Macisle

My first impression is... superb! I'm about halfway into the training mission on Elite level (did some GUI prep in the CMSF/CMA demos earlier). I absolutely love the increased FOW. My inf took a number of shots from the enemy AT without my finding its position. Accordingly, I've kept my tanks safe (so far). My attack was bogging down when I accidentally found what looks like a good spot for tanks to support an assault on the farm. Up to now, casualties have been light (just one pile of bodies in a bocage gap that looks like they were attacked by a very PO'd little white rabbit). And now, I have to stop for work. Aaargh!

I'm running the latest version of Norton Internet Security under Win7-64 Ult and have had no issues with the demo.

-Don't know about that, but I'm definitely refreshin' like Thunderball.

MajorJerkov, -Love your user name, man. Too funny!

I enjoy those shows, too

Yeah--great stuff! Live365 is a treasure trove for any type of music. I also listen to lots of classic jazz and 60's/70's. (I'm a gen-X'er, though.) Macisle

For CM, I normally go with game sounds only, but as a pre-game mood builder (or whenever I play VASL), I like to listen to period music. -Love it. My usual station is "Rat Patrol Radio" on Live365. It has some period news and PSA clips between the songs. There is a good selection of stations like this. Just search under big band, swing, OTR (old time radio), 30's, 40's, etc. I also love the old radio shows from the 40's and 50's. There are some great comedy shows from back then and I get a kick out of the sponsor plugs and jingles. Macisle

I can't remember the name of the book now (wanna' say Panzer Leader/Commander, but the author talked about this. He mentions that the SS were generally disliked by regular army and that many good officers were being transferred into it against their desires to pump up SS performance. IIRC, he also mentions that a few didn't mind, as they thought it would advance their career, but that most really did not want to go (an offer you can't refuse?). Does anybody know that book? The second half covers his time as a POW in the USSR. -Don't know how much is true, but he talks a lot about how valuable the German POWs were to the Russians who ran the camps, as they made a lot of money and/or earned favors with their superiors by putting the Germans, who often had good skills, to work on projects. One story almost sounds like Hogan's Heroes. I believe at a time when his group was in the Ukraine, they were often out working with only one guard, who they got along well with (Schuuuultz!!!). They used to play tricks on him for fun and one time they hid his rifle from him for awhile. Anyway, that's the only detailed account of life as a Russian-front POW that has drifted my way over the years. It's a good read. Oh, and I just remembered that I think the author later became a coffee merchant, if that helps anybody peg the book title. Macisle

Interesting thread! On the flipside of the POW experience, here's a story told to me by a woman I used to work with... Her husband had been a German pilot in the war. I can't remember his rank, but he was an officer. He was shot down, but survived, was captured and spent the rest of the war as a POW. During this time, he got a gig working at a camp bar serving enlisted men. This brought in money (I can't remember the details of who was running the camp) and he was livin' large in as much as a POW can. Well...eventually some British officers became aware that he was an officer and they complained to the camp brass that enemy POW or no, it was "beneath the dignity of an officer to serve enlisted men," and they got him fired. Of course, he was livid. -Don't know if the story's true, but I like it! Macisle

-Totally agree. It WAS buggy (like point-blank shots sometimes going into a no effect loop. You could fire shot after shot and they would do nothing.), but the terrain detail (in terms of game impact, not looks) was amazing. There were many moments of deep immersion in that one for me. Infantry was easily the weakest link in the game. Any time they showed up, it blew the sim feel. I was really hoping they would do an updated version. IIRC, something came out later using the same name, but was just an arcade style rip-off hoping to cash in on the street cred of the original. I didn't play that one. I too still have my copy of PE, along with copies of CC3 and CC4, including all the manuals. -Have been meaning to ebay 'em, but never get around to it. Macisle

