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jon_j_rambo

[UFC #1 / AAR] Minty Monty (Allies) vs Living Legend (Axis)

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I know how you feel.

Maybe air units should be allowed to attack in bad weather, but with a high percantage of not finding the target and start and landing damages.

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I know how you feel.

Maybe air units should be allowed to attack in bad weather, but with a high percantage of not finding the target and start and landing damages.

Just the breaks, I'll have my shot as Allies or a new game :)

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Most excellent suggestion xwood. Big Al has kind of a mechanism like this in his mod, where the target is allowed to evade the attack, it simulates the reality of imperfect conditions for combat resolution and think it works quite well.

Now in SC where you have turns that are weeks long, sometimes months, it seems highly unrealistic that there wouldn't be a window of opportunity to conduct air strikes in that time frame albeit they may be unproductive, hence the evasion notification.

Now you've created yet another consideration for the players to contemplate. Do I reinforce, upgrade my air units or sorti them in a possible effective strike knowing that the chances are much hindered than when in good weather conditions. I also want to state that I think air units shouldn't be completely grounded during bad weather conditions and have to use the operate function to avoid being involved in enemy ground force attacks.

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I guess we're getting into more detail. The game is the game.

I'm just frustrated on the June 1944 German turn immediately after D-Day. I could do nothing. Force to operand all my Air (which as away from the frontlines too, but the next Allied turn they'd be attacked), the cost was basically 200+ MMPs (or 3-Corps coming out the following turn.

Just didn't seem realistic. Else, that first wave is pushed off the map + 3-Corps the following turn.....HUGE swing, but so is war & gaming.

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Further to this supposed problem of representing reality is that again, in the time frame of a SC turn, does anyone think that an air organization wouldn't immediately evacuate their facilities when faced with an imminent ground attack?

I propose that an air unit that is moved next to by an enemy unit should automatically relocate to an adjacent tile of the most closely located friendly town/city/port unless the owning player has selected the "defend" option.

Yeah I know...a bit more micro-management....but just a bit.

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October 1944

Rain, rain, rain...............What do you think I'm going to say? RAIN, RAIN, RAIN !!! I've had 3 turns in 1944 without rain. All of Europe & Russia is rain.

I never got to use the Luftwaffen in 1944.

RAIN, RAIN, RAIN. June, September, and now October. I had 3 turns to use the Luftwaffen in 1944. Repeat, three turns to use the Luftwaffen in 1944. Read the AAR. Any turn with not rain, I kick ass.

I surrender.....the Luftwaffen was defeated by weather.

The Japs did great this game. So did the Germans. In June 1944, I controlled all of Europe, Urkraine Russia, Spain, Norway, Sweden, etc. I was getting 480 MMPs per turn. I had all the Luftwaffen, nearly all the infantry, and a little light on tanks. My units did lose some experience in battles & death, but HQ's had plenty of experience. I held the line at all points (France, Turkey, Russia). It was obvious the Allies were going to triple team Germany because the Japs control the entire Pacific Rim + Eastern Russia.

The Allies landed in June 1944, he went thru me like butter, because my Luftwaffen was worthless. Even on a couple of his turns, Germany was covered in rain, yet France & the invasion part of Russia was not. I was absolutely screwed. No intercepts, no nothing. No counters possible. D-Day would have been squashed in one turn. I had fortresses around Waraw, Konigsburg, Paris, and Germany.......everything was sealed tight.

Oh well, I lost. Must say, I feel cheated by the game. Minty played well, pressed Germany, which is fine. Think about a turn with all rain for your troops. I miss out on multiple easy ground safe kills against paratroops, and corp stealing ports (Italy). I spend all MMPs on operands for air, putting them in a "sucky" place for protection and lousy counter ranges. Nothing I can do.

the Allies had nothing on the Luftwaffen. I had +4 tech, and 3-fighters with 5-star 15-strength. They were unstoppable......that was my strategy, he couldn't break in. France lost it. I had to operand out air, and operand in some weak ground. He got free cover. Jan thru May, June, Sept, Oct.......I was grounded. Read the AAR, and the excitement of my killing.

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I believe a surrender has to be agreed by both sides Rambo and it is not accepted. I didn't take you for a quitter.

The game gets to end the minute you stop enjoying it? Play on, part of this is learning and showing the foks. The other part is simply I deserve to get to play out my strategies.. VE day is fairly close but VJ day is a long way off.

