YankeeDog Posted October 10, 2008 Share Posted October 10, 2008 ME, the problem with electricity generation in sunny climes is - nobody lives in the desert (except the arab peoples - and they have the oil. Proof that god does have a sense of humour.) You can only transmit the energy so far before losses and other costs start to make the exercise prohibitive. I'm no engineer, but from what I've read, this isn't as insurmountable a problem as it's made out to be. Power transmission technology has come a long ways in the past 100 years. That's not to say it would currently be practical to, say, power New York City with Solar Power plants in Arizona. But if the generation was there, you could certainly power the entirety of Southern California from the Southwestern Desert. And other regions their own resources to tap. For example, North Dakota is prime for wind power, and is more than close enough to power Chicagoland. Northern New York State also has sizable potential for wind power, as does Long Island Sound, and there is also the potential for Tide and/or Wave Power there. Heck, these sources are actually closer than HydroQuebec, which provides a fair amount of the NE US power today. So from what I understand, the current state of the art in power transmission is capable of transmitting distance loads like this reasonably efficiently. But it is certainly true that our current national grid falls well short; the current system is a hodge-podge of mostly older technology, cobbled together in a way that limits long-distance transmission and efficiency. And it would indeed be a huge project to upgrade it. But the benefits in energy efficiency would be tremendous, and we as a nation have taken on greater challenges; the National Interstate System, which took about 50 years to build, comes to mind. It would be a project well worth the money and effort, IMHO. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dieseltaylor Posted October 10, 2008 Share Posted October 10, 2008 The New Scientist arriving today has features on all the renewable technologies and it will take some time to encapsulate the reports. However on energy transmission over distance the prime answer appears to be to go to DC rather than use AC as you will have much lower transmission losses. Over 1000km AC loses 10% whilst DC loses 3%. Converting to AC at the consumer end is 0.6% Also the use of intelligent machines - air conditioners , fridges etc where a chip can modulate the device on and off when the grid is understrain will provide up to a 20% buffer. Over the weekend perhaps I will cover each resource in a new thread. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
costard Posted October 10, 2008 Share Posted October 10, 2008 YankeeDog - there's the infrastructure spending project to employ the ex-bank workers! The savings generated in efficiency gains should nearly pay for the exercise. diesel - hang on, I though that a resistor under a dc load generated heat (increasing resistance, giving more losses, etc)? And that's why only the earliest transmission models (1880's in NYC) used it. Sure, super conducting materials might do away with that part of the problem, but I'm not aware of any low cost (compared to aluminium wires, anyway), high volume materials that could do the job. I'm pretty close to making this stuff up - any power engineers out there? The self-managing devices sound good - I can't help thinking that the average Joe would just crank the a/c up when it self-regulates and starts to give him less than satisfactory performance. That or go buy one that doesn't self-regulate. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris London Posted October 13, 2008 Share Posted October 13, 2008 The New Scientist arriving today has features on all the renewable technologies and it will take some time to encapsulate the reports. However on energy transmission over distance the prime answer appears to be to go to DC rather than use AC as you will have much lower transmission losses. . that is already done Boris london 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilhammer Posted October 15, 2008 Share Posted October 15, 2008 Karl Marx is back in Fashion with the Germans! http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2008/oct/15/marx-germany-popularity-financial-crisis 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stalins Organ Posted October 15, 2008 Author Share Posted October 15, 2008 China now has about US$ 2 Trillion in foreign currency reserves, and we can probably anti-Beijing/pro-Taipei rhetoric out of Washinton to decrease somewhat in the future - it's not that Washinton is about to be Beijing's poodle any time soon.....but it looks like the Chinese are holding all the cards in the relationship. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
