Jump to content

Heavy Infantry Squads


Recommended Posts

  • Replies 131
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Phonan I'm just a day ahead ;)

I tried that CanCapture tag, too. It currently only works with TrackedChassis. I talked with Clay and its a simple mistake that will be fixed with the next version. Then all units could be 'capturing'.

An engineering unit (1 ENG, 2 Rifle) would be great. Equipped with takeover electronics and an anti-structure demolition weapon (the way you proposed) would be great.

Are you going to make it?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by Imperial Grunt:

Also, US/UK infantry today can kill tanks at over 2k with a heat seeking, fire and forget, Javelin missile that will track moving targets, no matter how fast they are going (as long as the gunner achieved a good lock prior to launch).

So making longer range capabilities is not getting campy, just realistic. Given the tech in the DT world, a heavy infantry squad that has a 20mm HMG and a RPG that can reach out to 800m does not seem "unrealistic".

Sorry, IG, I have to object. You know a lot more about weapons than I do but this is not about realism - its about game balance. 'Realistic' DT battles would be over in under 10 seconds (drop rocks from dropship with terminal velocity on opponents - wait for dust to clean - profit! ;) ).

The way the current light infantry works is fine. Invisible on long range but you need to get close for a kill. Thats fun to play.

The CMD infantry is a great addition. I'm not so sure about the ATGM inf - haven't had a human opponent using them yet.

I don't mind having heavy infantry with heavy weapons (and a suit that can go cold (=invisible)). But light infantry with heavy weapons is not good for the game IMHO.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by poesel71:

Phonan I'm just a day ahead ;)

I tried that CanCapture tag, too. It currently only works with TrackedChassis. I talked with Clay and its a simple mistake that will be fixed with the next version. Then all units could be 'capturing'.

An engineering unit (1 ENG, 2 Rifle) would be great. Equipped with takeover electronics and an anti-structure demolition weapon (the way you proposed) would be great.

Are you going to make it?

A 3 man combat engineer team works and balances it against the other squads, less firepower, but special capability. I also think that the combat engineer team should have an ability to clear mines as well. (Would make for some good mine breaching operations prior to assaults on bases).
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by poesel71:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Imperial Grunt:

Also, US/UK infantry today can kill tanks at over 2k with a heat seeking, fire and forget, Javelin missile that will track moving targets, no matter how fast they are going (as long as the gunner achieved a good lock prior to launch).

So making longer range capabilities is not getting campy, just realistic. Given the tech in the DT world, a heavy infantry squad that has a 20mm HMG and a RPG that can reach out to 800m does not seem "unrealistic".

Sorry, IG, I have to object. You know a lot more about weapons than I do but this is not about realism - its about game balance. 'Realistic' DT battles would be over in under 10 seconds (drop rocks from dropship with terminal velocity on opponents - wait for dust to clean - profit! ;) ).

The way the current light infantry works is fine. Invisible on long range but you need to get close for a kill. Thats fun to play.

The CMD infantry is a great addition. I'm not so sure about the ATGM inf - haven't had a human opponent using them yet.

I don't mind having heavy infantry with heavy weapons (and a suit that can go cold (=invisible)). But light infantry with heavy weapons is not good for the game IMHO. </font>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

An engineering unit (1 ENG, 2 Rifle) would be great. Equipped with takeover electronics and an anti-structure demolition weapon (the way you proposed) would be great.

Are you going to make it?

I could make it, but Redcon seems to be our infantry specialist.

[ February 26, 2007, 03:09 PM: Message edited by: Phonan ]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by Phonan:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />An engineering unit (1 ENG, 2 Rifle) would be great. Equipped with takeover electronics and an anti-structure demolition weapon (the way you proposed) would be great.

Are you going to make it?

I could make it, but Redcon seems to be our infantry specialist. </font>
Link to comment
Share on other sites

OK so if I get the general drift.

Sniper team is OK, but give the bullet a smoke trail.

Reduce ammo and range on AGTM squad, say 10 round total (same as any other ATGM) and 2500m?

Sapper Squad needs 1 Squad Leader with capture gear, 2 Sappers with demo charges/mine clearing and 10mm rilfe no ATG, and 2 Security Rifleman.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by Redcon-5:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Phonan:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />An engineering unit (1 ENG, 2 Rifle) would be great. Equipped with takeover electronics and an anti-structure demolition weapon (the way you proposed) would be great.

