Guest Seimerst Posted February 9, 2000 Share Posted February 9, 2000 I wonder if CMII will include some of the more exotic early Russian solutions to tank killing. For example-- dogs equipped with canvas vests loaded with explosives and a small wooden rod attached to a mercury switch and electric blasting cap. The dogs were fed under tanks and after being deemed trained were taken to the front. The concept being to not feed the dog for several days and then point him at a German tank and he would run underneath it to look for food, the wooden rod, which was pointing in the air would be bent down as the dog got under the tank, triggering the mercury switch and setting off the explosive. Of course there were no concerns of animal rights. This would not be considered a "smart weapon" by today's standards but it does demonstrate a degree of inventiveness. I recall reports of the project being graded as mixed for the dogs were just as liable to seek the more familiar Russion tanks for their chow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurtz Posted February 9, 2000 Share Posted February 9, 2000 I have heard that the dogs went for the Soviet tanks since they recognized them from the training. It´s probably not true, but it´s a good story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xavier Posted February 9, 2000 Share Posted February 9, 2000 And what about these famous canibal guinea pigs used by japaneses against the marines... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iggi Posted February 9, 2000 Share Posted February 9, 2000 I guess they had a large turnover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iggi Posted February 9, 2000 Share Posted February 9, 2000 What of the russian women who mistook the rod for a street broom? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neutral Party Posted February 9, 2000 Share Posted February 9, 2000 Yeah fighting ferrets of fury, hamsters from hell, the screaming budgies, the small pink one (oops! that could be misconstrued) Maybe BTS should also change the weather system so that when it is raining cats and dogs .. Mad, mad I tell you I can't take it any more Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GriffinCheng Posted February 10, 2000 Share Posted February 10, 2000 Even living a country which dogs are slaughtered for consumptions, I think this kind of tactics is horrible. *DISCLAMIER* I like dogs and have never eaten any. Also Hong Kong Law still forbids dog eating. IIRC, long time ago in HPS mailing list had discussions of dog mines. Yes, the Soviets employed dogs to stop German panzers in 1941 and such mines got useless very soon. 1. Dogs were "trained" under Soviet AFV so they got used to the smell. So the dogs sometimes returned back to the Soviet tanks after they are relased. Well, that really caused a havoc 2. Very soon the Germans reailsed the danger of dog mines, there was an order that all dogs were shot on sight Griffin. [This message has been edited by GriffinCheng (edited 02-09-2000).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Babra Posted February 10, 2000 Share Posted February 10, 2000 We ought not forget that "brilliant" American scheme to fire-bomb Japanese cities by releasing bats with timed incendiaries tied to their wee little selves. I guess the idea is they would find a place to roost and then whoooosh... ------------------ Floreat Jerboa ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest KwazyDog Posted February 10, 2000 Share Posted February 10, 2000 From what Ive read this practice also led to the near extinction of dogs along the Eastern Front for nealy 3 years, as they indeed were shot on site. Very sad, poor doggies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GriffinCheng Posted February 10, 2000 Share Posted February 10, 2000 Thoughout the history, human beings have employed animals as weapons. During the era of Seven Kingdoms in China, a general used the "burning bulls" (modified with blades attached to horns and the tails lighted) and let them rushed to the enemies siezing the city. Earlier, injured elephants were used to stop advancing enemies and bought time for the royal family to escape. More examples would be welcome. Griffin @ work Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest KwazyDog Posted February 10, 2000 Share Posted February 10, 2000 Didnt the US in the past train dolphins to detonate underwater mines? I saw a doco on it way back and cant remember any details. Another example would be the use of dead cattle lobbed over the wall of a castle under siege back in the dark ages. The idea was to cause and spread disease..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Big Time Software Posted February 10, 2000 Share Posted February 10, 2000 We probably won't include it as their use was so short and, from what we can tell, limited. It was also a documented problem that the dogs DID in fact go after any tank, red star or German cross not withstanding Yes, German troops for quite some time did in fact shoot dogs on sight. I don't think it lasted very long as the tactic was short lived. I have pictures somewhere of a German unit shooting a dog. Pic of during and after. It was a German Sheppard (ironic, no?) complete with the device Seimerst described in such detail. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe F Posted August 11, 2000 Share Posted August 11, 2000 HI, Fun reading. I also saw a documentary descibing the "FLEA BOMB" a Japanese invention - They breed millions of fleas and gave them blood containg PLAQUE. These critters were to be placed in a bomb were the nose was filled with sand - No explosive material. The Bomb would be dropped as normal and 75% of the fleas would survive on impect and be spread out in a wide erea - They would seek out new hosts, hereby creating PLAQUE epedimic when drinking blood from their victims - as the virus would be transferred. Sounds unreal - dosen't it. They actually tested it on their own people in a small remote village (with a very small version of the plaque bomb) - and an plaque epedimic broke out killing 50 people. As far as i remember the facility was bombed by the US before they acctually used the devices (Maybe the were already suffering from fuel shortige etc). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pathfinder Posted August 11, 2000 Share Posted August 11, 2000 Let's not forget the rabid SS Hamsters the Germans were using... ------------------ unca pathy will show ya the path, if only he could find it himself! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe F Posted August 11, 2000 Share Posted August 11, 2000 Rabid Hamsters ???? The "Fleabomb" is a true story. Discovery channel - Mid 1999. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cward Posted August 11, 2000 Share Posted August 11, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Seimerst: I wonder if CMII will include some of the more exotic early Russian solutions to tank killing. For example-- dogs equipped with canvas vests loaded with explosives and a small wooden rod attached to a mercury switch and electric blasting cap<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> This sounds a bit like the "Flaming Pig Variant" in SPQR.. Basically you could slather a pig in pitch and set him on fire pointing him toward enemy elephants.. seems they dont like little squeely flaming critters running around their feet.. and they go nuts trying to kill them.. Cool! Or in some other Civil War game that I played had a ?Mule? bomb.. same general deal , load up a mule with a few barrels of gunpowder and walk him into the enemy lines.. Whos the genius who thought that one up.. Or the two side by side cannons with shot that had a length of chain between them.. supposedly to cut a swath through the enemy.. problem was getting them to touch off at the same time, so you got this one end going in circles around the gun, killing anyone around.. And didnt some army force mares in heat in front of their lines to distract the enemy stallions? Oh well.. all is fair in love and war.. chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fionn Posted August 11, 2000 Share Posted August 11, 2000 cward, Actually the chained cannonshot thing was very common.. It was quite favoured for taking down masts during naval conflicts. The ground artillerists never seem to have gotten the hang of it though but it was damned succesful on the seas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregory Deych Posted August 11, 2000 Share Posted August 11, 2000 Fionn, As far as I know, the chain shot on naval vessels were fired from a single barrel. Instead of single large ball, they loaded 2 smaller balls connected by chain, which would unspool in flight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rattus Posted August 11, 2000 Share Posted August 11, 2000 Ahhh the incendiary pig my personal favourite - and if it doesn't scare the elephants at least you get roast pork! Also incendiary camel carts, Inca war dog handlers, herds of stampeding cattle... Wicker elephant disguises to make camels look like elephants! Camelry disguised as cavalry(!) the camels scare the horses. nearly as well as elephants do. Angry bears let loose into the enemies mines.. baskets of scorpions or maddened hornets cast by catapult.. And always a favourite at the games - the scythed chariot (also used with remarkably little succes in the field by many ancient armies). When you consider Greek fire the old boiling oil/water/(and in desperation lead!).. baskets of unslaked lime... Ah the good old days! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spook Posted August 11, 2000 Share Posted August 11, 2000 Ah yes, good catch, Gregory. There was an added variant to "anti-rigging shot" in which two cannonballs (either in halves or whole) were connected by a rod. The likelihood of this rig to tumble after exiting the cannon muzzle would capture a similar effect to chainshot against rigging. It sure was nasty business in those days when two ships-of-the-line (or "ragwagons") blasted away at each other point-blank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PzKpfw 1 Posted August 11, 2000 Share Posted August 11, 2000 Everytime someone makes an Ost front game or add on this question is asked . Those dogs didn't discriminate on who's tank they ran under , pretty soon dogs in general for a short time were being shot by both sides armored personell. Regards, John Waters -------- "Go for the eyes Boo, go for the eyes!!!". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ntg84 Posted August 11, 2000 Share Posted August 11, 2000 Lets hope no PETA people play this game and watch the dogs run under the tanks and "BOOM!" Bunch of wackos at PETA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rattus Posted August 11, 2000 Share Posted August 11, 2000 Just think - the dachshunds could go under even tanks with low ground clearance 'course they would have to be slow , but for those rapidly fleeing fascist foes - the faithful soviet greyhound (should that be a US unit ) will get 'em every time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Shaw Posted August 11, 2000 Share Posted August 11, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>They breed millions of fleas and gave them blood containg PLAQUE. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Quite right, the Japanese realized early on that destroying America's dental health was critical to winning the war. And what better way to attack than introducing Plaque! Sorry Joe, I couldn't resist, God knows I've had enough mis-spellings in my posts Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Reece Posted August 11, 2000 Share Posted August 11, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Joe Shaw: They breed millions of fleas and gave them blood containg PLAQUE. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Quite right, the Japanese realized early on that destroying America's dental health was critical to winning the war. And what better way to attack than introducing Plaque! Sorry Joe, I couldn't resist, God knows I've had enough mis-spellings in my posts Joe PLAGUE is a bacterium as well Joe, not a virus, or we'd all be dead now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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