Uzi Posted July 11, 2004 Share Posted July 11, 2004 In my opinion there are too many badly designed maps being posted for download. I'm tired of reading that this is an "Historical Map" only to download it and find a laughable flat world effort with all square fields. very boring.. Gameplay is enhanced by good map design. 2 examples of good maps are ones I have still from CMBO; They are; "Marnach" and "Neufmoulin". I don't know who designed them but they are obviously based on real maps or photos and prove that decent maps can be produced in this game. PLEASE RECOMMEND SOME MORE FOR CMAK that are of this quality 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoffel Posted July 11, 2004 Share Posted July 11, 2004 Hi Uzi, the original CMBO map for Marnach was made by Mc Auliffe from Belgium. I have made a new revised one of the area for CMAK covering the entire area from Clervaux to marnach. Download my Clervaux battle from the depot andd you see what I mean. I have visited the area myself and I can say that this huge map turned out to be a exact replica of the real terrain. Henk 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uzi Posted July 11, 2004 Author Share Posted July 11, 2004 Hi Stoffel, Thanks for that. I will definitely be checking it out. Do you know any more of such quality? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uzi Posted July 11, 2004 Author Share Posted July 11, 2004 Couldn't find your CMAK version in Scenario depot search but came across all Mc Auliffe's work. THESE MAPS ARE IMPRESSIVE!!!!!! I have most of them and they are how Combat mission maps should be... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoffel Posted July 11, 2004 Share Posted July 11, 2004 name of the scenario is: Clervaux deathtrapp for the 10th regiment If you send me an email,I will send it to you. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simovitch Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 Uzi, I agree with your statement regarding historical maps. This topic has been brought up before on this board and the bottom line is that sometimes accurate topo information is not available to the designer. In the vastness of Russia, accurate topo becomes irrelevant maybe, but in the smaller confines of Western Europe and Italy I think rendering an accurate map should be given more attention. I personally have some good mapping resources and I'm using them in my current designs for HSG, a scenario design group that strives for historical accuracy. Try the CMBO battle "Rollbahn A" (shameless plug) covering the 1st hours of the bulge in 6th Panzer Armee sector. The map was taken off a 1:25000 topo circa 1937 gridded at 100m and transposed in the editor. you might like my other CMBO scenario "The Prumerberg" as well, though the map is credited to someone else. Wait a few weeks for HSG's release of a "bulge pack" of scenarios for CMAK. you will find some more of what you're looking for. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
junk2drive Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 "Wait a few weeks for HSG's release of a "bulge pack" of scenarios for CMAK. you will find some more of what you're looking for." while impatiently waiting, I'm getting all my snow, light snow, ww, unis, ready. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simovitch Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 jtd, the best news in many months on this board was to hear that Tom is back in the modding business. just to get things rolling, and if there are no objections from herr Klimisch I will post my renumbering of his TBM winter roads and tree bases to cmmods tonight when I get home from work. oh crap, im at work... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
junk2drive Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 last night i was playing with different light snow mods, treebases, roads, etc. i used mcmmm to munge the tbm cmmos mod into non-cmmos zip. mcmmm lists them by type (ie road dark, road lite). give it a try before you go through all that work. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1stUkrainianFront Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 Comrades -- I have a bunch of 5-meter resolution satellite imagery of Ukraine which I could send to anyone who wants to do CMBB maps. You can see what the landscape looks like out here -- lots of green fields, tree belts, sprawling villages of wooden houses. I've got areas around Chernigov, Zhitomir, Malin, Ternopol, etc. -- Lots of heavy armor action all through these places in '41 and on the way back in '43-44. Sure, the photos are modern and there has no doubt been plenty of change since WWII but much of that around will have been around the cities, not out in the countryside. I'd attach a file here with the post but I dunno how -- advice anyone? Cheers 1stUkrainianFront [ July 12, 2004, 05:43 PM: Message edited by: 1stUkrainianFront ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted July 12, 2004 Share Posted July 12, 2004 You'll need webspace, no file attachments on the board itself. How many megabytes is the thing? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1stUkrainianFront Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 Well, the whole country is many gigabytes. But I have clipped out a couple of pieces each of about 1-2 megabytes. I could e-mail 'em to anybody who's interested, then if someone wants to do a scenario in a particular area I could clip that out as well & send it over. Got no webspace of my own so this would be via e-mail. It could be fun to do a Defense-of-Kiev 1941 battle or op -- one of the few places that held on really hard in '41. Then for the late-war armor fans, could do Zhitomir-Malin 1943 or liberation-and-relief of Kiev, or 1941 counterattack at Korosten or etc. etc. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 You could send me an example, I can put it up for others to see and tell if they need that kind of thing. Address is in the profile. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1stUkrainianFront Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 I sent you two images. Shows the real landscape of modern-day Ukraine very well. Look forward to your impressions. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 They look good. Do you have their coordinates? Someone might be able to find the topographical maps of the areas as well. Here's links to them so others can have a look. Please note that the second one is large and my webspace provider might not like it if 15000 BFC forum members downloaded it, so don't d/l unless you have use for it. Satellite image 1, 170kb Satellite image 2, 2.45Mb Edit-corrected link to the second photo [ July 13, 2004, 11:15 AM: Message edited by: Sergei ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWB Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 Those maps look great! Funny thing is, they seem to have large, square fields. Go figure. Uzi, if you dont like people's interperations of maps, why not try making your own? WWB 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1stUkrainianFront Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 The villages in rural Ukraine nowadays are laid out with the village itself, houses straggling along the main & secondary roads. Each house usually has a large yard/vegetable garden out back. Then just outside the villages are a ring of small patchwork fields which were turned over to private ownership for market & subsistence gardening in the early 1990s. Then out beyond the small fields are the large fields of the ex-collective farms. Those are the big geometric shapes. The ex-collective fields are huge -- I mean gigantic -- often 1.5-3 kilometers on a side. A lot of the big fields are probably the result of Soviet agriculture post-war, when they started farming with the big tractors & combines. Before the war the fields were probably smaller, and there would have been quite a few small hamlets scattered around in the hollows, and the central villages would have been smaller. They got bigger in the 50s & 60s when the Soviets conducted a "village consolidation" program. Actually what I'm doing out here in Kiev is using those satellite images and also field surveys to chop the big collective fields up into smaller pieces and return them to private ownership. Sortof like Stalin's collectivization in reverse. It's all perfect tank country, that's for sure. And every village has monuments to the poor people who died in the war. Hundreds of names in every village. Sergei, yes, the maps do have coordinates. I also have a full set of 1:100,000-scale topo maps covering Ukraine. Those are useful but maybe somewhat too small-scale to be extremely useful in doing CMBB scenarios. I may be able to scrounge up a digital elevation model as well which would have the actual topo heights in digital form. If anybody wants a particular location, let me know either by name or by lat-long and I'll try to clip out the imagery. I've also dug up an overview map of the Kiev defense lines in 1941, could send that as well. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eichenbaum Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 Hi 1stUkrainianFront, You have drawn my attention with your satellite images. Do you have those from the Crimea as well? I'm working on a campaign for CMBB called Operation Störfang (OSF). Everything we build should be as realistic as possible with CM. Like in the example you can see we're working with the famous Russian 1942 maps of Ukraine: <font size="-2">Krasn'ii Mak (Cherkes Kerman)</font> <font size="-2">(Click the pic to enlarge)</font> My brother has devoted his self the past year to draw a highly detailed 3d elevation map of the South-West region of the Crimea in AutoCAD. Would you mind if I contact you by e-mail? Nils 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1stUkrainianFront Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 Eichenbaum -- I have some 5 & 10-meter satellite imagery for southwest Crimea. Sure, go ahead & send me an e-mail. Suggest you include the exact areas you are looking for and I'll try to clip them out for you. Say, how did you include your two pictures in your post above? 1stUkrainianFront 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eichenbaum Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 Say, how did you include your two pictures in your post above?If you have a webserver where you can place them on you can include pictures with the [ img ] tags: </font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;"><a href="http://www.eichenbaum.org/Images/K-Mak01.jpg" target="_blanc"> </a></pre> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1stUkrainianFront Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 Eichenbaum -- The Sevastopol satellite image I sent you has 5m resolution. That is equivalent to a map of about 1:15,000 scale. This is better than most topo maps (usually 1:25,000-1:50,000 scale). But of course the image doesn't have the elevation contours. What we find when using these images for most real-world purposes is that image + map gives you the best possible result. The images have a lot of photographic detail like the texture of the terrain, presence of little clumps of woods, etc. which the map can't give you. If you have your brother put the satellite image into his AutoCAD model he can probably do things like drape the image over the terrain elevations -- should be a pretty exciting view. If you've been working off maps from 1942 you will also be able to see how things have changed in the sixty years since the battle. The city probably got flattened during the siege ("Is Paris Burning?") so it would have been completely rebuilt after the war. In the image you can clearly see all the Soviet-type postwar apartment blocks. Haven't been down to Sevastopol yet but I may make it down there from Kiev this fall. Cheers 1stUkrainianFront 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eichenbaum Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 1stUkrainianFront, Give me an hour to get home. I'm still at work and cannot get my eichenbaum.org e-mail. You've made me very curious Nils 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1stUkrainianFront Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 Sure, no rush. I've got the 5m image for Sevastopol and the immediate area. Outside about 10 km from the city our resolution drops down to 10m, which is OK but doesn't have the nice detail of the 5m images. By the way, how big are the tiles on a CM map? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 One tile is 20m. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWB Posted July 13, 2004 Share Posted July 13, 2004 Hmm, speaking of sebastapol, drop me an email Eichenbaum, I think I have something which will interest you. 1stUkrainian: Thanks for the maps offer. I need to The maps sound awesome, I need to check some sources and I will email you some requests. If you would like some maps to be hosted somewhere, I can arrange for space in various places. WWB 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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