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Tactical Wargamer

CM:N Safe to say 2011?

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You told us the British Forces Module sold much better than expected. Does this mean Non- Russian sales of Afghanistan are better than expected so far too?

Yup! After less than 1.5 weeks on sale we've got to about 50% of our expected sales of CM: Afghanistan for its entire lifetime. This pleases us :D

Preorder sales of NATO are quite strong as well, especially since we expect the majority of sales from NATO to be download only (which can't be preordered).

There are a handful of people that actively want Battlefront to fail for their own extremely selfish, and convoluted, reasons. Every time we say something positive about our sales they say we're lying and we're just a stone's throw away from going out of business. The fact they've been repeating this for 3 years doesn't seem to phase them. The fact that we've actually expanded our full time staff since then is also apparently yet more evidence, in their eyes, that our sales are crap and we're on our last gasp.

If we're on a road to failure with CMx2, as the doomsayers keep saying, then I for one hope to continue on this path to ruin because it's better than the road we were on with CMx1. Much, much better :D Which is important since we have now the largest full time staff we've ever had plus third party partners. It's not like we have other jobs to make ends meet, so this whole gaming thing we do is rather important for our lifestyles :)

Steve

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Any formal date certain for the demise of BFC?

More importantly, what will be the drink of choice at the wake? Whiskey sounds like a fitting choice.

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More importantly, what will be the drink of choice at the wake? Whiskey sounds like a fitting choice.

I don't drink (anymore) so I'll just join Charles in getting throughly wired on Red Bull

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Yup! After less than 1.5 weeks on sale we've got to about 50% of our expected sales of CM: Afghanistan for its entire lifetime. This pleases us :D

Preorder sales of NATO are quite strong as well, especially since we expect the majority of sales from NATO to be download only (which can't be preordered).

There are a handful of people that actively want Battlefront to fail for their own extremely selfish, and convoluted, reasons. Every time we say something positive about our sales they say we're lying and we're just a stone's throw away from going out of business. The fact they've been repeating this for 3 years doesn't seem to phase them. The fact that we've actually expanded our full time staff since then is also apparently yet more evidence, in their eyes, that our sales are crap and we're on our last gasp.

If we're on a road to failure with CMx2, as the doomsayers keep saying, then I for one hope to continue on this path to ruin because it's better than the road we were on with CMx1. Much, much better :D Which is important since we have now the largest full time staff we've ever had plus third party partners. It's not like we have other jobs to make ends meet, so this whole gaming thing we do is rather important for our lifestyles :)

Steve

Great news for us that enjoy modern settings: look forward to more :)

SF was rough when you guys released it; but it is probably the most supported game I've come across. That support and the mod/ battle makers have made it a diamond.

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Yup...people get pretty angry when they don't understand something and they lash out at it and those responsible for it. I can completely understand that games like CM are not interesting or desirable for people whose idea of wargaming is Company of Heroes. What I don't get is the hostility launched at anyone who tries to offer an alternative to the overused RTS model. It's almost as though they think that a developer is OBLIGED to offer up another clone of the same titles we've seen before but with flashier production values and still nothing under the hood that pushes the envelope in any way whatsoever. I was excited about Company of Heroes when I first saw some initial press and screen shots. That was before I found out essentially what the game really was all about. After that discovery, I knew I knew was no longer interested in the title and forgot about it. What I didn't do was develop a burning desire to see all the employees at Relic die in a plane crash over the Everglades. Call me abnormal.

Chalk it up to fixed thinking......

I remember back in the way early eighties when I had acquired a copy of AH's Arab-Israeli Wars. Of course, anyone who's been a player of simulation board games can attest how difficult it can be to find opponents for a game. So I've convinced my (actually very bright) cousin to play a scenario with me, even though he knows it could take up 3 or so hours of his life. I let him choose which side he prefers and he decides to play the Arab nation (Egypt, I guess, I can't remember which scenario), most likely because the scenario gave them many more units than the Israelites.

Well, about 1/3 of the way through the game, he realizes he's pretty much being stomped. He can't grasp how his quantitative advantage can be so offset by the qualitative advantage of my units. The he gets pretty angry. I try to tell him that the game is attempting to simulate a real world event and that part of the appeal is just playing and not necessarily winning, but he would obviously get better the more he played around with tactics and such.

But we never got through that game and he quit in a huff. Just goes to show you can never underestimate the power of someone's preconceived notions even in something as simple as a board game.

