not here

Pathetic newbie scum.

I think the invasion/defense of Singapore would be a must-have scenario. All the combined arms you want (if you're Japanese). I don't recall what, if any, British armor was present, but there were some great heroic stands of infantry vs. light armor.

Able Baker Charlie Dog Easy Fox George How Item Jig King Love Mike Nan Oboe Peter Queen Roger Sugar Tare Uncle Victor William X-ray Yoke Zebra http://www.nor.com.au/community/sarc/phonetic.htm Interesting. This site lists several variants as well as German and other languages- it does not identify any as official Wehrmacht, though.

Sound advice from Fionn and Major Tom. I have been trying to use these, more on intuition than formal statistics, for some time now, with some success. One small tactical question: How do you really know when you've truly achieved hull-down vis-a-vis a certain (enemy) location? The number 1 view has a peculiar center for armored vehicles- as you increment forward, it comes out of the muzzle and seems to drop to the ground. You can't really use this view until you've reached the actual coordinate, either, and then it may be too late. The #5 overhead fails to show enough terrain subtlety to pick the spot, either. I am never sure when I have just enough hull "up" to sight and fire, without exposing more of the vehicle than absolutely necessary. As a result, I often pick a spot that seems just a little too exposed and Hunt up to it, hoping the TC will react on his own. (He usually does- but if you're not sure where the enemy is, this is a risky strategy- they might see you first}. I wish I could choose my parking place as accurately as the real commander could! Is there a trick for this?

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Trust me I am a programmer<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Well, you've not only got some good ideas, but a sense of humor It's clear a polite "thanks, but no thanks" is being offered up here. I don't think BTS needs or wants the help to make their release date or to build their library of vehicles. I do like the idea of a custom vehicle contest, with winning designs being included in future releases (and that should be reward enough). You could get some good publicity, and maybe rope a few more graphics types who are borderline wargamers, into the fold. It would also help build the sense of community that CM seems to foster. Trust me... I'm in Marketing

...and will smoke be affected by wind speed and direction?

The US certainly trains for winter operations, but the northern troops adapt more readily. Training and prep is everything. On training and evaluation maneuvers in Germany we had a nasty winter storm near the Czech border (Grafenwoehr, for those who've been). Joining 3AD for the fun was an armored unit from the California National Guard. They showed up with smiles and suntans. The temp fell into single digits (F) and the snow flew. I have never felt so sorry for anyone who made me laugh as much. They froze- they crashed- they were utterly clueless and unprepared (they left bottled beer out at night to keep it cold- a sort of slow grenade in that weather). I watched one M60A1 try to pull another out of a hull-down position where it was stuck. As the track spun on the steep, frozen hillside, the second M60 slid in the hole to join the first with a loud clang. A humongous M88 recovery vehicle was called to the scene. It huffed, puffed, and finally threw a track. What a target for a HIND to stumble across! Those who want to free bogged tanks in a 30 minute scenario should have been there. The evaluation Major I was driving laughed til he couldn't take it anymore- and then ordered me to CS the whole unhappy crew. "Good training" was the phrase of the day (the grenade bounced off the back deck of one of the tanks and rolled pretty much into the middle of the clusterf**k, spewing a white cloud of teargas, while the NG stared at it with curiousity). Bad day in the snow.

BTS has said that the 'faust routine has been tweaked. The only times I have seen them work is when there no other targets available to the unit, and the tank is right in front of them. Come to think of it, I think the vehicle must be turning a flank or rear as well- can't recall seeing any frontal shots with a 'faust. I have two 'faust kills on Shermans that I know of- one just yesterday in Riesberg- the Sherman drove down the main road and turned 90 degrees in front of the first house on the German right of the road. The hidden squad apparently couldn't resist the engine noise and the juicy, unmissable target. You could see the backblast, but there was no launcher tube visible.

Thought provoking topic. This got me started thinking about dummy tanks- what a cool thing to model! There were certainly many occasions where dummy tanks and cannon were used to deceive the enemy in WWII. In prepared positions, actual vehicle hulks were used for the purpose, often with logs or pipe for cannon. If they were effective for that, actual KO'd vehicles would certainly be confusing on the battlefield, unless blazing. There were also instances on the Eastern Front of abandoned tanks, whose weapons were still serviceable, being taken over and converted to pillboxes by infantry. Generally I agree that we get too much information on the damage we cause enemy vehicles now. On the main gun KO issue, I would add that a main gun can be wasted without visible indications- and this may have been more common than catastrophic and visible damage. It wouldn't take much of a dimple or bend in the tube (or hairline fracture) to render the gun unserviceable, but you couldn't tell by looking from a range of 50m. Even the crew couldn't always tell, 'til they tried to fire the next round...

I've gotten to really like sharpshooters- after I learned to use them the way Fionn said- just leave them alone. They usually know what to do, and when they do nothing there is usually a reason for it. In the Riesberg I'm playing right now, the guy has fired 5 rounds total (currently turn 19). For that, I got one TC and caused another tank to button; both Shermans were subsequently killed by other squads (one 'faust, one 'schreck). Those are kills I probably wouldn't have gotten on unbuttoned, commanded tanks. The sniper was running on autopilot and I call that a pretty good return on investment, for 5 7.92mm rounds. He has also suppressed a mortar squad pretty much on his own. I wonder if some folks having consistent trouble with snipers are finding them good LOSs and unhiding them at the right times? This go, I'm very lucky in that there's not much incoming in the sniper's direction. They take a long time to acquire a moving target and some suppression fire forces them to start over.

