BFCElvis

1512 hrs With the loss of my Sherman on Hill 154 I have lost one of the most important elements of my advance up the hill. Having a Sherman on that hill gives me a big advantage. Together with the Sherman on Hill 144 most of the village can be covered with 75mm HE. If I stay away from the woods edge I feel confident that it is safe to keep a tank up there. With that in mind I commit one of my 3 reserve Shermans to get up on the hill as fast as possible. The rag tag infantry along the treeline of 154 can provide security for the portion of the hill it will be traveling past. As expected, I safely and quickly have an M4 back on Hill 154. Full size On Hill 144 I am being subject to constant hit and run missions by German infantry. They appear, fire off some shots and either disappear or die. It is like death by a thousand paper cuts. Never a major blow but enough to send men to ground and make my organization of troops on the hill difficult. Full size Men continue to arrive at the foot of Hill 144. This is shaping up to be the core of my attack on the Villa. Full size In the center area of operations advancing is very slow. Most of the units I am advancing with are the remnants of 3rd Plt/F Co. They are in pretty bad shape and have been harassed by machine gun fire causing them to constantly go to ground. I haven’t been able to get a read of exactly where the MG fire is coming from. Full size Back on Hill 154 more hit and run actions. The men are in such bad shape they throw their arms up rather than fight it out. Full Size

I never even considered that. What a great idea.

The TacAI will fire at multiple targets. I didn't target anything while trying to escape because I was still holding out hope that even in withdraw I might get an LOS on the foxholes with the gun and hopefully get a shot off. If I had targeted the woods (which hindsight tells me would have been a better move) the TacAI would have changed the target to the gun if it had become exposed but breaking off my target command would have delayed that some and opened my up to possibly getting blowed up by the gun. I guess we see how well that train of thought worked out.

A provides very good cover and concealment. Especially when hiding behind a wall and the spotter is at the same level. A fence will provide very little concealment (if any) and gives a little bit of cover against light arms fire. You can see the bullets bounce off of it sometimes.

I have been trying to move anything with a gun up the middle toward the Villa but they have been subjected to seeming phantom shots that continuously keep them going to ground. This has been making progress very slow. Finally I am able to see their position of the far hill behind the Villa. I need to get some sort of heavy fire on that if I am going to make any real push up the middle. Full size On Hill 154 I get me AT gun into a foxhole and begin unlimbering it. The hope is that it will provide some extra defensive fire for my men clinging to Hill 154. But sure enough, an uninvited guest shows up. Full size An exchange of fire leaves the German dead. But not before he can throw another of those nasty potato mashers knocking out my gun. Full size For now there is nothing else to do on Hill 154 but continue to set my troops up to provide some mutual protection and hold onto the very tenuous ground that so many have lost their lives to gain. Thank goodness Tube Guy is still on the scene. Full size

1508 hrs I dodged a HUGE bullet against the panzerschrek on Hill 154. One thing it let me know is that I HAVE to get out of those woods right away. The Germans are like ninjas in there. I never see them until it’s too late. I have to find a different way to knock out that AT gun. With the number of Shermans I have lost knocking it out may be what makes or breaks this battle. While these thoughts are going through my mind I am hit with a hand grenade. Again I’m amazed that at such close range I haven’t seen another unit approaching. And then BAM! As I am backing out of the woods a panzerfaust hits me. My luck has run out with this Sherman. Full size On Hill 144, the Sherman I have moved into position there is starting to rearrange the architecture of the Villa. I have seen Germans moving into the building in the rear and have decided to try to level it. I took this screen shot because it shows a few things about both the battlefield we are fighting on and the game engine. I’m going to take a detour here for a second to talk about something that I love with the way CMx2 models rounds. A very early battle I played with CMBN I had a bazooka team on a hill with an LOS to a Panzer Mark IV and a few trees in between. The first shot the bazooka took sailed over the Mark IV. The second hit a tree that was between the two. It was a WOW moment for me. I had seen this kind of thing in CMSF plenty of times but there was something about that bazooka shot that gave me goose bumps. I had the same feeling here. You can see in the screen shot where I have targeted and you can tell from the smoke in the area that other shots have already hit the building. But you can also see a round exploding in the tree that blocked a shot. When you see things like that happen it really brings you deep into the game and the battle. The immersion can be intense at times. Full size Thanks for indulging me with the detour. Back to fighting for my life (or dignity) ….. In the Villa I now see a lot of movement. It is difficult to tell if this is because of the fire they have been receiving or he is simply moving his men out of harms way. Either way I’m happy for the intel it is providing. Full size The Panzerschrek that was seen in the previous report has not improved his position. The good news for him is that he won’t have to worry about it anymore. Full size The MG team that I had moved up next to the surviving Sherman on Hill 154 no longer has the main gun. I advance them forward with a flanking view of the Villa. Full size