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I remember back in the way early eighties when I had acquired a copy of AH's Arab-Israeli Wars. Of course, anyone who's been a player of simulation board games can attest how difficult it can be to find opponents for a game. So I've convinced my (actually very bright) cousin to play a scenario with me, even though he knows it could take up 3 or so hours of his life. I let him choose which side he prefers and he decides to play the Arab nation (Egypt, I guess, I can't remember which scenario), most likely because the scenario gave them many more units than the Israelites.

Well, about 1/3 of the way through the game, he realizes he's pretty much being stomped. He can't grasp how his quantitative advantage can be so offset by the qualitative advantage of my units. The he gets pretty angry. I try to tell him that the game is attempting to simulate a real world event and that part of the appeal is just playing and not necessarily winning, but he would obviously get better the more he played around with tactics and such.

But we never got through that game and he quit in a huff. Just goes to show you can never underestimate the power of someone's preconceived notions even in something as simple as a board game.

I think that may be the key difference between a wargamer from a regular gamer. For a wargamer, the primary drive of playing is seeing a historical situation laid out, and then seeing what happens when these tactics are tried, or if this unit was substituted with that unit. Winning can be important, don't get me wrong, but it is never the only thing. Whenever I have played a wargame with another person, I have never really cared who won, so much as enjoy the action unfold. I think its why I enjoy we-go so much. Either way, it's not an attitude you see very often in other game genres.

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Yup...people get pretty angry when they don't understand something and they lash out at it and those responsible for it.

Yup, though after 3 years of hatching conspiracy theories to support an imaginary construct that serves as an angry outlet for things which have nothing to do with the target is a bit different. It's something that takes up large chapters in any psychology book.

I can completely understand that games like CM are not interesting or desirable for people whose idea of wargaming is Company of Heroes.

Or if their idea of a wargame is something other than what we produce. The Company of Heroes peanut gallery can be easily brushed off because they will go away quickly. The ones who claim some sort of God given right to determine what wargames should be allowed to exist are a persistent and (very unfortunately) long term problem for the wargaming community. Both are completely irrelevant to us, so nobody has to worry about us going the route of Company of Heroes or back to ASL on the computer. Neither have ever held an appeal to us, neither ever will.

Steve

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I think that may be the key difference between a wargamer from a regular gamer. For a wargamer, the primary drive of playing is seeing a historical situation laid out, and then seeing what happens when these tactics are tried, or if this unit was substituted with that unit

I disagree with that definition of a wargamer - the situation does not have to be historical. Historical scenarios just happen to be a wildly popular setting in wargames, but there are PLENTY of fictional scenarios and games as well.

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I disagree with that definition of a wargamer - the situation does not have to be historical. Historical scenarios just happen to be a wildly popular setting in wargames, but there are PLENTY of fictional scenarios and games as well.

Oh I agree completely. For example, to call Star Fleet battles anything other then a wargame is ridiculous. You could feasibly call it a strategy game, but no one other then a wargamer would look at that rulebook and go, "ooh! I've gotta play this!!"

As an aside, I have always thought that the ability to fully know and understand the entire ruleset of Star Fleet Battles and ASL(with all attending modules) should get you an honorary paralegal degree.

Mostly my main point is that with wargaming, seeing how everything plays it is as entertaining or more so the whoever won or lost.

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There are a handful of people that actively want Battlefront to fail for their own extremely selfish, and convoluted, reasons. Every time we say something positive about our sales they say we're lying and we're just a stone's throw away from going out of business. The fact they've been repeating this for 3 years doesn't seem to phase them. The fact that we've actually expanded our full time staff since then is also apparently yet more evidence, in their eyes, that our sales are crap and we're on our last gasp.

Steve

One would think with their level of expertise and genius at all things wargamey they would've spent the years since CMSF was released making the war game to end all war games...It's amazing... they know everything there is to know about games, sales, design, programing and yet not one product has come out...huh! Imagine that? All that talent going to waste...shame.

Instead they hang in their dark corner of the internet, wrapped in a bitterness that borders on mental sickness, giving each other a reach around every time one of them makes a funny, which includes attacking people here, people I might add that have actually contributed to the game in a positive manner, from design and testing to modding, to people who just plain enjoy playing. And woe to anybody who can actually criticize and argue game merits/mechanics without acting like an arrogant puke...they are just BFC fanboys....in my case, "uber fanboy"... Hell, they'll even pick apart posts down to single words and examine and re-examine what was written, looking for hidden messages and glyphs...the secret Illuminati code...gossiping and tee heeing the whole time. Then again the ring leader is a twisted little worm whose talents include an over exploded sense of self importance and collecting restraining orders from forum females...so I guess it's not so surprising.