For the record, the AI also seems a little too willing attack piecemeal. If it has to rush across open, defended spaces, for example, it will often send individual squads one after the other, rather than rushing in groups. (Once I had it launch a grand charge across the open and it was impressive). This isn't a case of using the other squads for supporting fire- it looks more as though they rush as they become available (ie, reach the treeline). Still a pretty crafty AI compared to some others I've seen.

I hope overly pink Americans will not find this thread offensive. Is there a place that describes the actual process of inserting textures into CM? It looks like coolcolj is working on them already. I'm no hacker, but I spend a lot of time with Paint Shop Pro and other graphics apps, and I find the idea of custom textures fascinating. Also, if you create custom textures, etc., how would they work in a PBEM? Do both sides see the same character set? Would my custom guys appear on both machines with the enemy's custom guys (probably he would have to load the bmp files separately)? This may be a little premature but others seem to know a fair amount about it. If there's a detailed discussion of this please point me to it.

Me too, right after Chance Encounter. I didn't need the extra convincing, just an inherent procrastinator. Amazingly my old friend Ed the Dinosaur, meticulous collector of period memorabilia, may actually buy his first-ever PC because of my glowing descriptions of CM. So I'll be committed to a lifeime of tech support.

Zamo: I mentioned Wake up around post #8, and it would be great. A what iffer ground invasion of Oahu would be kind of trick, too (I think there was one in Perfect General). BillWood: Nomonhan is a brilliant suggestion (long as we're dreaming)! I'm kind of a Russo-Japanese aficionado, and round 2, The Bear's Revenge, would be ideal for CM. Very nasty. I don't get around Gameland as much as some here, but I have never seen a Nomonhan scenario anywhere. Of course I would cheerfully settle for a 4th demo (just a little skirmish, mind you) any time before 25 DEC. Gotta a couple long flights to kill!

"...given the choice of owning a KT or a M1A1 for personal use, the choice is VERY clear..." Let's see, M1A1 gets something like 1.83 gallons to the mile. It does have some body styling, but it's hard on bridges and tough to park. And at 4.3 mil or more (depending on option package) they're a little spendy. Plus no classic plates. Fahrvergnuegen rules.

Bullethead: They don't call ya that for nothin'- right you are. 773mps muzzle, so 2536 Fps. Now, that's about muzzle velocity range for a .30-06, or a 7.92. I think we're also talking a 5 pound Tiger projectile, vs. something over 8 for the M1A1. (I know my 105mm was 8 lb. projectile with mv of 4850 fps.) That's a big difference downrange. At 500m in the proposed scenario, I'm still likin' the Abrams....

Some fun with numbers: M1A1 has a 120mm gun with muzzle velocity of 5500 feet per second (maybe twice as fast as a .30-06 bullet). M1A1 has Chobham-style mesh armor, and optional reactive armor, and was designed to combat tanks with 5000+ fps muzzle velocities. Tiger has 88mm gun with muzzle velocity of almost 800fps (about the same as a .45 ACP round). M1A1 also weighs 12 tons more than the Tiger, and probably has rear armor in the thickness vicinity of the 100mm frontal on the Tiger. M1A1 in addition has thermal sights, computer-stabilized gun, laser range finder, and turret launched smoke grenades (which do not inhibit its own ability to target thermally). The M1A1's most significant limitation is only 40 sabot rounds on board (I think we can skip over depleted uranium ammo for reasons of economy), but that is not going to be a limitation in this scenario. Now, the image of 20 nuns with blowtorches at least creates an atmosphere of pure terror. The Tigers are simply beer cans at the target range.

I thought about a WWI version, too. But when you think about it, most of it would be kind of boring from a game point of view on this scale. Kind of like the beach landing problem, at company level: two game turns, one long arty prep, one over the top and everybody dies. The dead body option would be the most entertaining thing about the WWI game. The scale is part of what makes this work, integral to the concept you could say, and that's why modeling ships and Zeppelins seems pretty much out of the question (except as OBA). Of course, there aren't any good medieval games out there... hmmm. I think they could do a great job with PTO, but I suspect it will require a custom engine job, for tunnels and jungle, etc. LRRPs in Burma shouldn't be overlooked. Some nice ANZAC possibilities to broaden the market base, too.

I'm with rune- you get my Pacific vote in return for Korea. Saipan and Wake would be fun, but Korea... Gotcher tanks, terrain nasties, cool weapons, and of course bugles (no war game should be without). This hummer is made for Korea. Jets and mounted infantry in the same scenario- Pershings and T-34s- real live Commies, and all the Marines you can shake a stick at. Puh-lease!

