Nippy Posted May 8, 2003 Share Posted May 8, 2003 I'm trying my hand at my first operation and I need a little help with a few problems that have cropped up. 1. How do I get the defender to stay put? After play testing a few times the defending forces always left the posotions I assigned them in the mission builder as the took off every which way. Note: I found a work around for this with battles where you get to place VL flags. I just put one flag wwwwaaayyyyy at the end of the map with the higest ranking unit and a few guards around it with the player haveing to battle his way through multi-layered defences to get to it. It works well in prefenting units from leaving trenchs and fox holes in a mad rush. 2. In Operations with the window feature (eg, 2000m map with 1000m viewable) why does the computer transfer all forces into the viewable area only even when I set the game to "default unit placement" and I padlock the units. I end up with a huge amount of forces scrunched into a small area when they should have been spread over the whole map. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWB Posted May 8, 2003 Share Posted May 8, 2003 1 is tricky. Bottom line is AI has problems without flags. As for 2, only place the units you want to apper in battle one. For the rest use reinforcements rather than placed units. If you want reinforcements to appear when the map reaches a certain point, use a location based reinforcement flag. But dont rely upon them solely--things can get ugly if they are never triggered. Note that padlocked fortifications will stay in map locations, IIRC. WWB 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SgtMuhammed Posted May 8, 2003 Share Posted May 8, 2003 Hopefully the next build will enable designers to give the AI a general stance like hold in place or hit and fall back. I am having problems getting my guys to stay put as well. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted May 10, 2003 Share Posted May 10, 2003 Originally posted by sgtgoody (esq): Hopefully the next build will enable designers to give the AI a general stance like hold in place or hit and fall back. I am having problems getting my guys to stay put as well. Let's hope so. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanman Posted May 10, 2003 Share Posted May 10, 2003 Having designed a number of huge operation scenarios (see at scenariodepot) I really hope the following problems will be fixed in CMAK operations. 1. Allow flags to be used in operations and make it so the troops defend the flags, not chase after every shot that is fired. 2. A way to make the defending troops stay put and defend instead of attack. 3. Default scenario means the AI does not move any of the troops. 4. Area set up of reinforcements using flags like in a battle. The troops can only be set up with in a certain distance from the flag decided in scenario builder. 5. Better use of FO’s and artillery by AI. 6. If a Fighter-bomber unit cannot attack in a battle due to weather they will be able to attack in the next battle with good weather. 7. Give the scenario designer some options on how the AI forces will attack/defend (send patrols first, stay hidden until contact, etc.,) If BTS would change fix these problem I think operations would be played much more than they are now. I’m one of those people who happens to like operations better than battles as I think they are more interesting, intense, and challenging. PLEASE help us out. Sanman 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MGONZOM Posted May 11, 2003 Share Posted May 11, 2003 Have you done a static operation? There is Flags in these operations... If you set your Troops in Hide they will defend the flag... If you put your FO's in LOS of area you wish they would cover they will shot and if you put a trp there they shoot faster and more accurately(BTW if you want TRPS in each battle you need to add them to reserves for each battle)... I even have seen FOs shoot off a pre planned arty strike in operations and scenarios.. The two biggest problems is reserve troops... I would like to see a turn base location to drop into map... Battle one turn 8 , or battle five turn 3 instead of what we have now... Finaly, the weather should not be random it should be controled by the designer especially if you like to do historical scenarios... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nippy Posted May 11, 2003 Author Share Posted May 11, 2003 Have you done a static operation? There is Flags in these operations... Ah, but they are a double edge sword. Using the single flag trick works great for getting an AI attacker to get moving, but AI defence is another matter. I tried that trick in the Operation I was making. I padlocked all the units and placed a single flag at the rear of the map with a bunker right next to ot to give owernship to the defender. So I start up the 1st battle and everything goes just fine. When the 2nd battle came around the computer took ages to "think". I decided to hit auto-surrender and what do I see? A battalion of Volksturm with support weapons and the schedualed reenforcments all crammed in a 200m by 200m space centered on the flag. :mad: I think what is needed is a Platoon and highter level managedment system. Like: A Company stands ground no matter what B Company Counter Attacks any captued flags. Doesn't Tac-Ops have an overall AI manager? Something along those lines would be nice. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pzman Posted May 11, 2003 Share Posted May 11, 2003 You can use more than one flag just like in scenarios, so if you use more this problem may not appear. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanman Posted May 11, 2003 Share Posted May 11, 2003 I should have said that my operations are CMBO. If CMBB has flags in operations then that is one problem that is solved as long as some troop will actually stay and defend the flag. I have found that no matter what you do, when action starts happening in one area of the map the defending AI will send troops to that area no matter if they are hidden, paddocked or even put in ambush in setup. Anything that will move comes out of their defensive positions eventually and attacks you . It is almost imposible to set up a layered defence You start a small action on one side of the map and pick off the AI as they move, then you attack on the other side of the map and watch them move back. I have slaughtered huge AI forces this way. You are attacking from a defensive position. A human will not move his defensive forces unless he absolutely has to and then will move them to good defensive positions of his choosing. As far as FO’s goes in CMBO they will leave their setup position if they have no LOS on where the fighting is. The AI loses most of it FO’s in the first battles where as a human player knows those FO’s are going to be needed in the next battle. Also the AI lets it’s FO’s get overrun while a human player will retreat them (along with forces that run out of ammo). I agree with Nippy that some sort of operational command system would be a great advance in the game. Just to be clear, I really love this game and am just offering some observations on CMBO which may have been cleared up in CMBB. Sanman 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MGONZOM Posted May 11, 2003 Share Posted May 11, 2003 Yes CMBO had major problems with operations, I tried designing several and was really frustrated with it so I never released an operation... I am currently woking on a historic scenario in CMBB and now am ready to start reserves... If the reserves dump into map like CMBO I will not release it either and that is too bad since the first battle played pretty much as I planned... I am also going to try AI free to set-up, I forget how that worked out in CMBO that may be another option to try... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanman Posted May 11, 2003 Share Posted May 11, 2003 I have found the AI Free To Set Up works better if you are the defender. It gives at least some amount of surprise. The problem is the AI always starts attacking from far back on the map. This is OK if there is a limited amount of LOS due to weather, trees, hills etc. otherwise you see them coming. Al is not real good at sneaking troops around. It doesn’t work as well if the AI is the defender because the AI has no defensive strategy. Flags might help in CMBB, but I haven’t seen much difference in CMBO battles with flags in free set up. I am currently playing my scenarios PBEM for the first time. What a difference. It is much more difficult unpredictable and intense than a Battle or QB. Strategy becomes so much more important. It does take awhile but has never become boring. The battlefield looks great (after 3 of 5 25 turn battles) littered with dead tanks, lots of craters, blown up bridges etc. We have gone from rain to clear to night with huge battles, small actions, Artillery duels, etc. and I love it :cool: . Sanford 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nippy Posted May 13, 2003 Author Share Posted May 13, 2003 Originally posted by Panzerman: You can use more than one flag just like in scenarios, so if you use more this problem may not appear. But there is the Catch 22 of Operations and battles. If I put in Multiple flags, the minute one of them falls the defending forces leave the entrenchments and positions I spend over an hour putting them in. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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