But it's really kind of sad that a collection of people could spend their lives bitching about one single thing in a world of billions of things, instead of living life and finding something that actually makes them happy...unless of course bitterness and bile are what makes you happy...then they are in Nirvana...add circle...add jerk...rinse and repeat for the next five years.

Mord.

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I can completely understand that games like CM are not interesting or desirable for people whose idea of wargaming is Company of Heroes.

But the RTS guys...they move on from their hate and disdain...too many games coming out rapid fire for them to linger on one negative...

It's those self proscribed "Real Wargamers" who are the worst ones....basically it boils down to wrath of a woman scorned and all that...they think CM betrayed them by not staying stuck in 2000 so they must constantly ridicule and lash out. They are the fat ugly girl who gets dumped for the double D hottie at the prom.

It's like this, I hate the band Poison...I have for over twenty years...nobody knew that until just now...because I have better things to do with my time than worry about something I hate...I'd rather listen to and talk about bands I love. The guys above, the "Real Wargamers" they'd rather rub poop on their selves like war paint and poke each other with sticks until mouths foam than give up that hatred. LOL. Bizarre.

Mord.

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Yup! After less than 1.5 weeks on sale we've got to about 50% of our expected sales of CM: Afghanistan for its entire lifetime. This pleases us :D

Preorder sales of NATO are quite strong as well, especially since we expect the majority of sales from NATO to be download only (which can't be preordered).

There are a handful of people that actively want Battlefront to fail for their own extremely selfish, and convoluted, reasons. Every time we say something positive about our sales they say we're lying and we're just a stone's throw away from going out of business. The fact they've been repeating this for 3 years doesn't seem to phase them. The fact that we've actually expanded our full time staff since then is also apparently yet more evidence, in their eyes, that our sales are crap and we're on our last gasp.

If we're on a road to failure with CMx2, as the doomsayers keep saying, then I for one hope to continue on this path to ruin because it's better than the road we were on with CMx1. Much, much better :D Which is important since we have now the largest full time staff we've ever had plus third party partners. It's not like we have other jobs to make ends meet, so this whole gaming thing we do is rather important for our lifestyles :)

Steve

Anyways, back to the thread starters question, will I be playing CM ww2 set in France in 1944 this year or not?

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compared to sat in front of the laptop, mug of tea steaming, pixel truppen advancing on Carentan, German pixel truppen in the windows cocking their MG42s................

why would i want to go snowboarding in the Himalayas?

I dare say you would be waiting a bit longer for your pixel truppen to advance on Carentan... No Fallschirmjäger until the 1st module release, or Waffen SS for that matter... :(

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But the RTS guys...they move on from their hate and disdain...too many games coming out rapid fire for them to linger on one negative...

That's quite true. If I play a demo for random RTS of the week, and I think it sucks, the developers will never know about my opinions because I couldn't be bothered to invest 1 minute of my time beyond what I spent on the demo. But for someone who has very narrow interests in an underserved market, it's easier to see how focused negativity can come about from people who (frankly) have nothing better to do with their time.

Anyways, back to the thread starters question, will I be playing CM ww2 set in France in 1944 this year or not?

No way to know for sure until 23:59 December 31st, 2010 :) Having said that, the intention is still for a 2010 release. The game engine for Normandy will be feature "complete", excepting one fairly simple thing, probably next week. The question then is... how long will it take to polish everything? It's a question we never have a good answer for, but 3 months for polishing would be rather long.

Steve

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... The game engine for Normandy will be feature "complete", excepting one fairly simple thing, probably next week...

Steve

Thanks for the info Steve, out of curiosity, how long does implimenting "one fairly simple thing" take? (barring the dreaded "unforseen consequences" of course) I'm not trying to nail you down, btw, I know there may be other development aspects that need to take priority over said "one fairly simple thing" and that you may not get around to it for some time as a result.

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That's quite true. If I play a demo for random RTS of the week, and I think it sucks, the developers will never know about my opinions because I couldn't be bothered to invest 1 minute of my time beyond what I spent on the demo. But for someone who has very narrow interests in an underserved market, it's easier to see how focused negativity can come about from people who (frankly) have nothing better to do with their time.

No way to know for sure until 23:59 December 31st, 2010 :) Having said that, the intention is still for a 2010 release. The game engine for Normandy will be feature "complete", excepting one fairly simple thing, probably next week. The question then is... how long will it take to polish everything? It's a question we never have a good answer for, but 3 months for polishing would be rather long.

Steve

Looks like it will be a fine Christmas (barring unforseen circumstances!)

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