On-Board Artillery?

[jxrey]

I'll admit it, I'm a knucklehead.  After reading dozens of pages of instructions and watching hours and hours of videos, I am still incapable of indirect fire using on-board artillery.  Basically, if my mortar team can't see the target (and risk getting massacred) they can't fire at it.  I've studied an ocean of manuals, web-pages, and videos on this, I follow the instructions (I think), and get no results.  For example, take this mortar unit that appears to be in communication with it's superior unit (Brg Sec Det) which is 35 M away .  

 

 

I've reached my screen shot size limit, but trust me when I say that the superior unit (Brg Sec Det, lying there along the rail line) has line of sight and can target almost any point of the field in front of it.  Yet, the mortar team, 35 meters away, can't target any of the field.  What gives?  Is it because the superior unit needs to be a mortar HQ for the above arrangement to work?  If so, in scenarios such as this where there is no mortar hq, does that mean the mortar cannot engage a target indirectly, that it must expose itself by only killing what it sees?  I must be missing something, but what is it?  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Ithikial_AU]

You are trying to target direct with the 50mm mortar. In this case the mortar team needs to see what it is shooting at (or the ground area you want to pummel) themselves. If you want to shoot an area the on map mortar can't see you'll need to order an indirect attack via the support menu in the same way as if they were off map. There are also minimum ranges for these units as displayed in the UI. A mortar team won't fire straight up for self preservation reasons.

[jxrey]

Thanks for the reply.  Unfortunately, the 50mm mortar does not appear under the support tab of any of my units (including the mortar unit itself).  Same situation and location described above.  

[jxrey]

Also, has anyone else had problems with friendly-fire from artillery?  In the scenario above, 81 mm mortars arrived as reinforcements and instantly appeared in the support tab of my spotter and other units.  Needless to say, I was relieved to finally have some artillery at my disposal since the above-mentioned 50 mm's hadn't fired a shot.  So i set a linear target inside a gully with spotted enemy troops inside.  To my horror, the first 10-12 of the shells fell, with pin-point accuracy, on top of my own units, killing, rattling, and breaking them by the half-dozen.  My troops were over 100 yards away from the closest part of the linear target and almost 200 yards away from the furthest part.  Eventually, some shells started landing in the target area but, by that time, the enemy had displaced so much that it's doubtful I killed many.  

I understand that artillery attacks need to time to slowly 'walk' their way to the target but this was not that.  Instead of "walking" to the target,  the barrage appeared cleanly divided into two separate groups: one on my own men then, switch, another on the target 100-200 yards away.  It was remarkable to me that almost all of the misplaced shots (and there were about 12 of them) landed on the 2% of the map where my own troops were located.   It was so improbable I figured that maybe the shells that landed on my units were actually fired by the enemy and I was confusing my attack with theirs.  However, later, I set another linear target to the other side of the map and, sure enough, shells began to rain down on my positions again, leaving my troops devastated.  But this time there weren't two groups of shells falling, there was only one: on my own units.  Incredibly, not one shell fell inside the desired target zone, eliminating the possibility that these were enemy shells.  

The scenario is CM Normandy, game engine 4, campaign: "A Moment in Time", scenario: "Bridge Over Troubled Waters".  It's a night mission and the mortars in question are 400 yards from the the first-described target and maybe 700 yards from the 2nd.  The mortar team and spotters are regular troops.  Given all that, I was expecting a lot of misses but not an astounding 60% accuracy rating... against my own troops!  This has happened to me before (in the School Daze scenario, I think).   Is there a pattern to this?  A way to avoid it?  Situations where you shouldn't use artillery?  Was this incredibly bad luck, like being struck twice by lightning?  Any information would be appreciated.  

[Howler]

Some mortars such as the British 51mm team assigned to an infantry platoon are not able to fire indirectly. I don't know if that is the case with the German LMT in your screen shot but assume it is. In any event, when a piece isn't in your support tab - it may only be used in a direct fire role. This requires LOS to the target rather than being in contact with a commander. While mortars are able to target spots on the map that other weapons can't - it's not going to allow targeting of a position that is entirely out of LOS. It will allow a (limited) reverse slope target to be fired on.

You can avoid hitting your own position by using a Forward Observer who is trained to guide artillery and also by not calling missions closer than 600m (aka danger close) from friendly positions.

The big difference between on-map and off-map support pieces that populate the support tab is that the former are able to be used in a direct fire role. Other than that - both will need a line of communication to whomever is calling the mission. Without a TRP (Target Reference Point), your effectiveness will be determined by the quality of the shot caller. With a TRP - the shot caller isn't as critical as the ranging has already been worked out.

[Sgt.Squarehead]

A couple of small indirect fire pointers.....Make your target zones a bit smaller & more precise than you would ideally like. The targeted area represents an optimum kill zone, if you will, the actual shells will spread out, a lot! 

Even a Point target will not result in pinpoint impacts unless you are using precision guided munitions (unlikely in CM:BN), and these can be an excellent choice for taking out small clusters of troops, just stick the point in the middle of 'em somewhere.

Make sure your observer has good LOS to the target right up until FFE, the sketchier his LOS, the more the impact spot will deviate.

Edited May 23, 2020 by Sgt.Squarehead

[jxrey]

Thanks Howler.  Good to know that some units wont fire indirectly.  I guess that’s why these mortars would not come up on any support tabs.  Sgt., what you wrote makes sense.  I’ll use more point targets and less area targets.  Will also aim for better quality LOS.