I was playing CC3 when CMBO came out. I also got CC4, but didn't play it much. After a few days of CM, the CC series was unplayable for me. It just seemed too arcade in comparison. As for general WWII games, I've played lots of demos, but actual purchased titles (again, not like CM, but WWII-based) include: Panzer Elite (loved it and played the hell out of it). Deadly Dozen (had some annoying aspects, but was overall quite fun). WWII Online (played for awhile when it was pretty new. See more below.). BF1942 (arcade FPS, but quite fun. This was actually the last video game I purchased, when it was still in stores. CMBN will be the first since then.) I've always wanted to ask fellow CM players--and especially Steve, what they thought of WWII Online. To me, it really showed that no matter how accurate your modeling is, it will not help if you have a fundamental game design flaw. IMO, for that game to live up to its goal of having a full-scale, permanent game world, MASSIVE amounts of AI units are required. Without them, it becomes what the game is--WWII-flavored capture the flag where you might play for hours and never even see an enemy unit (well, infantry anyway). And how 'bout spending 30 minutes or more staring at a bunker wall hoping that an attacker might enter the door... I've often daydreamed about a game where you could have two or three layers happening at the same time, combining a tactical layer (CMBN-like) with a 1st person layer (Ghost-recon like) and, taking it to the extreme, a strategic layer where players could control things at that level. So, the strategic layer would make its decisions, then the resulting battles would be played out at the tactical level (sounding kinda' TW here). However, players wanting to play at the 1st-person level could command teams/squads and fight ala FPS, while doing comms with the tactical-level players (everybody playing RT at the same time). I've read Steve say they're not interested in strategic to tactical level, but how about tactical/1st-person hybrid? Could a future incarnation of CM take that on? Macisle

Just a thought off the top of my head: It's safe to say that the US ground forces are far superior to the Syrians in CMSF. But how would the battles go if you did the following: 1. Not allow the US any air power, but instead give that quality of air power to the Syrians in great abundance. 2. Give the Syrians a massive artillery support advantage. 3. Give the Syrians and very heavy numbers advantage. I don't have a horse in the race as far as the thread goes, but the above occurred to me as an interesting thought to get feedback on. There is no way you could say that the US is not a superior force pound for pound, but what would happen if red air and artillery was decimating their Abrams and other key assets and the enemy was coming at them with a huge numbers advantage? I'd say it's more than possible to be a superior ground force pound for pound and still lose every battle, if the enemy has the air, artillery and a numbers advantage (but again, I'm not saying the Germans were actually better.)

FYI, in case anyone is interested... I'm on the ground in Old Mama Nihon. As of the late-nineties, credit cards were still very uncommon in Japan. Since then, they have made great inroads and are now much more common. Many people have them. However, they are still not universally accepted, so use remains not nearly as widespread as it is in the States. Prepaid cards are also available here. Another growing trend is the use of cellphones that offer a credit card-like functionality. For example, you can scan a coupon with your cell and then use your cell itself instead of a cc to conduct the payment transaction. I believe most McDonald's here allow that (-never eat there, so not sure). Some vending machines, too. It's still far from universal, though.

Adding my hands to this round of applause. Your vids are wonderful. Thanks again!

Count me in that, too. Heck, I'm not even a gamer really at this point, but Battlefront's vision and hard work have made them the one company and game I have to support. Why? Because they offer the most realistic WWII-based tactical combat video game available and I want to experience that. For the reasons stated by Steve (budget and minimum system specs), they cannot currently include "cutting edge" graphics. However, the graphics as they stand are pleasing for most of the customer base and will I'm sure, be enhanced by community modding. With my new high-end rig, I've recently tried a number of game demos with hi-end graphics like CoD. Do they look nice? Yes. Graphics have improved a lot since my last upgrade. Do they play well? Answer: they play exactly the same as they did before--which leaves me yawning. I haven't played it, but I checked out some vids on CoH. Jeez... That's not even in the same universe as CM. C'mon, man. Yeah, the graphics are nice, but it looks like it would make the first Close Combat seem realistic in comparison. It's total sugar. One last thing, using purchase points as an example to compare realism levels is apples to oranges. That's saying, a game that sets up an unrealistic ability to choose units and then presents a completely unrealistic battle experience is the same as a game that sets up an unrealistic ability to choose units and then presents a battlefield with unmatched realism, in which real-world tactics can and do work. Okay, lurker throws potato-masher and disappears back into forest... Macisle

