The Graeme Posted July 27, 2003 Share Posted July 27, 2003 Call me weird, but 90% of my CM time is spent altering existing scenarios or creating new ones. Part of it is due to my chronic fatigue (late shift warehousework plus a mild heart condition) and part of it is CM being my childhood dream come true (I used to spend hours drawing stickfigure battles on elaborate terrain -- "What's wrong with this boy?" my granddad used to ask). So when I come home too tired to think I nevertheless spend a relaxing hour or two changing scenario maps till they look 'right'. I've changed every scenario in both CMOO and CMOB. And I've done more than 100 scenarios from scratch such as, my own versions of the Falaise Pocket or the Hurtgen Forest, lesser known battles like the Brit commando raid on occupied Guernsey or the Polish defense of Westerplatte, Dieppe of course (I'm Canadian), allies overunning research bases like Rechlin or E. Stelle Travermunde, the Polish attacking Peenemunde, operation Felix (Gibralter), and some odd fictional battles like American airborne assaulting Carinhall (in hopes of nabbing Goring), or Skorzeny leading an attack on the Nuremburg Trial site, or even dropping in on Los Alamos (courtesy of a squadron of Junkers 390s). In short, CM is for me a creative hobby involving research and imagination. I get a great sense of accomplishment when I complete each one. Yet so far I've playtested very few, but will get around to them all as time goes on. (Rechlin airbase turned out to be too lopsided. All the antiaircraft weapons sited about the base made short work of allied armour. Must rethink this one.) Note that 'After The Battle' magazine is a superb resource with both detailed maps and excellent photos for a host of obscure battles. Anyway, just curious. Which aspect of the game do you enjoy the most? What percentage of time is devoted to creating rather than playing? Im my case 90/10. I'd be interested in finding out if I'm unique in this or if many share my approach to CM. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenAsJade Posted July 27, 2003 Share Posted July 27, 2003 Originally posted by The Graeme: So when I come home too tired to think I nevertheless spend a relaxing hour or two changing scenario maps till they look 'right'. Each to his own. The "looks" of a scenario are very important, and some wonderful art has been done in the medium of "Terrain Editor" (I think my all time favourite is a CMBO scenario with a huge dam, in the rain... can't remember what it was called, but it was fantastic - took my breath away when I opened it), but its barely the beginning of creating a scenario. It's positively amazing how a scenario that one makes that looks great when its done plays awful, and not at all how you expected. There's a thought: maybe we need a web page with CM art! Scenario's/screen shots that deserve to be preserved purely for their aesthetic value! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Graeme Posted July 27, 2003 Author Share Posted July 27, 2003 Originally posted by Greenasjade: "It's positively amazing how a scenario that one makes that looks great when its done plays awful, and not at all how you expected." Some of my altering scenarios is purely cosmetic, as in: 'the farmhouse is facing the wrong way' or 'the road isn't level' or 'the town is too generic, needs more variety' which, to someone concentrating on play value, isn't important. But for me, such 'flaws' take away from the credibility of the scenario. Generally speaking, I keep in mind such matters as LOS and possibilities of manoeuvre when altering or creating a map, I want it to be playable. Then again, the joy of creating, & the joy of playing, is perhaps also matched by the joy of playtesting until tweaked to perfection. All part of the infinite replayability of this wonderful game. "There's a thought: maybe we need a web page with CM art! Scenario's/screen shots that deserve to be preserved purely for their aesthetic value!" Cool idea. Would probably need to be moderated since not everyone would share the same opinion as to what is worthy and what isn't. Would be great fun to browse thru though. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ng cavscout Posted July 27, 2003 Share Posted July 27, 2003 Honestly, I have never tried making a scenario. I think this might be a hold over from several attempts at making scenarios for operation flash point and failing miserably. So my answer would be I only play. Do you plan on posting the scenarios you have made anywhere? They sound pretty good. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Graeme Posted July 27, 2003 Author Share Posted July 27, 2003 NG cavscout wrote: "Do you plan on posting the scenarios you have made anywhere? They sound pretty good." I would if I could. I don't know how or where. Though I've always had a computer of one kind or another since 1980, I have yet to develop a 'handle' on them, thinking of them as glorified typewriters. (Did I mention I'm 52 years old? Might be part of my problem...this newfangled stuff...) I can't even figure out how to use the quote function in this forum. I gather from perusing scenario sites that everything is 'zipped'. I don't have a zip drive or a zip program. I don't believe I have any compression program (I might, but if so I don't know about it). Still, I suspect some would enjoy checking out my scenarios. If not playable, could always be altered I assume? So my scenarios could be the base for someone else's improved version? Any advice how I might go about this? Or what sites to send to? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenAsJade Posted July 27, 2003 Share Posted July 27, 2003 Originally posted by The Graeme: NG cavscout wrote: " I can't even figure out how to use the quote function in this forum. You just click on the "" button on the person's post that you want to quote, as I did to quote yours above. If you want someone to try out your scenario, why don't you describe one in this forum, and offer to email it to interested parties. They will let you know where to send it and how. Posting it on a web site can come later... GaJ. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Graeme Posted July 27, 2003 Author Share Posted July 27, 2003 Originally posted by GreenAsJade: If you want someone to try out your scenario, why don't you describe one in this forum, and offer to email it to interested parties. They will let you know where to send it and how. Posting it on a web site can come later... Hmmm, excellent idea. Meanwhile, I downloaded a temporary zip program and zipped my Carinhall battle and submitted it to the scenario depot (at least I think I did, if I did everything correctly). If it works and it gets posted on the depot, I'll announce it on this forum. In the near future I'll either post more battles to the Scenario depot or follow your advice. [ July 27, 2003, 09:21 AM: Message edited by: The Graeme ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ng cavscout Posted July 27, 2003 Share Posted July 27, 2003 Your scenario is posted at the scenario depot now, but I can't download it for some reason. If you want, my email is in my profile, and I would like whatever scenarios you want to share. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Graeme Posted July 28, 2003 Author Share Posted July 28, 2003 Originally posted by NG cavscout: Your scenario is posted at the scenario depot now, but I can't download it for some reason. If you want, my email is in my profile, and I would like whatever scenarios you want to share.I must have done something wrong when I submitted it. I notice that there are a number of other battles in the Scenario Depot with the same problem. I've emailed the site contact for advice on how to correct this. Meanwhile, I'll try emailing the Carinhall battle to you as an attached zip file & see if that works. If not, let me know please. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SgtMuhammed Posted July 28, 2003 Share Posted July 28, 2003 It takes a couple of days for the actual file to be posted for download. Be patient it will be there. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Graeme Posted July 28, 2003 Author Share Posted July 28, 2003 Originally posted by sgtgoody (esq): It takes a couple of days for the actual file to be posted for download. Be patient it will be there.Ah! Thank you! That's a load off my mind. I am revamping my scenarios and hope to post quite a few more over the next two weeks (I'm on vacation). My next posting will be my version of Obersalzberg with the Polish airborne bringing a Christmas surprise for Hitler in the Berghoff. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Keth Posted July 28, 2003 Share Posted July 28, 2003 Originally posted by The Graeme: I gather from perusing scenario sites that everything is 'zipped'. I don't have a zip drive or a zip program. I don't believe I have any compression program (I might, but if so I don't know about it). The Graeme, Actually, I prefer to receive the battle and operation files unzipped. I have a registered version of Winzip, and I end up rezipping files anyways. I genuinely look forward to receiving your scenarios. I personally like "short and sweet" battles that can be played between when I get home from work and dinner time (about 1 to 1.5 hours). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Keth Posted July 28, 2003 Share Posted July 28, 2003 Originally posted by The Graeme: I must have done something wrong when I submitted it. I notice that there are a number of other battles in the Scenario Depot with the same problem. I've emailed the site contact for advice on how to correct this.The Graeme, You did everything correctly. Here's how the system works: Authors post the battle or operation synopsis to The Scenario Depot. They then email me the unzipped file. If the following day is a weekday, I manage to post files by 7:30am that follwoing day. If the following day is a weekend day, I'll usually get the file posted by the following Monday at 7:30am. Please remember to always put the purpose of your email in the Subject line, such as "CMBO Battle Submission". I have some pretty aggressive spam killers operating, and emails with blank subject lines are deleted. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Graeme Posted July 28, 2003 Author Share Posted July 28, 2003 Originally posted by Admiral Keth: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reinald@berlin.com Posted August 16, 2003 Share Posted August 16, 2003 I ventured a little into scenario design and enjoyed it albeit the results were mediocre at best. Found it too time consuming to create really good scenarios with mapmaking, historical research and stuff and therefore quit. Just playing is 'cheaper' fun after a long workday. But I do comment on every scenario I play that hasn't enough reviews yet at the Depot and encourage other to join me in doing so. Makes it a lot easier for scenario-sluts like me to pick a good one and I assume it helps designers to improve. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucero1148 Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 I like to play for the excitement and the challenge of pitting my strategy against and opponent and getting a good fight out of it. Designing a scenario or operation though is what I like to do to relax and think out a "what if" tactical problem. I also notice that designing a scenario has also helped me read a tactical map and gives me clues as to how best to approach a situation. Especially for a blind battle as in the current RD tournament. Lately I've also been doing a number of reviews as well since there still seems to be a lack of reviewers compared to the number of battles and ops out there. Hopefully that will encourage others to put their two cents in. All best Patrick 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GJK Posted August 17, 2003 Share Posted August 17, 2003 Not wanting to step on Adm. Keth's toes in any way, but I can suggest my site, The Proving Grounds for posting to if your scenario is still in need of playtesting, before moving them over to the Scenario Depot. This will keep Adm. from having to keep reposting your corrected versions. This will also save you from having to email the scenario out time and time again when people email you asking for a copy of it. At TPG, you can upload either .zip, .sit, or the scenario in it's native format (.cme, .cmb etc). They are available for download immediately. The scenario should then be moved to the Scenario Depot at any time that you think it's finished. There's few of us who are reviewing scenario's on a full-time basis, I'm hoping more people will join us. Overall, there's 270 members or so, so somebody should give you feedback on