Are you going to make it?

I could make it, but Redcon seems to be our infantry specialist. </font>
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sapper Squad needs 1 Squad Leader with capture gear, 2 Sappers with demo charges/mine clearing and 10mm rilfe no ATG, and 2 Security Rifleman.
I believe some people are looking for a smaller, less powerful squad; for instance, make the leader a capture unit & sapper, and the other 2 are security Riflemen. Just a 3-man squad.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by Redcon-5:

OK so if I get the general drift.

Sniper team is OK, but give the bullet a smoke trail.

Reduce ammo and range on AGTM squad, say 10 round total (same as any other ATGM) and 2500m? Maybe the ATGM can look like this: Predator

Sapper Squad needs 1 Squad Leader with capture gear, 2 Sappers with demo charges/mine clearing and 10mm rifle no ATG, and 2 Security Rifleman.

Sounds good to me. On the sniper team, I would make the round just leave a slight vapor trail if possible. But not a heavy smoke trail like the missiles do in DT. Is there a way to give the round the same AP capability but have a little more of a "punch" against internal components than just a penetrator would? Maybe the sniper rifle can look like this:

20mm sniper rifle

Steyr prototype

Sapper squad sounds great. Can I add one more thing? Maybe some smoke grenades? (Same as tank smoke grenade launchers). I can see a sapper squad being a great unit for base assaults.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by Imperial Grunt:

Sounds good to me. On the sniper team, I would make the round just leave a slight vapor trail if possible. But not a heavy smoke trail like the missiles do in DT. Is there a way to give the round the same AP capability but have a little more of a "punch" against internal components than just a penetrator would?

Smoke: no, its either smoking or non smoking. smile.gif

But it could have a tracer. IIRC it currently hasn't (can't check right now).

More punch: yes, thats moddable. Fragmentation, Explosion, Damage - descriptions to be found in the Wiki.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by Redcon-5:

OK since IG is gripping SO MUCH (especally about the rocket launcher) :D here is what I just kicked out tonight.

image.jpg

And a better rifle too. image.jpg

Im not gripping! Its all supposed to be good and helpful.

Here is another great French weapon by the way. It cutting edge!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by Redcon-5:

OK since IG is gripping SO MUCH (especally about the rocket launcher) :D here is what I just kicked out tonight.

image.jpg

And a better rifle too. image.jpg

Im not gripping! Its all supposed to be good and helpful.

Here is another great French weapon by the way. It cutting edge!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A couple of thoughts:

ATGMinf-> it's too jolly good but these missiles are more of a TOW that a RPG so they should be reduced in number/range and the power of the jet pack as well 'cause is not only the launcher that has more trust also the riflemen in the platoon, so they can be used in long jumps and tank drivers could be misled

Sniper/FAC: split the two teams, no matter what bullet you give to the sniper is more or less useless

FAC/Sapper: they should receive the increased trust jetpacks, for one they'll be more easly identified by their long jumps and given that the proposed demolition charge has a relatively short fuse they should be able to fly to safety

[ March 01, 2007, 12:08 AM: Message edited by: aittam ]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, if the ATGM squads had RPGs instead of a guided missile, then they would not be ATGM squads, but RPG squads, big difference. The ATGM that REDCON made is very much like the old Dragon missile. The ATGM on the Paladin is like a TOW/Javelin combo.

The sniper round does need more punch against internal components in my opinion, but the snipers are not useless. Its pretty good at killing the Ariel, Shrikes, turrets, and if your lucky, the back of a Thor turret. But it does seem to punch holes into Apollos and Paladins with virtually no effect.

The combat engineer/sapper squad should be able to set a charge and get away in any fashion they see fit. I think that their demo charge will be launched in some way anyways, maybe with a range of 100m or something. We have to wait to see what Redcon comes up with.

If anyone should get longer jumps, it should be the standard light infantry squad that is only equipped with rifles. All of the other squads (or teams) are carrying heavier equipment but wearing the same light powered armor and using the same propulsion system. So the standard light infantry squad should have the most mobility.

The radio operator (RO) [Army uses RTO for radio telephone operator] is not a FAC. A FAC is a forward air controller and there is no air to control in DT. The RO/RTO does however act as a FO (forward observer) to call for fire and he can drop in deployables and give orders like a commander.