It may have been a half turn or maybe a full minute. It was not like the moment the tank reached its position they all came into view. The MG on the left part of the screen shot is the most forward part of the Villa to my advance. The MG in there had been harassing my guys trying to come across the center field for a while. The buildings that the closer shot shows the MG teams firing from have been in somebody's LOS nearly the entire game. When I targeted the artlillery on the Villa those buildings are what I used to target. I didn't spot anyone in there but I had LOS to those locations for most of the game so when something starts happening in there it will be noticed. And as I mentioned a couple of posts the Panzershreck team was in a location I did not have any LOS to until after arriving in the elevated position with the Sherman. When reaching the position what came into view instantly for me was the Villa. I knew I had LOS to most buildings and that was HUGE for me. After that is when the targets also came into view. There are several reasons the MG targets could have been spotted by the Sherman. I suspect it was a combination of things. The Sherman is in full C2 and as has been discussed that helps with spotting, when the guns fired on my position that helped with spotting, my Sherman (at the time) was unbuttoned that helped with spotting. I believe Jon has posted up to this point in the game so t may be interesting to hear if he targeted my Sherman or if the AI did. Either way the Sherman was spotted by the Germans.

As you would expect it isn't easy. Men will go to ground easily and its usually because someone has been killed.

One other thing to add about the Sherman sighting...The only enemy unit that was not in a place that someone had an LOS to most of the game was the Schreck team. C2 helps with sighting (and the Sherman is still in C2). The schreck team set up in the open behind a wall and I am above it. It did not appear to be "hiding" behind the wall. Easy sighting is not something I have experienced with CMBN and certainly not this battle. If anything there have been times that I wondered why I didn't see something earlier. When we're done I'll read what Jon has done and maybe even rewatch some turns from his side to get a better idea of what has been going on. One thing is for sure, thick foliage will provide excellent concealment.

I'm not sure what you guys mean by" spotted so fast". They are spotted whenh tey are seen. Until then they aren't spotted and because of that I have no way of knowing how long they were in my LOS before being spotted so I'm not sure how you do. I'm not trying to be a wise ass but how do you know? The building they are in has been in somebodys LOS for most of the game.

Wiggum, the Sherman is pretty close to the Villa. Its about 250 yrds away. Jon would be able to tell you if it was the AI that opened fire or if he ordered it. There are other units moving in the area the Sherman is set up in. For instance the 30cal is right next to it. If Jon didn't order a hide command I would epect the guns to fire at that range. I also don’t know their condition. A lot of arty came down in that area. They might in such bad condition that they would fire at their a Mothers.

The screen shot is the "global view" and it may not have been entirely the Sherman, although that is the way I remember it. They were making no effort to hide at that point. The 2 nearest the Sherman were firing. The schreck team behind the wall was not hiding and I was above it helping with sighting it. The MG team in the building closest to my center front may not have been in the Shermans LOS but was in the LOS of other units, like the one firing the bazooka at the building.

Back on Hill 155 I decide to move in tight through the woods and see if I can catch the AT gun off guard and unable to turn on me before I can knock it out. I plot my screening infantry to move along the tree line to protect my flank from any infantry in the woods. But their morale is so bad right now that the only thing that moves along the woods is the Sherman. As I watch the turn unfold I am helpless to stop the Shermans advance. And what happens next is my worst fear. A Panzerscherk connects!! I am fortunate that it hit my tracks and does not disable the tank. Full size While the schreck team scrambles to reload I am able to get a round off at point blank range. I won’t need to worry about him anymore. But still I have to get out of these damned woods before one of his buddies comes along. Full size On Hill 144 I am able to move a 30cal MG team into position to see into the Villa. Full size In the Villa there is a lot of movement. This may have been going on for a while but now I can see it. And I can see where they are going. Full size

On Hill 144 I move my Sherman forward to try to get a look at the Villa from the hillside. As I arrive what I have been trying to get the entire battle is now laid out in front of me. Not only do I have a good look at the Villa but I also have targets!!!!! 3 machine gun teams and Panzerschreck team and a firing position to reach almost the entire Villa. Full size The machine gun teams fire on my Sherman. Full size The Sherman returns fire with all guns. Full size In the center a ragtag squad see the same thing as the Sherman and fire a bazooka round into the first building of the complex. (TUBE GUY!) Full size

