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Zveroboy1

What does freezing temperature do in CM?

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Does anyone know what effects it has? I tried doing a quick search but couldn't really find anything that answered my question. Does it affect optics and spotting? Something to do with thermal sights in modern titles? Maybe stamina of your pixel truppen?

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I think it does effect Stamina a little (getting tired quicker), and maybe spotting, but not shooting...Same principle with units that are tired, their spotting might be effected, but, unfortunately not shooting.

Joe

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Freezing temps is GOOD! The ground hardens and chance of vehicle bogging drops to near zero. When I see 'freezing temps' on a scenario I heave a sigh of relief. I think the only modern war title with cold and snow is CM:Afghanistan, which I don't have a working copy of. So I don't think there are many thermal optics around to be affected by freezing temps.

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Posted (edited)

Yes, soldiers should tire more quickly.  I suppose if one was as "Beta Bil" has called me anal :), it should impact projectile ballistics due to the density of air (velocities).

Does the difference 120F in the desert versus -30F on the steppe impact physics of rolled steel armor in terms of its material properties of brittleness vis-a-vis kinetic weapons?  BTW, I am asking for RL and not the game for those who are true students of history or material chemists among us.

Edited by markshot

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Something I noticed from several memoirs I read about Huertgen and Ardennes engagements.  

When going into frontline combat, troops left their greatcoats with their personal gear, even when very cold.  I guess the idea being that they are cumbersome.  You might be really cold, but experience would show that you can recover from that, but not from getting the tail of your coat stuck on a fence post or something.

The reason I mention this is that in scenarios we often see troops on both all sides wearing greatcoats.  Somebody went to a lot of trouble to make those models.  A shame if they just discarded them. 8-)

 

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Propellant in projectiles doesn't like extremes of heat, if I recall some old article correctly. The Israelis installed AC in the Merkava not for crew comfort but to regulate the temps of the rounds. If the round gets too hot the ballistics get iffy. In 1989 the 16 inch gun propellant detonated in the turret of the USS Iowa. After initially making some very shady excuses for it happening, they eventually admitted the gun cotton propellant had been stored in a baking-hot supply ship for months.

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Posted (edited)

We shouldn't forget about the sound of the cold wind wooshing over the fields and among the trees when playing a Winter scenario. That sound always makes me enjoy those Winter scenarios/quick battles more.

If the pixeltruppen could comment on it they would probably curse that wind.

Edited by BornGinger

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On 1/2/2020 at 8:26 AM, markshot said:

Yes, soldiers should tire more quickly.  I suppose if one was as "Beta Bil" has called me anal :), it should impact projectile ballistics due to the density of air (velocities).

Does the difference 120F in the desert versus -30F on the steppe impact physics of rolled steel armor in terms of its material properties of brittleness vis-a-vis kinetic weapons?  BTW, I am asking for RL and not the game for those who are true students of history or material chemists among us.

Depends on the steel selected. As a very general answer:  „Ordinary“ construction steel is normally good up to -20degC. Below, one would have to go with  special low temp steel.

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On 1/2/2020 at 2:24 AM, Zveroboy1 said:

Does anyone know what effects it has? I tried doing a quick search but couldn't really find anything that answered my question. Does it affect optics and spotting? Something to do with thermal sights in modern titles? Maybe stamina of your pixel truppen?

I have not been able to notice any effect of freezing teperatures, apart from less risk of bogging. I think snow has some effect on stamina for moving infantry, but that's the snow doing it, not the cold temperatures.

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13 hours ago, Ts4EVER said:

Would be interesting if wounded guys died quicker.

Actually, extreme cold could also save lives as leaking blood would freeze and respiration would slow.  So, maybe a wash?

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Yes, there are documented cases of people having fallen through the ice of ponds and being resuscitated after 30 minutes.

I had open heart surgery in 1999, and they chilled my body to add to the time that they could stop my heart (about 20 minutes) while they worked.  The only time I have been dead in my life.

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Posted (edited)

If anyone would like to read about how the climate can effect on combat in real life there's some info on the All World Wars website which tells us about the situation in Russia during the war. That blog contains a lot of other interesting information and some really nice pictures made by soldiers who got inspiration from the battlefield and a German-English list of military terminology in case someone would need that.

Edited by BornGinger

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Quote

The Russians usually attacked along existing roads or on paths beaten down by their tanks. Frequently, the infantry followed close behind their tanks, using the trail made by the tank tracks.

I never thought about in all that old film footage.  I always thought they were using the tanks for cover ... (not above)

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52 minutes ago, markshot said:
Quote

The Russians usually attacked along existing roads or on paths beaten down by their tanks. Frequently, the infantry followed close behind their tanks, using the trail made by the tank tracks.

I never thought about in all that old film footage.  I always thought they were using the tanks for cover ... (not above)

They would also be pretty sure that the tank had cleared any AP mines in the tracks.

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2 hours ago, Bulletpoint said:

They would also be pretty sure that the tank had cleared any AP mines in the tracks.

Couldn't there be a risk that AP mines damage the conveyor belts on the tanks? Or does that only happen in films and Combat Mission?

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18 minutes ago, BornGinger said:

Couldn't there be a risk that AP mines damage the conveyor belts on the tanks? Or does that only happen in films and Combat Mission?

Probably it could damage the tracks, but it's war. Many things can damage the tracks. I don't know if they deliberately used tanks for mineclearing, but I guess that no matter which direction the tank goes, there's always a risk of hitting a mine. And from the infantry's perspective, it's nice to only step where the tank has already gone.

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Bulletpoint said:

I don't know if they deliberately used tanks for mineclearing,

Not without a roller.  ;)

C'mon @Battlefront.com we really need Soviet (& post-Soviet come to think of it) Mine-Roller Tanks.....All the assault columns in Bagration were led by companies of T-34 Minerollers IIRC. 

Here's a Polish one:

4b6d041fb40a1cf9326d14da525b1ea8.jpg

Let's be honest.....The game doesn't handle mines brilliantly and these vehicle would really help to make up for that (IMHO).

6 hours ago, Bulletpoint said:

And from the infantry's perspective, it's nice to only step where the tank has already gone.

This is the key to it.....The infantry could feel a lot more confident if a tank had driven somewhere first (but I bet they gave wrecks a wide berth).  :P

Edited by Sgt.Squarehead

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2 minutes ago, Sgt.Squarehead said:
6 hours ago, Bulletpoint said:

I don't know if they deliberately used tanks for mineclearing,

Not without a roller.  ;)

Roller not available, comrade. Tank available.

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On 1/3/2020 at 9:57 AM, markshot said:

Hmm ... am I confusing this with extreme heat or cold of CMx1?

In CM1 didn't mg's "jam" quicker in freezing weather?

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I don't remember.

Do mg's even jam in CMx2?  Certainly there is no text for it like there was in CMx1 (I believe, a little jam tag above the gun).

BTW, it also seems to me that tanks bog less frequently in CMx2; true or my imagination?  Also, it seems tank crews have a little more courage in CMx2.  I seem to remember my Shermans popping smoke and backing up as soon as they saw a Tiger or a Panther even when they had a flanking shot and the target hadn't even spotted them.  True or failing memory?

AFVs do a better job of spacing in CMx2, I remember some incredible traffic SNAFUs in CMx1.

I see that dust got carried over now and plays a bigger role.  I never liked dust added with CMAK, because, it was too obvious to the human player, and the AI didn't know that dust meant armor inbound.

I am enjoying this game.  For all my criticism of 3D oddities, the movies are fun.  I remember how CMx1 soldiers appeared to be ice skating from place to place.  :)

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