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Dude, you call me a name, a quitter, because I surrendered? The game is over. This is where I say "good game" to you. You won, congrats. What else am I to do? It will take you probably 2-years at the most to take Changsta for the win.

This is the part where you say "good game" too. We switch sides, life goes on. Have you seen the victory conditions? You have 3 years to get Changsta to "actually win". Considering you have 3 major nations (soon enough) against 1 major......safe to say, you'll capture that city.

Wouldn't you rather switch sides?

You won dude. I tried my best. Yeah, I got rain, oh well. We played to October 1944.

This is UFC pal, "I tap out"......

I'm hardly a quitter,

-Legend

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Great game. Thanks for it. You're a good player. I'd just have liked to have tried out what I was about to do in the pacific. When I normally play PBEM the prize is the other's password. Feel free to send it unless it is the same one you always use.

I'll switch sides with you for another game but not for a little while. Wife is rightly telling me I spend too much time on this thing.

So my analysis of the game is a little different from Rambos. Allied strategy was initially very cautious with my intention to fight deep in russia ( I have a bunch of forts from sverdolsk to novosibrsk) but as soon as it became clear that he was invading Spain ,that Barby would be late and that the Japs were still heavily committed to finishing the Chinese I moved the entire Red army up west in summer 41 and threw a bunch of commando and paras at every chance to stretch him.

Germans had a terrible game , he invested far too much in super strength units and was very light in numbers.

Yoda always said the Germans have to stay on timetable to win. Colin I is a very vocal advocate of doing anything to throw jerry off track and in this game Rambo let himself get too distracted by Norway , Spain , a uboat campaign etc

Japanese fared a little better but made little impact against russia despite vast superiority of their forces there. After 2 years of fighting they held only the 4 most eastern towns/ cities. I was expecting a long drawn out affair with the yanks but once I saw all those tanks in China the americans just steamed west capturing all the islands and smashing the IJN with nothing but a couple of Australian land units. I then got cocky and lost some ships as far west as Singapore and had to wait 2 years for more reinforcements but it was a cheap and fasy island hop and meant I could throw everything american at Europe.

As for the rain / air issue at the end. yes a bit of bad luck but I can't see how his fighters could have stopped the 6 allied tanks I had plus infantry even with clear skies. Even if the allies had had no cover (and 7 allied fighters plus 3 CV withthe yanks on lv5 jets is not insignificant) there just weren't enough jackboots on the ground.

Rambo is tactically very very strong and I learnt a few things from him. He does complain about the weather a lot though.....

THANK YOU EVERYONE FOR TUNING IN AND I HOPE YOU ENJOYED UFC1 AND LEARNT FROM OUR MISTAKES.

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My strategy was to gain all the ground I could & delay Barby. My units were all about experience. Yes, the number of my ground units was low.....because I put everything into air. I maxed out the number of fighters. I think I built all the Tactical bombers too. All Luftwaffen had at least 2-star experience. Swedish Air, Romanian Air, Italian Air too....had 3 fighters with 5-stars. HQ's had awesome experience too. In France those "fighters" 5-star + HQ-5-star + 4-tech didn't lose sorties. Most damage I'd take was 1-hit, turn-after-turn......offense or defense. Against Tanks, they would do 2:0 pre-roll attacks. That's pretty awesome, when I could use fighters only to melt a Tank, draw out RAF/USAAF, then send in Tactical. That's why I wasn't happy with the weather. Oh well, I took the risk & lost.

The Japs controlled the Pacific Rim. Yeah, I was down to 3-Carriers, 1-BB, 1-CR, 2-DD, 1-SB....because everything went into the ground units. I had maxed out the ground. Japan was an entrenched fortress.

Once the Allies saw the Japs were tought, the Allies in 1944 triple teamed Germany, just like Axis & Allies board game. With the D-Day landing (2nd landing) in 1944 & my failed effort (or no effort due to rain), the game was over. I had to get him then. Spain's MMPs were cutoff, I had risk units in Norway/Sweden coming back to mainland, etc.

When Germany owns all the land, it takes alot to garrison it.

Minty is a good player. He tries to emulate his hero, Terif by feeling & guessing for soft spots. He loves commando raids & paratroops. He won the game fair & square. He positions himself well for the long run too, like int he Pacific, he picked his naval spots & watched the time lines well.

