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Heaven & Earth - "Open Beta"

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Posted (edited)
15 hours ago, uru38 said:

Great campaign, I'm really enjoying it. Although I've just gotten to the "Lighting Strike" mission after "Stroll up the hill" and I can't seem to win that mission without it being a draw and subsequent fail for the whole campaign. The enemy always seem to have a "Friendly Bonus" of 20 points that I can't get rid of but there are no enemies left on the map. What am I doing wrong?!

Odd, I haven't got to that mission myself but @Aquila-SmartWargames managed a "minor victory" & got to the next mission (and, indeed, has completed most of both campaigns).

Looking at his post mission screen (in slow motion)... the enemy get their 20 point bonus & cause 19 points worth of damage to the Imperials, the point total was 39.

The Imperials got 33/35 points for kills & the, de-facto bonus, of defending their base for 20 points.... 53 points in total.

Did you perhaps empty your base of troops & lose the bonus... or just suffer heavier casualties (he suffered seven)?

 

Edited by 37mm

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Posted (edited)
17 hours ago, uru38 said:

Great campaign, I'm really enjoying it. Although I've just gotten to the "Lighting Strike" mission after "Stroll up the hill" and I can't seem to win that mission without it being a draw and subsequent fail for the whole campaign. The enemy always seem to have a "Friendly Bonus" of 20 points that I can't get rid of but there are no enemies left on the map. What am I doing wrong?!

The Friendly Bonus is a static value for that mission, it cannot be changed. It's used because I didn't want to give the OPFOR terrain objectives for that particular mission. When you don't use those, it becomes difficult for OPFOR to earn points, so they need a point boost from the beginning. Edit: I might be remembering this wrong. Maybe this actually applies to a whole other mission. But in any case, juggling the points on each side can be difficult when you design a scenario. 

There are some enemies set to spawn long after the time limit runs out. This is to prevent the enemies on map from surrendering, which they have a habit of doing when they aren't than many of them. 

You are probably just losing too many men. If you need some general pointers, maybe look at @Aquila-SmartWargames's playthrough. You are nearing the end, so I hope you'll be able to make it through!

Just curious, did you select to build the outpost on the hill or not? 

Edited by puje

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@puje a Friendly Casualty parameter for the AI force might have helped you here - say you set it at 50% it means that the AI side gets the points if the player ceasefires at start or without inflicting 50% casualties.  It is more flexible than the Friendly Bonus trick.  Obviously setting your percentage threshold requires a few tests but I often use it in conjunction with the Friendly Bonus to give the AI force a points score at the start which automatically results in a player loss if a turn one ceasefire is selected.  Clearly if the human player plays the scenario through then they will reach a point (in this instance 50%) where they have killed the required number of enemy and the AI force no longer gets the VPs for the Friendly Casualty parameter.

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It would be great to see more AARs & get more feedback on the package.

On a personal level I'd really like to see more users getting into the 'Heaven & Earth' editor, even that is different to CM:SF2 these days..... @37mm has done an enormous amount of work, putting together a truly comprehensive mod, it really is different enough to justify a second install (I have one).  B)

PS - @Combatintman.....Ever the guru mate.  Which have you done more of, CTS or scenario designers, I wonder?  ;)

Edited by Sgt.Squarehead

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Though I´m not that much interested in Nam theater I´d likely purchase CMSF2 just to play this mod! You´re using invisible trenches in there? I´d likely replace the jump over animation with the one used for troops exiting a vehicle. This IMO looks more convincing for this particular purpose. Otherwise great mod and worth any the efforts. B)

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2 hours ago, RockinHarry said:

Though I´m not that much interested in Nam theater I´d likely purchase CMSF2 just to play this mod! You´re using invisible trenches in there? I´d likely replace the jump over animation with the one used for troops exiting a vehicle. This IMO looks more convincing for this particular purpose. Otherwise great mod and worth any the efforts. B)

No invisible trenches.