it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Graeme Posted August 20, 2003 Author Share Posted August 20, 2003 Ah, I was vaguely aware the Proving Grounds site existed, but didn't know what it was all about. Checked it out. Looks good. I submitted my info to join up. I have very little free time, so I probably won't be able to play test other people's scenarios, not for the forseeable future. But I will submit some of my scenarios and see what people make of them. I hadn't realized that the Scenario Depot should be reserved for the final version, but that makes a lot of sense. One site to test, another to go to in search of a reliably challenging game. Feel a bit guilty that in my newbie ignorance I may have submitted scenarios to the depot which aren't ready to be there. Oh well, one step at a time. I'm learning. My ultimate goal is simply to create scenarios which others will enjoy. If I can succeed in that at least 50% of the time I'll be content. Thanks for setting me straight about how things are done. Hope to submit something soon. Cheers! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GJK Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 It's by no means set in stone that only "proven" scenarios should go to the Scenario Depot. That has only been my suggestion since launching The Proving Grounds...quite some time after the Depot was launched. The Depot is the place to go for your scenario needs, no doubt. My idea came when I would see a post here on these forums of a new scenario; "need testers" and then there would be 15 replies of "send it to me, email in my details". The Grounds is a way to help authors distribute the scenario without having to individually email everyone that wants a copy, while still maintaining the knowledge of who has a copy of it. That's the important part, you'll know whose downloaded it so you can follow up with them for feedback if needed. The opponent finder part was almost an after thought, but actually was added to the site first. It's matched me up with about 5 people that I'm doing PBEM's with now, so hopefully it's working for everyone else. Thanks for joining, and look forward to testing some of your scenarios! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fredrock1957 Posted August 20, 2003 Share Posted August 20, 2003 Graeme I tell you what, I have been playing CMBO and CMBB for about 3 months and I love it. But a few weeks back I took my first crack at creating a scenario. I was addicted, my every waking hour when not at work for 15 straight days was put into the creation, fine tuning, research, loading Mods, etc of trying to make it great (if that makes me weird then I am fine with that). Not sure how it will fly though, I did have some friends playtest it and they thought is was good I just posted it last night at The Proving Ground and at The Scenario Depot. Both sites are awesome, plus the "Admiral" was great and it was there within 8 hours. Then I celebrated with a bottle of Oban 14 yr old and... Geez I already started working on one for CMBO ( I think I have been gaffed) Let me know when you post one and I will try it out... My first is called Stompout and if you get a chance check it out FredRocker 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Graeme Posted August 22, 2003 Author Share Posted August 22, 2003 Hi Fredrock! Downloaded Stompout, but unfortunately my computer can only handle the small to tiny scenarios. Could barely navigate the map. Playing it would be out of the question, unless I reduced the size of the forces, cut out the snow storm, etc. However, the scenario looked good. Perfectly credible landscape. At first glance force balance seemed weighted toward the defender, but then I noted the reinforcements for the attacker and concluded the defender would probably be overwelmed at the end. Looks like a hard fight. I wondered about the amount of open space, but realized the snowstorm would cut visibility, reducing the action to a series of sudden, vicious confrontations. Also wonder about the number of trucks, but I guess to move your defenders about quickly where needed? Dang but I wish my computer could process your scenario. You obviously put a lot of thought into it. Looks like fun. I encourage you tro do more scenarios! I also encourage anyone reading this to check out Stompout! As for myself, I have 5 battles posted in the CMBB section of Scenario Depot. You might want to check out my Gulag Factory Complex, which is roughly comparable to Stompout, albeit tiny in comparison. Also have 22 battles posted in the CMBO section. Check any out, such as Dieppe Disaster or Obersalzberg, and it'll give you the complete list. I also encourage you to try doing a smallish to medium size scenario. If my computer can handle it, I'll definitely review it! Cheers! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fredrock1957 Posted August 22, 2003 Share Posted August 22, 2003 Hey Graeme Thanks for the input...sorry about the size... because of my job I have a killer PC at home (2.4ghz, 1gb ram etc) and when I got hooked into creating Stompout (I mean it was like an addiction) I forgot about the size and playability for other users..... I am working on two more scenarios one for CMBO and one for CMBB both should be medium size of smaller... I have no plans this weekend except to slurp down some scotch and watch the race from BRISTOL(awesome I usually go but not this year ) So I will get some of your scenarios and start to check them out.... sounds like we are on the same plain..... Oh and by the way... all them trucks... I just figured that a complex like that would have a batch of them laying around... though in one playtest I did as the allies I did use them alot... did you see the 76 mm's located in the houses on the hill...(sneaky) My friend playtested as the germans and tried to flank on the north side and ended up with alot of broken and dead units from those babys.... your right about the individual intense firefights... thats what we discovered in the playtesting... I sorta enjoyed that aspect... Well take care and I will let you know how I make out with some of your scenarios... And I will keep you posted on my next two FredRockin into the night!!!!! PS - I cant wait for CMAK did you see the bones from Madmatt... AWESOME.... I love addiction !!!!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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