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Georgie

General OOM Issues

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From everything i have seen, there hasn't been any "circling of the wagons". Having difficulty figuring out the base cause of these issues is not the same as saying they aren't trying. I think the low level of feedback communication simply reflects they don't have a lot of data yet they can share. They definitely aren't interested in giving any false impressions or promises which is a very good thing.

No news I think simply reflects the difficulty in isolating and reproducing.

I hope that you are correct. I'm getting ready to buy a new computer and if BF elects to leave the OOM problem unresolved then I will be tempted to chose a Mac rather than a PC since the Mac version of CMBN is 64 bit and AFAIK the Mac version doesn't have the OOM problem and can play the largest scenarios with no problem. Please correct me if I am wrong.

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Now have 4 Gigs in the machine, with little less than 3 GB available for apps as can be expected for WinXP 32 and the OOM issue still remains. Now second guess would be a 1GB VRAM graphics adapter, which I can´t afford right now...or a patched up CMBN.

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Now have 4 Gigs in the machine, with little less than 3 GB available for apps as can be expected for WinXP 32 and the OOM issue still remains. Now second guess would be a 1GB VRAM graphics adapter, which I can´t afford right now...or a patched up CMBN.

You are running out of virtual address space, not physical memory. Adding physical memory doesn't do anything about this problem. I explained that as often as I could without thinking I spam the forum, what else can I do? Don't go wasting more money.

(there was a separate problem running out of graphics memory but that one has an intact and clear error message saying so, and it has nothing to do with the problem discussed here)

(also note that the default process manager on windows names swapspace/paging space "virtual memory" - which is incorrect. The advanced process manager you can download from MS gets it right)

Anyone tried the win7 switch? Sorry I don't use win7.

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You are running out of virtual address space, not physical memory. Adding physical memory doesn't do anything about this problem. I explained that as often as I could without thinking I spam the forum, what else can I do? Don't go wasting more money.

(there was a separate problem running out of graphics memory but that one has an intact and clear error message saying so, and it has nothing to do with the problem discussed here)

(also note that the default process manager on windows names swapspace/paging space "virtual memory" - which is incorrect. The advanced process manager you can download from MS gets it right)

Anyone tried the win7 switch? Sorry I don't use win7.

I know, I know, but there´s nothing we can do about it now. Lets wait what BFC comes up with next to solve the issue. At least my latest ARMA 2 projects benefit from the increased RAM. :cool:

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You are running out of virtual address space, not physical memory. Adding physical memory doesn't do anything about this problem. I explained that as often as I could without thinking I spam the forum, what else can I do? Don't go wasting more money.

(there was a separate problem running out of graphics memory but that one has an intact and clear error message saying so, and it has nothing to do with the problem discussed here)

(also note that the default process manager on windows names swapspace/paging space "virtual memory" - which is incorrect. The advanced process manager you can download from MS gets it right)

Anyone tried the win7 switch? Sorry I don't use win7.

The LAA flag in CMBN is set to False, so you can't do anything about running out of virtual address space limited to 2 Gb

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The LAA flag in CMBN is set to False, so you can't do anything about running out of virtual address space limited to 2 Gb

Yes you can, see my earlier post. Win7 has a new feature to override it.

And that doesn't begin to ask the question how an application written in the mid-2000s is supposed to be not safe for pointers > 31 bits. That's extremely unlikely. And the code even works in 64 bit on macs, so clearly BFC didn't do anything too stupid in the base code.

Maybe the answer to all this is that BFC uses a third party library that sets the flag.

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Yes you can, see my earlier post. Win7 has a new feature to override it.

And that doesn't begin to ask the question how an application written in the mid-2000s is supposed to be not safe for pointers > 31 bits. That's extremely unlikely. And the code even works in 64 bit on macs, so clearly BFC didn't do anything too stupid in the base code.

Maybe the answer to all this is that BFC uses a third party library that sets the flag.

Unfortunately I use Vista 32 bit...anyway I tried to load the unfamous Fire Brigade with success...I will see if I get a CTD during the game

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Don't use these tools, or otherwise attempt to modify the game's binaries. Doing so may cause the DRM to decide your copy of the game is illegitimate. This is something you definitely want to avoid. It would also violate the product's EULA.

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This article addresses the problem of using more than 4 GB virtual address space in a 32 bit program.

In CMBN we have bigger problems since BFC's binary shuts us out of the virtual address space right above 2 GB. The above flag in win7 or the external program solves this and should make more scenarios run. "That other" forum has observed no failures with the game, the DRM doesn't notice. And crash? Heck it was crashing and now it doesn't.

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This article addresses the problem of using more than 4 GB virtual address space in a 32 bit program.

In CMBN we have bigger problems since BFC's binary shuts us out of the virtual address space right above 2 GB. The above flag in win7 or the external program solves this and should make more scenarios run. "That other" forum has observed no failures with the game, the DRM doesn't notice. And crash? Heck it was crashing and now it doesn't.