I did have a vague plan of looking at some animations eventually... the overly athletic obstacle jump animation would likely be top of the list to change... I might look into implementing that for 0.97 as it is kinda immersion breaking.

Are there any side effects to this animation swap... or any video's of what it looks like in game (I once saw a video of WW2 forest fighting & there were lots of animation changes... but it's the only one I've ever seen featuring animation mods)?

 

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7 hours ago, Artkin said:

WOW THIS LOOKS AMAZING NEW MODELS?!? SO COOL!!!!!!

There are a few model swaps here & there, many are tagged so that content creators can use them appropriately (the manual explains much), however I think it's the maps that are the true star of Heaven & Earth...

... and more, so many more, are to come.

Edited by 37mm

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10 hours ago, 37mm said:

No invisible trenches.

I did have a vague plan of looking at some animations eventually... the overly athletic obstacle jump animation would likely be top of the list to change... I might look into implementing that for 0.97 as it is kinda immersion breaking.

Are there any side effects to this animation swap... or any video's of what it looks like in game (I once saw a video of WW2 forest fighting & there were lots of animation changes... but it's the only one I've ever seen featuring animation mods)?

 

Ah ok. Think I read in your manual what it is actually.

I don´t know of any side effects of that particular ani file swap. Animation sequence length is the same, but pixeltroopers show less of a targetable footprint. Guess the files hadn´t changed since CMBN so just dropping it in gives a quick impression. (unarmed-vehicle-crew-exit.ani renamed to kar98k-jump.ani)

https://www.dropbox.com/s/3mnkmx9tm8miz0p/kar98k-jump.ani?dl=0

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Just to reply to @37mm and @puje for their help with the campaign scenario: I think I must have taken too many casualties then! I can't remember the exact number of casualties but it certainly wasn't the best of missions I've conducted.

Thanks for the help guys

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On 5/24/2020 at 3:04 PM, Combatintman said:

@puje a Friendly Casualty parameter for the AI force might have helped you here - say you set it at 50% it means that the AI side gets the points if the player ceasefires at start or without inflicting 50% casualties.  It is more flexible than the Friendly Bonus trick.  Obviously setting your percentage threshold requires a few tests but I often use it in conjunction with the Friendly Bonus to give the AI force a points score at the start which automatically results in a player loss if a turn one ceasefire is selected.  Clearly if the human player plays the scenario through then they will reach a point (in this instance 50%) where they have killed the required number of enemy and the AI force no longer gets the VPs for the Friendly Casualty parameter.

Thanks, I'll try this next time 👍

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1 hour ago, puje said:

Thanks, I'll try this next time 👍

No worries - I stumbled across it because I was having the same issues with point balance so that the human player could achieve a Total Victory.  Having a massive Friendly Bonus for the AI meant allocating massive VPs for the human player objectives it was a bit like calling in artillery 'add 100' etc.  Even then, because of the high human objective scores testing would reveal that I could not balance the points to give what I had deemed a 'fair result' either midway through or at the end of the scenario.  Then I hit on the AI Friendly Bonus thing and it made the whole process a lot easier.

Also, in case you aren't aware @Ithikial_AU has made a VP Calculator spreadsheet which is awesome - you just plug the numbers in and it works out all of your VPs.  I can't find a link to it at present but it is well worth the download.

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On 5/25/2020 at 2:11 AM, Sgt.Squarehead said:

It would be great to see more AARs & get more feedback on the package.

On a personal level I'd really like to see more users getting into the 'Heaven & Earth' editor, even that is different to CM:SF2 these days..... @37mm has done an enormous amount of work, putting together a truly comprehensive mod, it really is different enough to justify a second install (I have one).  B)

PS - @Combatintman.....Ever the guru mate.  Which have you done more of, CTS or scenario designers, I wonder?  ;)

I did download it a while back and played with it a bit, had a blast! Didn't create two separate installs though and currently engaged in other battles, so it has been sitting in my unused mods folder for a bit. Can't remember if I gave feedback or not (should have at least), but it's for sure a great effort with great results! Felt like playing a different CM game.

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