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Dredloc

Guys,relax and Read This...Comment Plz

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I don't get it. Since when was this game advertised as being a replacement for Combat Mission or Close Combat. This game was made on the IL-2 engine and is its own game. Other than Battlefront being the distributor nothing else has changed. If you want the complexity of turn-based Combat Mission style play and the RTS style play of close combat... then go play them...they're still around. Why not try to be patient and wait for Combat Mission 2 and if you're a really patient masochist..good luck waiting on Close Combat...the next generation. :rolleyes:

Anyone who is familiar with Battlefront games knows that these guys support their products and to the best of their abilities improve them. Most of you know that companies like EA and Activision etc.... don't listen to us. So be patient and let these guys work it out. But for goodness sake quit comparing it to something that it wasn't supposed to be.

Most of you who have been playing realize that the level of detail in this game is pretty extreme. I don't ever remember seeing individual pieces of armor being blown off of a tank in Combat Mission.

In my book a few primary things need to be resolved if possible: frame rate, cover, line of sight, waypoints, smoke and vehicle pathfinding. If those problems can be resolved this game could go down in history as a middle ground between Combat Mission and Close Combat.

This is for you guys who love to complain about controllable things. :D

Okay guys, let me give you a little suggestion on something you might want to purchase. FUL1_F8GFPC100.jpg Check out this awesome little product called the Nostromo Speedpad N52. If you can find one, it's one of the best fully programmable USB controllers I've ever used. It works great for RTS titles as well as FPS games. I use it exclusively for everything from the Battlefield series to Combat Mission. I've been using this little thing for years. I think you can probably find one at Best Buy for around $30-$40. Trust me though, for any game that has screwy controls, use a programmable pad. Here's the link:

http://catalog.belkin.com/IWCatProductPage.process?Product_Id=157024

[ April 25, 2007, 08:26 PM: Message edited by: Dredloc ]

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I can't agree more. People should stop being negative and focus on what things can be improved.

. . . and enjoy this wonderful game smile.gif

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I agree.

I don't particularly like the game and I didn't think I would based on the videos I had seen prior to release.

But I got it anyway to support BFC and along the way I've learned a lesson.

I'm impressed by the ability of the guys at BFC to divorce themselves from their own philosophies in game design and to detect quality and merit in games that follow a completely different concept. Clearly discussions here show that that is quite a difficult thing to do.

I think it shows their creativity, their gut instinct for what makes a good game, the many different things they can get their head around when many of us can't. CMx2 looks to be every bit as revolutionary as CM was and only an exceptional group of people like the guys at BFC could pull off such games.

I think they are a better judge of what is a good game than I am. So if I don't like it, it's probably not just my cup of tea or my thinking is too focused on what I already know.

If we were all like that, games like CM just wouldn't get made.

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100% true,,,,,is the best and will only get better. battlefront is awesome with the community,,,look around and u will not see anyone like them,,,give them time and u will see tow turn into the best.

When I first played the cm demo I didn't like it,,,but I noticed the review and figured I was doing something wrong so I bought the cmbb,cmak with the instruction books,read it played and slowly was drawn in and got hooked,,,but i gave it a chance...Give it a chance and if u still donnot like tow,,let it be cause of tow not because it isn't cm or cc,,,express yourself and move on,,,wait for cmsf or get supreme commander or coh or whatever.

[ April 24, 2007, 12:42 PM: Message edited by: mitchell58 ]

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Theatre of War is indeed a fantastic title. ToW is a whole different animal from the CM series, period. ToW and the CM series are both excellent, with their respective strengths, weaknesses and advantages over one another. If you purchase ToW expecting it to be CM with updated graphics, you'll likely be disappointed.

I enjoy both.

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Agree 100%

This game is more fun and advanced than any wargame ever made, and it is still a realistic wargame.

I am really enjoying the game.

It is not a Combat Mission ?

Great, it means as soon as Commbat Mission 2nd generation arrives we will have more fun.