1502 hrs With the second JPz IV knocked out and only the last AT as a long range threat for my movements I’m feeling pretty good about the progress I’m making. It’s always a bad idea to feel good I am finding. Moments after the lovely screen shot of my convoy racing to the foot of Hill 144 I am met with tragedy. Of all the vehicles that could be destroyed the one that would hurt the most is the one that get destroyed. My 2 ½ ton truck is hit by a deadly round instantly killing nearly half of the Pioneers it is carrying. Full size The rest of the convoy somehow makes it to the base of the hill intact. I still can’t believe that the only vehicle hit is that truck. The field grass and flowers of the field are very high and the truck is the tallest vehicle that I had passing though. That lack of concealment is what must have saved the others and doomed my Pioneers. Full size The celebrating on Hill 154 also did last long. Throughout the regrouping the German have been conducting little hit and run missions against my infantry in the very thick woods. The combination of the trees and thick underbrush has made the Germans nearly invisible until it is too late. Here a soldier joins the choir invisible and is sent there by a nearly invisible enemy. This screen shot is taken from the location of the shooter. Do you see it? Neither do I but I did see the flash come from this spot. And he certainly saw my guy. Full size My surviving Sherman on 154 moves slightly forward to try to get a clear LOS to the Villa. What is left of my MG team that received fire from the foxhole moves across the bare field to try to get an LOS to the Villa as well. It is a risky move but there is no good LOS where it is so I have to try it. While the Sherman moves into position it spots a German forward observer behind a wall among some trees. With a clear line of fire I am able to pound it with the tanks 75mm HE. Full size

I know what I forgot...a couple of the things I mention above were already written up in my next post so your timing is good. Just sorting out the screen shots now. Also, I have gotten a different appreciation for infantry in CMSF from playing CMBN. There are aspects of C2 that were not as apparent to me in CMSF now after playing CMBN for a while a lot has been cleared up.

The sides are much more even and taking fire is not nearly as lethal as CMSF (unless you catch yourself point blank, tired and facing German SMGs in the woods). C2 comes more into play. Because every squad does not have a radio/walkie talkie like CMSF, maintaining C2 can be difficult under harsh conditions. When C2 breaks down and your unit is a little roughed up it will not perform its orders as well (or at all). The terrain (buildings obviously excluded) is very different and provides cover and concealment not seen on most CMSF maps. Because of this movement out of LOS happens much more frequently (as you would expect). And the last part of the equation (until I can think of some aspect I've forgotten) is that spotting of infantry is more difficult. Several things such as terrain, night vision, troop morale, etc contribute to that. That being said I don't believe any of things are not possible in CMSF. Steve, please correct me if I am wrong, but the basics of the infantry are the same in both games. What changes the behavior and feel is how the infantry reacts under the different conditions seen in CMBN, not a fundamental change in how infantry is modeled in the game (did that sentence make sense?). I would be a good choice for one of your first games because I'm easy pickins.

Well, I don't know about the "hey mom look at me" behavior (I'm not feeling that) but you would not be the first to use the View Counter Whore phrase. Although in truth it was Jon who first referred to himself as a View Counter Slut in an email to me a few days after the DARs started..

It took last years Visual Bone thread 6 months to have over 57,000 views. This thread did that in 10 days. I'm hoping for 100,000 before this is over. That might also mean that Jon's thread gets 75,000 Thank you for your viewership.

It doesn't take me any more or less time than CMx1 or CMSF. I think I am a relatively fast player though. It is very rare I will spend 10 minutes processing a turn. This game is the exception because I spend a ton of time looking for screenshots to take and replaying many many times.

stoex is right, that's what the red sign is in this shot.

I have read almost nothing beyond the first page of this thread but popping in just now I noticed this. I wish there was an engaging way I could show this in my current AAR because it has been what I have spent a good deal of the battle struggling with. There have been times when Jons infantry has come out of the woods right on top of my men, undetected until they were in point blank range and because of the condition of some of my units they disobey any order I have issued and crawl, run, hide, do what ever they can for self preservation. And the men do it independently of each other. 2 guys may crawl for cover while 2 others try to get some shots off. They have at times been issued movement orders but because of their condition immediately go to ground if they hear any type of fire, even mortars falling halfway across the map. The TacAI has performed fantastically.

So did I. I even intentionally brought the tank to the center of their formation. When that didn't do the trick I had the guys jump out because I didn't want to try the Sherman thing any longer and risk losing the men. I'll be asking around to see if it is something that could use some adjusting. In addition to the rescue element I posted it to show that bail out and re-manning of tanks.

I have seen more surrendering in this battle than any other but the causes seem to be in line with what I had been seeing before. So I don't think it needs adjusting. I maybe have a question about the squad that ran to Hill 144 but when everything is factored in it shouldn't have come as a surprise.

Not sure if you mean from that FO unit or the game in general so I'll answer for both. If you have a FO or HQ leader without a radio that unit can't call in arty. If you have a radio but no FO or HQ leader then the unit can't call in arty either. I have other units with both leaders and radios so I am still able to call in artillery..just not from that unit.