Another standing ovation and thanks for doing these vids, tyrspawn. You are doing a superb job! Please (oh, please!) keep 'em coming. The shakes set in so fast afterwards... Oh, and in case anybody missed it, you can start the vid at 720p, but after 20 minutes (you can skip the slider ahead), you can up it to 1080p. Trying to up it before the 20 minute mark causes an error. Anyway, I want to repeat that you are doing a fantastic job and lots of folks like me greatly appreciate and respect your hard work. Macisle

Yup. I can totally see that. A few times, I experimented going Hotseat against myself in CMx1 and even playing both sides, it was way harder than the AI. It's gonna be (painful at first, but) great!

Fellow longtime lurker here. Hello all! I recently posted in the How did you find out about Combat Mission? thread. -My first post in years. I'll repeat it here: When I was a kid, I bought the core Squad Leader module, but was too young to completely grok the rules and had no adults around that were interested. Love for the game and the desire to play it stayed with me through the years, despite my not evolving into a full-blown wargamer with other titles (owned some though). Years later, I bought Close Combat III and it certainly traveled part of the way to satisfying that lingering desire left by SL. Then, a couple of months after its release, I stumbled on Combat Mission. By the end of my first demo game, I was hooked and the CC series seemed hopelessly obsolete. I played the heck out of CMBO and also got CMBB and CMAK, though I played them less. Amazingly, I later stumbled upon my old copy of SL in storage and that led me to discover ASL. I got into that for a few years and it replaced CM for me. However, a few years ago, I took up music as a hobby and my gaming went down to nothing, due to time and brain cell demands (if you don't play often, the ASL rules tend to leak out of the ol' noggin). When CMSF came out, my rig was too old to run it. As fate would have it, I upgraded this Xmas (core i7-950, 6 gigs and a GTX-470!). I tried the demos of CMSF and CMA. SF is great, but I'm not into modern. I really enjoyed the CMA demo, but won't be getting that one either--but only because I can't afford the time. I'm quite the forum lurker and have kept an eye on development throughout the years and have read many of the threads--particularly the ones debating the whole design for effect vs. engineered thing. For my part, I think Battlefront is headed in exactly the right direction for this medium. I will definitely being trying the CMBN demo and will almost certainly buy it. The continuing (pre-modern) CM series may be the only games I ever buy going forward. I still don't really have the time for gaming, but I'll make an exception for this. I can't wait to dive in! This time, I have to try human opponents. for CMx1, I only played against the AI. All the best, Macisle

Looks GREAT!

When I was a kid, I bought the core Squad Leader module, but was too young to completely grok the rules and had no adults around that were interested. Love for the game and the desire to play it stayed with me through the years, despite my not evolving into a wargamer with other titles (owned some though). Years later, I bought Close Combat III and it certainly traveled part of the way to satisfying that lingering desire left by SL. Then, a couple of months after its release, I stumbled on Combat Mission. By the end of my first demo game, I was hooked and the CC series seemed hopelessly obsolete. I played the heck out of CMBO and also got CMBB and CMAK, though I played them less. Amazingly, I later stumbled upon my old copy of SL in storage and that led me to discovering ASL. I got into that for a few years and it replaced CM for me. However, a few years ago, I took up music as a hobby and my gaming went down to nothing, due to time and brain cell demands. When CMSF came out, my rig was too old to run it. As fate would have it, I upgraded this Xmas (core i7-950, 6 gigs and a GTX-470!). I tried the demos of CMSF and CMA. SF is great, but I'm not into modern. I really enjoyed the CMA demo, but won't be getting that one either--but only because I can't afford the time. I'm quite the forum lurker and have kept an eye on development throughout the years and have read many of the threads--particularly the ones debating the whole design for effect vs. engineered thing. For my part, I think Battlefront is headed in exactly the right direction for this medium. I will definitely being trying the CMBN demo and will almost certainly buy it. The continuing (pre-modern) CM series may be the only games I ever buy going forward. I still don't really have the time for gaming, but I'll make an exception for this. Anyway, a big thanks to Battlefront for their great work and vision and a heapin' congrats on them remaining a viable and growing force where so many others have fallen. I can't wait to play this game! Macisle