I searched, and I know this has come up before, but... wouldn't it be possible to randomize just the AFV contingent in a given scenario, by a factor of +/- ONE? I don't think it's necessary to reorder the whole OoB. If you kill the two StuGs and the Tiger (in LD, e.g.), you can then proceed to do gamey things with armor- count 'em 1, 2, 3, and then zoom about with relative abandon. Or count 1, 2, then tiptoe around til 3 shows up. I understand that the scenario editor allows near-infinite variation, but it looks like you did your homework on these scenarios and I just want to keep them fresh and honest (being occasionally too lazy to create them from scratch- hell, I play on airplanes and in hotel rooms). If you didn't know whether you'd killed all the heavies, you would play a lot more realistically. There are psychological limits to what can be simulated when you KNOW what's out there. This single die roll would preserve some FOW and realistic tactics, and keep gamers guessing like real commanders time after time. Maybe this is just the beta blues- but it seems easy to pull off, and the OoB briefings could be left a little more vague to suit. It's just that I've seen other features (like Undo, which seems pretty unnecessary with this interface) described as not commonly requested, thus low priority, so I'd like to keep the volume up on this one (Oh, s**t, there were FOUR of the bastards!). If not, there's an end on't.

It's always nice to topple popular myths, although it's customary to provide a reference when doing so. Here's a post that supports your claim, in some impressive and interesting detail: http://www.uwm.edu/~jpipes/wwwboard/messagesnew3/18746.html Thank you for the correction.

Tank collisions not happen in battle? Don't tell SS-Hauptsturmführer Michael Wittmann: "....the heavy Tiger thundered towards the British, shuddering only slightly as the heavy gun fired shell after shell into the mass of machines. Half-tracks, carriers and tanks were smashed by 88 mm shells, and then with a final burst of speed the 55 ton steel monster, destroying in its rush a British tank which it met on the narrow path, crashed through the junction, was swung in a tight arc onto the roadway and began its descent upon the vehicles lined up outside the village and along the narrow high street." He was also decorated at Kursk for clearing his vehicle deck of Russians with an MP after they had deliberately rammed his tank with their T34. "The Canadians brought an end to the career of SS-Hauptsturmführer Wittmann. His Tiger I tank fell to a co-ordinated salvo fired by five Shermans on which he was making a single-handed attack. It was a fitting end for the leading tank ace of the Second World War. "He was credited with the destruction of 138 Allied tanks and 132 anti-tank guns in less than two years." Used without permission from http://www.valourandhorror.com/DB/PERSON/Wittman.htm and other sources.

Before being too hard on the AI, how do you know what shape the enemy Tiger was in (internally, I mean)? Just because it's not abandoned doesn't mean all is well- could have main gun damage, thrown track, injured crew, etc. Second, even if all is well, how does the Tiger know "all" Hellcats and bazookas are gone? Assuming AI doesn't cheat and the US Army failed to send their headcount to the Germans before the engagement, he may wisely be waiting in an overwatch role in case more US armor shows up. And how on earth would he know that the zooks were all dead? Every standing building is a potential bazooka nest, as far as it knows. In Chance Encounter, the AI has certainly shown no reluctance to use the Shermans in a close infantry support role. Sometimes they get schrecked to death- otherwise they cause a great deal of trouble.

Is it too obvious to mention http://www.achtungpanzer.com/panzer.htm ? I assume most are familiar with it, but if not, you're in for a treat.

This had been an interesting thread- I don't PBEM, at least not yet, and I've always used whatever tools were at hand to beat the AI as a matter of course. It's a game- I wanna win. But the subject of gamey-ness (gaminess?) got me to thinking. I just ran through Last Defense as the Germans, and worked the HTs through the gaps in the woods on the German right. Dropped some 81mm smoke in front of known bad guy locations and did the HT bum's rush with D platoon up the right side of the map to flank the town (other details proprietary). What got me thinking about the difference between a "game" and gameyness was when I went to roll up the houses from right to left to get that left-most (from the German perspective) VL. As one platoon worked it's way over, I paralleled it with an MG that was still in the woods on the German player's side of the big open field. I figured that if any Amis had survived my tank-and-mortar shelling and were laying low, I'd have them in a nice crossfire as my squad approached, with the MG across the field. Now there were no officers and no radio with the MG- he was very alone in that part of the map, and basically out of targets. He was at least 250m, probably more, from the platoon going after the house- earshot was out of the question (there was still a tank battle and beaucoup shelling going on). In real life, how would he know that the distant platoon was going to manuever 350m to its left, and that they would really appreciate some back up when they made their final rush? Is this gamey, or playing the game? I am genuinely confused about how to deal with this, and I never really gave this sort of thing much thought before. The MG might have witnessed the platoon movement and divined their intentions, moving to help on his own intiative. I certainly could pretend that he had been briefed as part of a master plan, except that that particular part of the plan was anything but defined and arose as circumstances permitted. In short, only my god-like view allowed this otherwise obvious maneuver to take place. From the sky, I directed the MG as if by magic to the right time and place- coordinated as if by magic with another unit with whom contact was pretty much impossible. The platoon on its own could not have done that. An ethical dilemma, and one that arises multiple times per scenario. Have I sinned? How would either software or human judgement adjudicate such a thing?