But you have a point, the sniper/RO combo as it is now does not make sense, because the RO is not just a FO because he has full command and control capability. Maybe the sniper team should be made separate (3 man team, 2 snipers and a scout with a 10mm rifle?) and the RO be made into a command/headquarters team (3 marines with 10mm rifles, including the RO).

(It would be cool if they could put some black captain bars and 1stSgt stripes on the shoulder armor of a couple of the marines in the headquarters team!)

Redcon and others, what are your thoughts?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

that was my point, you don't send around ATGM squads with 16 rounds, the probability that they get killed before they are able to use all the rounds is too high, ok this RL in game they have a 50% kill ratio that mean 8 vehicles, a little bit too much IMHO; so or we put one specialist per squad or less rounds and anyways limited range, FAC because is calling strikes but whatever other definition suits me untill is clear we are talking about the same thing

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by Imperial Grunt:

The combat engineer/sapper squad should be able to set a charge and get away in any fashion they see fit. I think that their demo charge will be launched in some way anyways, maybe with a range of 100m or something. We have to wait to see what Redcon comes up with.

The DEMO charge has an Effecticve range of 35m and you don't need too jump away. You can drop one at your feet and it won't kill you. Kind of gamey yes I know but it was the best I could do for now. (man making me give away all my supprises for the weekend :D )

If anyone should get longer jumps, it should be the standard light infantry squad that is only equipped with rifles. All of the other squads (or teams) are carrying heavier equipment but wearing the same light powered armor and using the same propulsion system. So the standard light infantry squad should have the most mobility.

Here,here, I agree.

The radio operator (RO) [Army uses RTO for radio telephone operator] is not a FAC. A FAC is a forward air controller and there is no air to control in DT. The RO/RTO does however act as a FO (forward observer) to call for fire and he can drop in deployables and give orders like a commander.

Thanks IG that was irking me to but I was trying too be nice and not say anything. smile.gif I think I renamed him to Scout, genaric but effective.

But you have a point, the sniper/RO combo as it is now does not make sense, because the RO is not just a FO because he has full command and control capability. Maybe the sniper team should be made separate (3 man team, 2 snipers and a scout with a 10mm rifle?) and the RO be made into a command/headquarters team (3 marines with 10mm rifles, including the RO).

Just one question "What are you going to kill with a 10mm that a Sniper rifle can't?"

(It would be cool if they could put some black captain bars and 1stSgt stripes on the shoulder armor of a couple of the marines in the headquarters team!)

Redcon and others, what are your thoughts?

DO you do nothin' but gripe? I give and I give but all I heard is "gee sum rank would be nice". :D

Sorry had too do that. I suck at texture right now so it will be awhile. Besides I cant open any of the LightArmor.CAF .CMF .CSF in any of my programs to mod them.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hey, I am a trained professional, twice over, when it comes to gripping and complaining. Its when I am quiet when everyone needs to afraid!

I do appreciate all of your efforts REDCON, you and Poesel have contributed alot to the game. If I had any flipping computer skills, I would be trying to do more than just gripe and bitch.

So, with all that said, here is some more gripping!

1) 35m for the demo charge is perfect. Hope it makes a big boom! They shouldn't be able to blow it at their own feet though. Is that a DT programming limitation? Will there be a delay on the charge?

2) Can you mod the light infantry squad to have slightly upgraded jets to better reflect their mobility as compared to the other squads?

3) I would still vote for a separate sniper team and a separate HQ team. I think it works in the game better. Making all the support squads into 3 man teams also helps with game balance.

4) A standard sniper team consists of a sniper with the sniper rifle and an observer with a standard rifle, radio, and spotting scope. The observer does not carry another sniper rifle, but an automatic weapon like an M-4/M-16A4 with a 203 on it. For DT, I am suggesting that the sniper team has the 2 snipers and a scout (for security and to be the sniper's observer-not a RO/FO though). The 10mm rifle that scout carries still would have the ATG launcher on it, providing that capability to the sniper team if required. Both the observer and the snipers should have the zoom capability.

5) Hey, I kept the rank insignia idea in parentheses...I was just rambling.

[ March 01, 2007, 09:42 AM: Message edited by: Imperial Grunt ]

Link to comment
Share on other sites


×
×
  • Create New...