I am using win7 but I still have OOM errors. Do I have to do something to enable the "above flag"?

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Just because you haven't noticed it tripping the DRM doesn't mean it hasn't. Your not noticing means nothing, because you have no idea what to look for. Hence my advice.

I'll repeat myself: "Don't use these tools, or otherwise attempt to modify the game's binaries. Doing so may cause the DRM to decide your copy of the game is illegitimate. This is something you definitely want to avoid. It would also violate the product's EULA."

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Just because you haven't noticed it tripping the DRM doesn't mean it hasn't. Your not noticing means nothing, because you have no idea what to look for. Hence my advice.

I'll repeat myself: "Don't use these tools, or otherwise attempt to modify the game's binaries. Doing so may cause the DRM to decide your copy of the game is illegitimate. This is something you definitely want to avoid. It would also violate the product's EULA."

Hello Phil, Does this include using the bcdedit /set increaseuserva 3072 entry?

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That command doesn't alter the game's binary, so it shouldn't trip the DRM. It also, therefore, doesn't violate the EULA.

Understand that if used improperly it could cause crashes or erratic behavior for you, so be cautious and make sure that you know what you're doing. Any changes you make are your responsibility - be sure you understand the consequences AND how to reverse them if necessary.

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That command doesn't alter the game's binary, so it shouldn't trip the DRM. It also, therefore, doesn't violate the EULA.

Understand that if used improperly it could cause crashes or erratic behavior for you, so be cautious and make sure that you know what you're doing. Any changes you make are your responsibility - be sure you understand the consequences AND how to reverse them if necessary.

Thanks Phil, I'll study it a bit,actually I'll get my son to study it a bit, and give it a try.

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Just because you haven't noticed it tripping the DRM doesn't mean it hasn't. Your not noticing means nothing, because you have no idea what to look for. Hence my advice.

I'll repeat myself: "Don't use these tools, or otherwise attempt to modify the game's binaries. Doing so may cause the DRM to decide your copy of the game is illegitimate. This is something you definitely want to avoid. It would also violate the product's EULA."

You game is already crashing, how much worse exactly do you think it'll get?

I agree that using Win7 and it's switch is the more elegant method compared to patching the binary.

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You game is already crashing, how much worse exactly do you think it'll get?

I agree that using Win7 and it's switch is the more elegant method compared to patching the binary.

I think it could get a lot worse.

To quote a post made by Moon back in April:

"And there is one important thing missing: our new online activation system comes with new anti-hacking protection which will make people who play a pirated copy VERY unhappy. They will be surprised to find tanks missing, vehicles not being able to turn, game crashes etc. I don't want to into specifics, though."

http://www.battlefront.com/community/showpost.php?p=1245019&postcount=64

Tamper with the DRM at your own risk. Altering the binary is tampering with the DRM, which is why I've been telling people *not* to use the LARGEADDRESSAWARE tools under any circumstances.

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Tamper with your customers at your own risk :) Nice way to treat people who only want to work around the code problems you put in and you fail to communicate about. Because misidentification of paying customers as non-paying ones happens all the time in the world of DRM. Not that I actually believe any of what Moon says there but just the threat is a slap in the face of paying customers.

Anyway...

The fact (if it is) that this makes 1 to 2 GB more virtual memory available and seems to work doesn't mean anything to you? If it works, and it seems it does, why don't you set the bloody flag yourself? I would ask you whether you even tried but you already said this is somehow a business secret so that -what- Panzer Command doesn't copy your game by next week?

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Redwolf, your arguments are very familiar to me. It's the sort of thing that has lead to Super Fund cleaning sites and the BP Gulf Oil disaster, amongst other things. I'm sure BP came to the same conclusions as you when they thought "we cut corners all the time and our wells don't blow up, so it must be safe". Same logic says smoking doesn't cause cancer because when you light up you don't get a tumor within minutes. Or that lead paint inside a house is perfectly fine, or mercury in the water supply is harmless, or any number of other things.

For your sake I hope no future potential employer of yours reads this thread. I know I'd certainly not hire anybody with such an attitude of arrogant indifference to the complexities and subtleties of cause/effect. Especially when you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.

To our paying customers, here's what you should know about this whole situation:

Tampering with binary is potentially harmful. There are a number of reasons why, only some of which have been touched on in this thread. It is entirely possible that careful code hacking could alleviate the OOM error for some people some of the times, but it could create crashes and adverse gameplay the rest of the time. Even for scenarios that normally don't produce a OOM. Which is why altering the binary is against the EULA.

Can we stop you from hacking the CM EXE? Obviously not. However, if you do you should know that you're playing Russian roulette with the entire game's ability to function correctly, not just tweaking one isolated behavior.

If this were an easy problem to fix we would have done so already. Trust the people who have a long history of making wargames for you to enjoy, not an outsider with a chip on his shoulder larger than a Maus. Especially one who has a track record of being correct that is on par with the average bank CEO.

Steve

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