costard Posted October 18, 2008 Share Posted October 18, 2008 I don't know about that - Germany between the wars printed lots of money in an attempt (successful, as it turned out) to devalue the reparations to be made to the victors of WW1. The fact that the German populace had it's savings wiped out as a direct result was just the colateral damage. After all, the Chinese only hold paper, don't they? As long as they hold US treasury bonds (paying about 6%) they have a share in the growth and wealth of the US - I can't see any US government getting away with defaulting on the payments (unless a state of war existed between China and the US). Of course, if the Chinese were to dump the lot... Lars, what would happen there? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars Posted October 18, 2008 Share Posted October 18, 2008 They'd flood the market and get pennies on the dollar. In short, an excellent opportunity for the US to buy them back and retire the debt. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soddball Posted October 18, 2008 Share Posted October 18, 2008 Karl Marx is back in Fashion with the Germans! http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2008/oct/15/marx-germany-popularity-financial-crisis Yes, well, that's the Guardian you're citing there. They are the most ghastly bunch of middle-class Trots you'll ever run in to. Their editorials consist of articles like 'Global Financial Crisis - Now Is The Time For The Working Classes To Rise Up'. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stalins Organ Posted October 19, 2008 Author Share Posted October 19, 2008 I don't know about that - Germany between the wars printed lots of money in an attempt (successful, as it turned out) to devalue the reparations to be made to the victors of WW1. Popular myth unsupported by any facts whatsoever....so reparations were valued in gold - not in marks. 3260 gold marks = 1 kg gold, and annual reparation repayments were to be 2 billion GOLD marks plus 26% of the value of Germany's exports (Hyperinflation in Weimar Germany). The fact that the German populace had it's savings wiped out as a direct result was just the colateral damage. After all, the Chinese only hold paper, don't they? As long as they hold US treasury bonds (paying about 6%) they have a share in the growth and wealth of the US - I can't see any US government getting away with defaulting on the payments (unless a state of war existed between China and the US). Of course, if the Chinese were to dump the lot... Lars, what would happen there? A bankrupt USA? Let your imagination run riot - the end of the petro-dollar meaning the end of US Govt deficits, so hundreds of billions of $$'s wiped from the budget - where are you going to take htem fomr? Military R&D I bet - so say goodbye to your super-tech army, net-centric warfare and the like. Firms selling tech wherever there's a market will ensure that the PLA has as much tech as anyone in 10 years - and a billion soldiers to use it on. Look forward to a police state in the USA (and most other places) - the constitution suspended, civil liberties curtailed, the end of the right to free speech - because otherwise you'll be destroyed by internal discord as privileged groups fight to retain their position at the expense of much of the population. I'm sure there's plenty of other ideas that you might not want to think about.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
costard Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 Thanks Lars. So no joy for the Chinese there. Stalin's Organist - my history teacher would be disappointed with me. Was. Probably still is. Who cares - Look forward to a police state in the USA (and most other places) - the constitution suspended, civil liberties curtailed, the end of the right to free speech - because otherwise you'll be destroyed by internal discord as privileged groups fight to retain their position at the expense of much of the population. so its situation normal - just that the consequences of our all too human stupidity become further reaching and more severe? I doubt China could field 1 billion soldiers - but there is the likelihood of them having about 100 million unmarriable men in a few years time: look out for the growth industries of female slavery, bordellos and the state promotion of a homosatisfying way of life. Or war. Take your pick. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dieseltaylor Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 Original item was brilliant - but unfortunately irrelevant 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 A bankrupt USA? Let your imagination run riot - the end of the petro-dollar meaning the end of US Govt deficits, so hundreds of billions of $$'s wiped from the budget - where are you going to take htem fomr? Military R&D I bet - so say goodbye to your super-tech army, net-centric warfare and the like. Firms selling tech wherever there's a market will ensure that the PLA has as much tech as anyone in 10 years - and a billion soldiers to use it on. Look forward to a police state in the USA (and most other places) - the constitution suspended, civil liberties curtailed, the end of the right to free speech - because otherwise you'll be destroyed by internal discord as privileged groups fight to retain their position at the expense of much of the population. I'm sure there's plenty of other ideas that you might not want to think about.... Who said anything about bankrupt? Sheesh. http://www.nathannewman.org/nbs/ Play with the numbers. You can leave defense entirely alone, balance the budget, and even start paying down the debt. Farmers and old farts won't be happy, but then again, they never are... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 I doubt China could field 1 billion soldiers - but there is the likelihood of them having about 100 million unmarriable men in a few years time: look out for the growth industries of female slavery, bordellos and the state promotion of a homosatisfying way of life. Or war. Take your pick. How about the iSlut? Just in case you wanted a high tech solution. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stalins Organ Posted October 20, 2008 Author Share Posted October 20, 2008 oops - yes I mean 100 million - getting a bit carried away with the zeroes!! Who said anything about bankrupt? Me - it's what happens when a nation cannot pay its debts. do you think the US could ship 2 trillion $$'s worth of goods & services to China should they decide to speend that reserve? it's a concept the US will have to get used to - continue running hundreds of billions of $$'s deficit and you WILL be bankrupt sooner or later. It's not negotiable. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 Umm, spend? How can they? Look, you sure you know how this works? The Chinese bought debt. We have to give them their principal back, plus interest. That's it. Say, in 10 or 30 years (just to keep it simple), depending on what types of notes they bought. There is no demand feature on the purchaser's part here. If they want to go sell their notes to get ready cash (I assume in some other currency) instead of waiting till the term is up, well, go ahead, no skin off our backs. In fact, as I pointed out, it could be considered doing us a favor. As you say, you can't run a deficit forever. So yes, we would have to finally make some budget cuts (yea!!!) and we could easily pay our debts. It's just the people we elect who don't seem to want to. Go play with the calculator, I saved $1.6 trillion without breaking a sweat, and I didn't even stop the two wars, cut defense or touch research. And I didn't break out into Ron Paul type ravings either. I did rely on you taking care of your own grandma, however. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stalins Organ Posted October 20, 2008 Author Share Posted October 20, 2008 You are going to give them their principle back by cutting back on services to people but keeping the wars going? You've got some screwed up priorities there IMO. Using your calculator, eliminating Aghanistan & Iraq operations, cutting the rest of the military 10%, eliminating Corporate tax relief, Civilian retirement, aid to low income gamilies and making large cuts to agricultural support (40%), and lesser ones (10%) Govt Admin, Medicare and International Affairs I managed a $400 billion surplus - you could buy back your debt in only 4 years of utter penury.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 LOL. Yes, I've always considered National Defense a priority. The Departments of Commerce, Education, Agriculture, Labor, Health and Human Services, yadda, yadda, yadda, less so. How did the original Republic ever get by without them? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stalins Organ Posted October 20, 2008 Author Share Posted October 20, 2008 Who's going to attack the USA, and how does spending Billions in Iraq and/or Afghanistan stop them? the original Republic got by without them by living 230 years ago - times have moved on since then. but you can bring those good ol' days back for many - just repay your debt..... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 Gladly. Lets start by not having the gubermint mucking around in things it was never intended to. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stalins Organ Posted October 21, 2008 Author Share Posted October 21, 2008 such as defence for example - no standing army for a start.......? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
costard Posted October 21, 2008 Share Posted October 21, 2008 Gladly. Lets start by not having the gubermint mucking around in things it was never intended to. Well its doing a crapulous job of looking after the people it is meant to represent. And a sterling job of screwing things up. What is it you want a gubermint to do? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars Posted October 21, 2008 Share Posted October 21, 2008 Well its doing a crapulous job of looking after the people it is meant to represent. And a sterling job of screwing things up. See? You reinforce my point. What is it you want a gubermint to do? As little as possible. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars Posted October 21, 2008 Share Posted October 21, 2008 such as defence for example - no standing army for a start.......? We could do that also. But it seems you've come around to the realization that we're not headed for bankruptcy, we've just have some hard budgeting decisions to make. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
costard Posted October 21, 2008 Share Posted October 21, 2008 Lars, no taxes? Is that what you wish for? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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