He-he. I have had the opposite experience. I am in my mid-thirties and am neither a "wargamer" nor a "gamer" - just a person who wants the most enjoyable WWII-based tactical game experience he can find. I started playing ASL after years of CMx1 and a long line of other quality video game titles (Panzer Elite, WWII Online, The Close Combat series, The Total War series, and many others). While CMx1 is still the best WWII-based tactical game experience in video game format I have ever seen, and the only video game series I still play - I prefer ASL. I guess this is why I felt the need to post, as there is an automatic assumption that people played ASL because computer gaming just wasn't up to snuff yet and once it was - bye-bye ASL. The truth is that each medium offers things not provided by the other and so it is really not an either-or decision. For me, as of CMAK, the CMx1 series still does not have the richness of game experience that ASL provides, due to the great variety of ASL victory conditions, available controllable player actions (direct control of smoke grenades, PF's, ATMM, demo charges, individual AFV weapons & smoke dischargers, etc.), random events (heat of battle, snipers, etc.), and the juicy decision making that the "RT" nature of defensive fire in ASL allows. (Example: Your German concealed flank hardpoint of a stone building is being approached by an Ami HT. Do you reveal yourself and hit it at distance with small arms and hope for a stun? Do you let it come closer, perhaps to pass you by? Do you wait for a bypass "freeze" attempt and blast it with a PF - probably filling your location with blaze smoke, thus losing the value of your hardpoint? YOU and not the TacAI must make this decision as the HT moves forward in RT - no take backs. Big tension and big fun!) I may seem to be knocking CM, but believe me, I am not. I am just trying to offer my 2 cents with regards to the "Of course I left ASL for CM" train of thought. As for CMSF, I cannot comment on it, as my rig won't run it. I will certainly try out it and future CM offerings, future hardware allowing. As for CMx2, and coming from my position as being primarily an ASL player, I am completely open-minded about it. It can never replace ASL, so why not see where the video game medium can take it? I look forward to trying out the WWII CMx2 titles. By then, I should have a new rig! All the best, Macisle [ November 27, 2007, 12:23 PM: Message edited by: Macisle ]

-Just wanted to throw in that ASL also layers an Experience Level Rating (ELR) on top of a unit's base morale. This allows the scenario designer to depict troops that may "officially" elite, 1st line, etc., but who may actually have more or less functional experience and/or unit cohesion when the bullets start flying. So, a squad that is trained to "elite" status, but with little or no real combat experience can be depicted, as well as a squad that may not be "elite," but that is comprised of grizzled veterans who will hold up under fire very well. This abstract system functionally depicts whatever subtle shadings of morale/force cohesion might be needed for a scenario and is a beautiful system IMO. The design for effect here really seems to work well. So, for example (using our imaginations, the game doesn't go into this kind of detail), in late war, a German squad may have a good inherent NCO who keeps the green horns in line - thus presenting a 1st line squad on its surface. However, if that NCO is incapacitated, the squad may fall to pieces rather quickly. This is is represented by the ELR. An early/mid war force of 1st line Germans, for example, may have a high ELR and thus not lose much unit cohesion over the course of a battle as they break and rally during the fight. However, a late war 1st line force (or a force from a different period that has little combat experience) with a low ELR may very quickly begin to drop in effectiveness/cohesion. This is represented in ASL by a drop in unit class (elite to 1st line, 1st line to 2nd line, 2nd line to conscript, etc.). CMx1 may have used the ASL system as a jumping off point for the design of its morale system. I'm not sure how it is handled in CMx2. For the first time, my rig is too long in the tooth for CM! No luck running the CMSF demo. Anyhoo. Interesting discussion (as was the Valley Thread). Thanks, Michael! Macisle