ToW and Combat Mission Shock Force, future is bright, all wargamers will be happy. smile.gif

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Sorry, but TOW is lacking in just about every aspect, I thought Company of Heroes was an RTS that lost my interest quick, I have played TOW about 3 times and it's about ready to be erased off the hard drive.

Menaingless AI, unweildy camera movement, unable to place troops in buildings, almost no real control over the troops or vehicles, lack of governing initial set up of fortifications, etc. etc. etc.

Zoomed out, if I wanted to watch a bunch of stick men doing a chinese fire drill, I would have bought an ant farm.

Outside of great close up graphics (if you can manage to zoom in, in time to watch the action), this game flat out stinks.

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100% Agree with Dredloc!!! Accept ToW for what it is and not for what you want it to be. For what it is it's a pretty good game and with a few tweaks, some enhancements, (did I here someone say WAYPOINT's?), it will be better yet. Let's get constructive with the criticisms and stop comparing it to CM or CC.

Just my thoughts

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Originally posted by Sgt_Kelly:

I don't particularly like the game and I didn't think I would based on the videos I had seen prior to release.

But I got it anyway to support BFC and along the way I've learned a lesson.

^^^^^^^^

what he said. I'll give ToW a go again in a patch or two.

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Well I tried it, ( the demo ) didn't like it, simple. I wasn't even going to post anything about

"TOW" because I thought, hey if somebody likes it

and I don't so what. But I'll give a voice and say

it is not going to take me from "CMBB" or "CMAK" at

any rate. No I'm not comparing "TOW" with "CM series

either. But I'll agree with the people that said,

give the "CMer's" the graphics of "TOW" and every day would be Christmas smile.gif But enjoy!

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I like ToW. Somehow. Some titles need more time to get into than others. "Take Command - 2nd Manassas" for example. Even the old "Sid Meier`s Gettysburg" was easier to handle and the user interface in Take Command is not exactly what you could call intuitive.

Same is ToW. You have to remember every time to press the "Hold Position" button, after you moved your troops. But after a few games even this works. I still use the Pause function often. Not only to get a better overview, but also to enjoy the graphics. So, after a little practice it works.

But still there are a few things I miss. Most important for me are random missions and random maps. So, of course I compare it to CM. Not because of the gameplay, but because of such features like the Quick Mission Builder. And then I ask myself, what the guys at 1C have done in the last 4 years? Such a game shouts literally for open maps and mission generators. But instead they give us 40 maps which look pretty much the same, except the color. After you played each mission you know exactly where all the AT guns are positioned and where the reinforcements enter the map. And this takes much thrill out of the game for me. In addition to that no tactics are needed, no encircling, no flanking some essential things are missing which I hoped for being part of the game. Yes, ToW is not CM. And as I said, somehow I like it. But it could have been more than frontal assaults in which the infantry prones to the front as a scout and the tanks clear up the rest. People play(ed) CM because of the inner beauty. But this is missing here. Therefore I can understand that they (I) compare these two games.

After the first patches/ mods have arrived we are able to see, if there can be more behind the nice graphics, or if it was just enough to fill a screenshot gallery.

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Originally posted by Andreas:

Nice lurking Dredloc.

All the best

Andreas

Dredloc must be somebody to drag Andreas in here.

smile.gif

Regards,

Gunz ;)

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When I pay $67 CDN for a game, I'm free to post criticism of said game if I wish. I don't care if I hurt BF's feelings. I don't like TOW. Not because it's not an RTS version of CM (not that it's so astronomically impossible to hope that someone out there could design such a thing...please), but more because there are too many things that are missing\broken.

For example, why can I not determine a unit facing for a tank by simply holding right click ala CoH and several other RTS games out there? Why is the camera control so flawed? Where are the waypoints, and barring that, why do my units not follow my orders to stay put, or keep formation? If it's a 'more hardcore military' RTS game, why do my tanks do such stupid things like turning their rear to the enemy instead of back up? That's a small sample of a laundry list of issues that I've discovered after mere days of gameplay.

