fr Army. Move Corps (or army) into LC forest hex. Move Fr Army into hex SE of Brussels. Do not attack with this army unless you've actually got a really good chance of capturing Brussels (all my games i don't even capture LC).
Operate egypt corp next to Beirut. The following turn, move towards iraq, but don't declare war until the following turn. Italy won't be in the war until 3rd axis turn (turn 6).
Disband Fr Air, buy 2 Corps
Do not disband any fr navy. Use 1-2 cruisers to help RN to hunt atlantic subs. Move the rest of the Atlantic fleet towards east med. I prefer at least 1 fr cruiser and BB. I also move in an extra RN BB and CL to help out. Move Marseilles BB into west Med, join up with Egypt RN east Malta.
Move the Air on Malta S of London. Move Main Air on UK to London. Disband Bomber, Disband any BB (your choice, you NEED the cash). Buy Monty, put him around London. These 2 Air will intercept first LW attacks on your Fr Army SE of Brussels. Actually, these 2 RAF units are the secret 'key' to this strategy. You wouldn't believe how much damage they cause over the long run to the LW. With Iraq oil, UK can reinforce and, more often than not, still have money for a corp purchase.
Move Algiers corp to Marseilles on the 1st turn by using Gibraltar BB to allow it to move there in one move. Move Gibraltar to Marseilles, on 2nd turn, move the fr corp N 1 hex, move the UK corps to replace it. This provides 2/3rds of the barrier against Italy. You'll need to buy another corp the turn after Italy comes in to cover the hole of course.
Move the Canadian units (go Canada!) to France.
Turn 3, Axis
Axis will 100% (why wouldn't he?) try to destroy Fr Army SE of Brussels. He has around 70% of doing so. It surviving simply buys the allies another turn. His Air will attack it, your UK air will intercept and cause full damage. If he succeeds and destroys it, he'll move in. Poland could/should fall, along with Denmark on this turn. Any extra time that they survive is extra time for the allies.
Turn 4, Allies
Get ready to invade Iraq. Move your fleets in the med if they aren't there already. These fleets are the noose around Italy's neck. If he doesn't move his fleets out of base, he's not a threat, therefore germany's doing the brunt of the work, and Iraq won't be threatened, so you can get your oil
, plus you won't lose Malta, Algiers, Gibr, Alexandria etc... In all of my games, I had around 8-10 units in the Med against Italy's 5. It's a one-way battle without the LW.
Of course, this turn, and the following ones, all you're going to do as France and UK is build corps, and put 'em in line near Brussels. With the 2 UK Air causing much unhappiness among the LW pilots, you'll find that the Wehrmachts offensive (ala Terif) is not such a steamroller. You're getting twice as much money as Germany, and can put 1-2 corps in line, while germany is fighting a narrow front, forced to use precious air against a tough RAF. He has to fight hex by hex, and the time taken to do so is incredible. The earliest I beat myself was January 41, after taking a ent. 6 Fr Army out of paris, and every hex between LC and paris was with a corps.
There's no hope, there's no 'alternative' strategy for the axis, there's nothing. Axis only gets plunder for Pol and Den. He's choked from the very start, and Italy's early entry doesn't do anything.
The only thing i haven't tried is a full invasion from the south, with LW and all. I haven't tried it because it seems like an even worse proposition than the north.
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ps: terif, if you think you can prove me wrong, let me know
ps #2: i moved to germany 2 months ago (g/f), nice place. it's not quite canada, no bacon (only uncut 'speck'), tabacco sold in vending machines on the street(i saw 2 10 yr olds buying), and tv here is NOT up to my standards.
[ August 01, 2004, 03:06 PM: Message edited by: Avatar ]