John Kettler Posted October 2, 2008 Share Posted October 2, 2008 BigDuke6, Common sense isn't, and I think you'd be a major boost to many intelligence entities, whether governmental or private. I like the way you think and present your conclusions. As for the pirates, as scary as the tank situation is, I'm far more concerned with what's on that Iranian freighter that's killing and sickening the pirates. cabal23, Glad you liked it! Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyD Posted October 2, 2008 Share Posted October 2, 2008 "Anyway, if you're a ship owner considering arming your ship" I hear some big cruise lines sailing those waters field a high tech focused sound beam guns on their ships. Small boat approaches, the sound beam gun gets fired up, pirates don't want to come any closer all of a sudden. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted October 2, 2008 Share Posted October 2, 2008 "Anyway, if you're a ship owner considering arming your ship" I hear some big cruise lines sailing those waters field a high tech focused sound beam guns on their ships. Small boat approaches, the sound beam gun gets fired up, pirates don't want to come any closer all of a sudden. Actually, that's an SS-designed death ray. They've been secretly perfecting it in their underground base in Antarctica and now it's ready for field testing. If all goes well with that, it will be mounted on their fleet of flying saucers and soon the swastika will fly over all the capitals of the world! Remember, you heard it here first. Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homo ferricus Posted October 2, 2008 Share Posted October 2, 2008 "Anyway, if you're a ship owner considering arming your ship" I hear some big cruise lines sailing those waters field a high tech focused sound beam guns on their ships. Small boat approaches, the sound beam gun gets fired up, pirates don't want to come any closer all of a sudden. yep, LRAD. http://www.defense-update.com/products/l/LRAD.htm This was an interesting article i found, explicitly mentions use in maritime non-lethal self-defense along with an example of its use off the Somali coast by a cruise liner to successfully repel pirates attacking with RPGs. Also mentions the Navy using them in in the Gulf to regulate shipping coming and going from Basra. It also mentions something about (armed) unmanned surface vehicles (USV) quoting the article now, "as international maritime law does not allow commercial vessels to carry heavy armament." The second half is about MRAD and its use by ground forces during OIF, it seems. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike_the_wino Posted October 2, 2008 Share Posted October 2, 2008 It also mentions something about (armed) unmanned surface vehicles (USV) quoting the article now, "as international maritime law does not allow commercial vessels to carry heavy armament." I would imagine international maritime law does not allow piracy either. Arm yourself and be alive to argue your point or unarmed and dead. Tough choice. Time to bring back the buccaneer. What's a pirate's head worth these days? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homo ferricus Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 I would imagine international maritime law does not allow piracy either. Arm yourself and be alive to argue your point or unarmed and dead. Tough choice. Time to bring back the buccaneer. What's a pirate's head worth these days? Well i agree completely, but strictly legally speaking... I'm not sure what kind of clauses (with respect to international law) exist that let non-military ships respond (or perhaps, prepare to respond) to pirate attacks with lethal force. I'm interested with this USV stuff, maybe i'll do some reading here... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlefront.com Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 I guess the crew has no choice but to taunt the pirates a second time Steve 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dima Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 I haven't been on top of news on this situation, but from what I know, I am just wondering: is it possible that pirates didn't really know what the ship was carrying that they were about to capture? And now they are stuck with no easy way to backpedal? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purpheart23 Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 I haven't been on top of news on this situation, but from what I know, I am just wondering: is it possible that pirates didn't really know what the ship was carrying that they were about to capture? And now they are stuck with no easy way to backpedal? Yep(all my intellectual glory). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purpheart23 Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 I would imagine international maritime law does not allow piracy either. Arm yourself and be alive to argue your point or unarmed and dead. Tough choice. Time to bring back the buccaneer. What's a pirate's head worth these days? Yeah i think i'd rather be judged by twelve than carried by six. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homo ferricus Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 About the most that a cargo ship (or any other considerably large ship) can do against a pirate attack (granted it is not armed with any lethal or non-lethal weapons, and/or is not being escorted by warships, USVs, aircraft or mercs) is to turn vigorously left to right, essentially doing a slalom in an attempt to create waves large enough to flip the pirate boat. I imagine it looks more like a desperate, pitiful flail for life from the top down viewpoint--something perhaps comparable to a brontosaurus getting clusterf***ed by velociraptors, for those of us who appreciate classics such as "Jurassic Park". or perhaps it is more like an old tymer bludgeoning an SSN half to death with his metaphorical club of social ruin and self-esteem deprivation leaving the victim motionless in a pool of his own newly discovered doubt, dissonance, and hatred for the world on a Peng thread, for those of us with too much time on our hands. :-) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 or perhaps it is more like an old tymer bludgeoning an SSN half to death with his metaphorical club of social ruin and self-esteem deprivation leaving the victim motionless in a pool of his own newly discovered doubt, dissonance, and hatred for the world... Sounds good to me. Suppose we could bottle that? Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zmoney Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 I bet Bush and his dad were there. And don't forget the mastermind behind it all............. THE EVIL KARL ROVE. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisND Posted October 3, 2008 Author Share Posted October 3, 2008 As for the pirates, as scary as the tank situation is, I'm far more concerned with what's on that Iranian freighter that's killing and sickening the pirates. You've obviously never had the ship's chef's cooking. :eek: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 Here's more on the seized Iranian vessel, its scary cargo and other developments. http://www.longwarjournal.org/archives/2008/09/mystery_surrounds_hi.php Normal Dude, Dad used to have T-shirt which read "Navy Cook--Death from Within!" Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SgtMuhammed Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 I thought this was interesting: "A tense standoff is underway in northeastern Somalia between pirates, Somali authorities..." There are Somali authorities? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted October 11, 2008 Share Posted October 11, 2008 It appears at least one cruise line was on the ball regarding ship security. The report is dated, but what's fascinating is that something rather like/the same as the American Technologies, Inc. directional sound weapon was used to thwart the attack--in 2005! http://intellibriefs.blogspot.com/2005/12/how-real-is-threat-from-maritime.html Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 The Somali prates have become very high profile indeed. The MV Faina is still under guard at sea, some 10 nations are now involved in antipiracy measures, but the pirates just took another vessel. Their reach and armament have become dramatically extended, now being deemed a threat to 150 miles out, with GPS, satellite phones and guns through 20mm. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081016/ap_on_re_af/af_somalia_fighting_pirates Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seanachai Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 The Somali prates have become very high profile indeed. The MV Faina is still under guard at sea, some 10 nations are now involved in antipiracy measures, but the pirates just took another vessel. Their reach and armament have become dramatically extended, now being deemed a threat to 150 miles out, with GPS, satellite phones and guns through 20mm. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081016/ap_on_re_af/af_somalia_fighting_pirates Regards, John Kettler All of which threats look far less intimidating in the hands of dead people being nibbled by eels at the bottom of 100 feet of water... Are the Ukrainian owners still claiming that they're 'worried about the lives of the crew', as opposed to their expensive ship and its high profile, not to mention high priced cargo? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigduke6 Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Well, they say they are, but also, they can't tell any one what's going on because of "sensitive negotiations in progress" etc etc. Of course, the crew family members are talking to the press and saying the government isn't doing jack, they want their husbands and fathers back, screw the value of the ship and the cargo. I am beginning to get the feeling the big powers have decided to make an example of this ship because of the high-profile cargo, and its crew might well pay the price. Just a hunch at this point. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted October 19, 2008 Share Posted October 19, 2008 Here's a thread detailing many aspects of the issue. Note it's now a NATO item of interest, too. The pirates have been busy! http://earthboppin.net/talkshop/international/messages/44906.html The Iranian mystery vessel MV Deyanat has been released, but we still don't know much about what really happened or what was actually aboard and why. Thread here. http://earthboppin.net/talkshop/international/messages/44900.html Seanachai, If I'm following your argument correctly, you seem to be saying that as the pirates "heavy up" and come more and more to resemble a recognizable standard naval threat operating well out to sea, they become vulnerable to standard solutions to, say, the FPB problem. If so, then I concur. They were much better off remaining an inshore threat that looks civilian. Speaking of that, one of the recent seizures took place a mere 17 miles off the coast of Somalia. What was the skipper thinking to go in so close to a known hostile shore? Bigduke6, Am surprised someone didn't use SpecOps already to take down the MV Faina. Can you tell us anything new about the real story on the MV Denyat? Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted October 19, 2008 Share Posted October 19, 2008 Bigduke6, Er, MV Deyanat. Was able to fix it in one post, but time ran out here. Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Flash! Somali pirates have achieved to the heights and are now authorized by the Somali government as targets for NATO military action! NATO, though, has an ROE problem. Meanwhile, Russia has made logistics arrangements to forward support the frigate Neustrashimy in Yemen. Quite a multinational concentration of naval power off the Horn of Africa. Blackwater sees a new business opportunity, and one nation "spanks" its merchant ship owners and says they need to protect themselves. MV Faina's crew was photographed recently and appears fine. http://informationdissemination.blogspot.com/search/label/Somalia Regards, John Kettler http://informationdissemination.blogspot.com/search/label/Somalia 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigduke6 Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 A couple of points: 1. The Somali "government" authorizing NATO action has no navy, no army past militia, no control over the coast where the pirates live, and little sovereignty over most of Somalia. A go-ahead from them may be enough for NATO to start shooting and think they'll stay the good guys, however, in the region it will look an awful lot like the corrupt government in Mogadishu making a deal with infidel NATO to attack and kill Muslim Somali citizens. Just something to keep in mind. 2. The pirates are now talking to Ukrainian negotiators and even media, and if the reports are accurate the crew is running out of food. No confirm on that. 3. The Ukrainian government right now is saying crew safety is the top priority here, and under most circumstances that would be enough to keep the secret squirrel special ops people away from the cargo ship. Usually, you have to get clearance from the owning nation's government before you can grab a cargo ship on the high seas, after all, if you don't then you sort of are a pirate yourself. 4. A Russian frigate is about to show up as "reinforcements", it was passing the Suez yestiddy. 5. As noted earlier, Blackwater can talk and huff and puff and wave their weapons all they want, the bottom line here is that it's cheaper to pay a bit of ransom than properly to insure or even more costly to place mercenaries aboard the 200,000 ships passing through the region each year. The US government may not care much about how much Blackwater bills them, but the international shipping industry, those boys know all about the bottom line. Besides, what are navies for if not to stick it to the pirates? It's not a very good way to convince taxpayers you're spending their money wisely, if you tell them all those expensive warships and crews, they're really useless when it comes to pirates. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan/california Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Navies aren't useless at all if used correctly, simply establish a shipping lane as far from the Somali coast as the local ocean bottom allows. Or midway between the Somali and Yemeni coast. Whichever you hit first. Then simply allow target practice for any NATO ship directed at any small boat in the lane. Don't blink when the pirates arrange for some dead women and children. One month, fifty or a hundred sunken boats, and no more problems. Blanket the Somali coast with air dropped leaflets of the area where fishing is about to become extremely unsafe if you feel you must. If we allow this to be profitable in local terms it WILL continue. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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