I was more than ready for D-Day. Matter of fact, I was exciting when it happenend. One turn, one lousy turn of weather. Trust me, I was more than ready. That was my strategy. I had ALL forts filled, entrenched. But it was with Corps, because it was upto the Air to knock off the Allies.

Yes, like Terif says, don't put MMPs into Air & Naval. I had some Sub wars too. Oh well, I like to play every game different. I'm not going to play cookie cutter everytime, that bores me.

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Yes, it was exciting to start UFC #1 league. This was a great game, lots of action. We fought all over the world. The fact we got heated about weather in 1944, just shows you how much of a battle it was.

If we would continue on, it wouldn't take Minty 3 years to take Changsta. He would probably take Berlin in early 1945 (it was November when I surrendered) with the Russians on the ground. I'm assuming winter snow would slow his air though mine be destroyed by ground & pound by then. The Reds would get Berlin probably in Feb. 1945 (my guess). Then, just operand all air to Borneo (he'll have that in a turn or two). Then just get a port on the Rim, and slam units in, marching to Changsta for the win.

Aren't the victory conditions weird to you all?

I was a little rusty on playing too. This is more like traditional SC-1. I've been playing Vypuero's Campaigns for the last couple years.

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When I normally play PBEM the prize is the other's password. Feel free to send it unless it is the same one you always use.

So what we need is in truth a "surrender" or "resign" button to end the game.

Sending passwords to your opponent can't be the solution.

Could work like this:

click on the resign / surrender button

the game saves this turn

you send the turn to your opponent

he gets a question like "do you accept"

if yes the game draws away the fog of war, you see everything, maybe even a nice animation and song & dance

you save

your opponent get the info "surrender accepted"

and again: open map

Right now it is a bit dissapointing not to get the chance to take a last look on the map and into the statistics and summaries.

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Oh well, I like to play every game different. I'm not going to play cookie cutter everytime, that bores me.

I seem to recall you wiping out my allies with Air a few years back in a previous version of the game......so perhaps not really so different in in every game.... :)

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I seem to recall you wiping out my allies with Air a few years back in a previous version of the game......so perhaps not really so different in in every game.... :)

New generation of players. So far they are all by the book. Whereas many of the Icons enjoy some hotdogging.

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In a way you're right SO, strategies are similar but the mechanics of prosecution are different game to game. As Axis you make the early major decisions, Sealion or blockade, Spain, Africa, delay or not Barbarossa, China or the SRA and from there its kind of wide open after that, you take what the Allies give.

The Allies have less scripted strategies as they are reactive, dependent upon Axis moves as to where their inclinations unfold, but there are similar theaters of combat that would be considered the conservative moves.

Earlier I believe, Minty mentioned "Rising Sun Victorious" and I'll add "Hitler's War" to books that investigate possible viable Axis strategical deviations. I like both books and many times I'll a take a page out of the lesson and see if I can pull it off in a game of SC, its a most instructive historical experiment, always interesting.

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So what we need is in truth a "surrender" or "resign" button to end the game.

Sending passwords to your opponent can't be the solution.

Could work like this:

click on the resign / surrender button

the game saves this turn

you send the turn to your opponent

he gets a question like "do you accept"

if yes the game draws away the fog of war, you see everything, maybe even a nice animation and song & dance

you save

your opponent get the info "surrender accepted"

and again: open map

Right now it is a bit dissapointing not to get the chance to take a last look on the map and into the statistics and summaries.

I would like to play on past victory decisions, if the other player is willing?

so both players would get the screen re - one side has gained a Victory, would you like to continue for total victory?

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This is where a point system would keep players and observers updated as far as where the advantage lies from turn to turn.

Panther Games has a victory meter that changes as the game progresses.

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IMO points systems are a cop out unless looking at limited scenarios outside of a wider context (eg something like Kursk or el Alamein).

This is WORLD WAR - you should have a pretty good idfea who won and who didn't!!:D

And if it ends with allied victory some time in 1945 it is a draw.

A long time ago I got berated soundly in htese forums for daring to suggest that vistory/defeat/draw should only be measured agains the historical situation - I must be a sucker for punishment 'cos I still hold that view, and I still think that games that are "rebalanced" to give hte axis a 50% chance of winning are poor simulations :)

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