If it's an RTS game (which it is), then it's going to be compared to other RTS games. They need to at least get the fundamentals of RTS gameplay fixed for this thing if they want to hear rosy posts about it. I suspect the reviews will reflect the same.

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I just think the missions are too hard, and do not afford enough favorable terrain for the attack. Almost every attack so far feels like it is in the face of greater enemy numbers, which is counter-intuitive and not at all what CMx1 is about, which is fair battles and realistic forces. I'm looking forward to user-generated missions, where I think things will be designed less towards an overly-challenging campaign, and more towards reality, which is what all of us CM'ers want.

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Sure I'll judge ToW for what it is... but unfortunately what it is amounts to "disappointing". I don't have a bit problem with blowing $100 on it (two copies - one for me and one for a friend) as 1C and Battlefront are great companies making games that I want them to make. But ToW doesn't interest me now that I've got it installed and have tried it. I do have hopes (based on the reputation and my experience with 1C and Battlefront) that patches and improvements will come. Maybe in the future it will creep into the realm of "interesting" and be worth another try.

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Its growing on me but things need to be fixed for longevity

major flaws are:

LOS

Minor flaws:

buildings hope they can find a way around

missions and campaigns can be fixed

Hope theirs a map editor too in future

most everything else I can get used too

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I think TOW has potential but its not quite there yet. Units don't follow orders as they should. Example when I give an order to a tank to face the front; I don't give a damn if on the flank there is a damaged enemy tank and it can't fire at me. Don't turn your vehicle towards that unit, period! If a unit is being shot at I want some kind of voice feedback...it's been done 10 years ago in CC, so what's the problem ? Ok fine, I can live with infantry not being able to enter buildings. What I'm having hard time is the campaign...too few missions. I don't feel connected with my units. I get the base of my units so I spend some points to add more. When I finish the mission, the units that I bought are gone, why ? I bought a stug D in one of the missions in the next mission that unit was gone ? How is this interesting for me ? What's the point of the medals...really ? Why am I using Pz Mark IVC!!!! in November 1941 in Rissia ? After all the battles I have been through should i see some Mark IVEs or even Ds would be nice! Why am I still stuck with Pz Mark IIIFs in November 1941 ? How about giving me a choice at list for some G, H models ? I don't like the laser guided targeting of the enemy AI ATGs. Give me vehicle reverse movement that works 100% of time. Where the heck is smoke ? Where are German AA 88s guns ? I hate the camera system. I have a huge map and the scenario map is so small...why can't I move the camera outside of the scenario space ? I have a huge map around yet the camera movement is so limited. There are some LOS issues as well. Oh and where are mortars ?

I think it's not a bad game but from my point of view its not polished and the campaign is lacking. I was glad that I had to chance to play but I'm currently not much interested going back to it until I see a patch or add-on. There isn't simply enough there in the game to make me interested.

Peter

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Originally posted by Chazman:

Sorry, but TOW is lacking in just about every aspect, I thought Company of Heroes was an RTS that lost my interest quick, I have played TOW about 3 times and it's about ready to be erased off the hard drive.

Menaingless AI, unweildy camera movement, unable to place troops in buildings, almost no real control over the troops or vehicles, lack of governing initial set up of fortifications, etc. etc. etc.

Zoomed out, if I wanted to watch a bunch of stick men doing a chinese fire drill, I would have bought an ant farm.

Outside of great close up graphics (if you can manage to zoom in, in time to watch the action), this game flat out stinks.

Well I'm neither negative or positive at this point...BUT...IF..you learn how to use the camera you can zoom in and out quick. What you might argue is it's not all on the mouse.

If you really want to get in fast without using the camera..lock and unlock and back off..

The camera isn't the problem..assuming there are problems. It's you don't know how to use it yet.

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