Nightshade

Good point, but I tend to use only E/F1 for Eastern front 1941.

They did.

It does occur to me that since the jump from F to F1 is fairly well documented as they are short and long guns, the jump to G is fairly irrelevant since it is only a marginal up armouring and the jump to h again is only really a 'tweak' to the gun it is perhaps not worth worrying about. The earlier and later changes are pretty irrelevant as far as the Eastern front is concerned. Contributions appreciated

My best guess is worked out as follows. There are around 625 38(t) serving in Panzer divisions in 1941. 455 of those build are model A-D and were completed by November 1940. Some were in service with allies (mostly Slovakia) and some must have been lost pre 1941 (I have no figures for this, anyone ?) If we assume that accounts for 155 that leaves possibly 300 A-D in 1941. The other 325 must be E or F. This is further supported by the fact that the 275 E's produced were all completed by January 1941 and of the 250 F's built between Nov '40 and Oct '41 many would have been available by June '41. Still doesn't answer which division's have which as I would like but it is a start. I would imagine 7th may have the better vehicles as it is the more pampered of the bunch and is noted to be Vetran. Possibly 8th too as another of the old Divisions, but there is a fair argument for the newly equiped to have had the best kit, given that supply officers didn't seem to care what they sent where.

I'm looking at this with a view to historicaly accurate wargames. I have tried looking at it from the point of view of production dates and there are plenty of problems with looking doing this. For example Most sources particularly wargames rules seem to be under the impression that in mid '41 the 50mm PZ III are all late F and G at total production run of 700 tanks, basically same as the earlier 37mm armed tanks with the bigger gun. however the last of the 308 H's was completed in April '41 so where are they in 1941 ? must be in someone's Division and they were up-armoured. Furthermore the Early J's started production in March '41 and they were produced a lot quicker over 150 a month so maybe up to 600 of those available in June. The whole issue is futher complicated by the fact that from August 1940 all of the 37mm and early 50mm were progressively up armoured and up gunned when sent back for repairs. I don't imagine for one momment this can be tracked accurately but it ought to be possible to arrive at some uniform decision as to what proportions of which tank were around at a given time.

Thanks Redmow. I have all that info, looks like I need Panzer Truppen.

panzer truppen is looking a good bet, cheers chaps.

Thanks chaps, but I got all that. I need to know which mark/ausf went where :confused:

Sorry, typo - I meant 35(t) for 6th Panzer, they were the only users. Also 20th Panzer still had a few 38(t)in 1943 and I believe 9th panzer still had one or two 38(t). Must learn to type slower or more acurately

Mike, I know that the 38(t) was used by 7th/8th/12th/19th and 20th Panzer divisions in 1941 and the 38(t) was used by 6th Division. In mid 1942 8th/19th/20th still had some, 22nd used a lot of them and there were a few in 1st/2nd/27th. What I can't find out is which version i.e. A-G. A,B, and C are very similar but the D-G are noticably up armoured. And it is which version I am attempting to find out.

Has anyone out there got any information as to exactly which variant of panzer IV was supplied to which division's at what date. And in what numbers. Or do you know where that information might be ?

Has anyone out there got any information as to exactly which variant of panzer 38(t) was supplied to which division's at what date. And in what numbers. Or do you know where that information might be ?

Has anyone out there got any information as to exactly which variant of panzer III was supplied to which division's at what date. And in what numbers. Or do you know where that information might be ?

Good thread Para. I have no doubt that manouvering a 10 ton half track in snow can be a little less than straight forward but I cannot imagine how it can take in excess of two minutes. No doubt some weight to power calculation is taking place to calculate this and the results are bordering on absurd. The whole point in putting tracks on vehicles at all is to improve manouverability/survivability off road. I would have thought weight would influence it but I doubt the vehilces full power is being used to turn around so what relevance is it's maximum HP going to be in the real world ?

Sorry the order was fast move, not withdraw.