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Majestic12

Playing as Brazilians

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they are basically just US forces with 1903's and 1917s instead of garands. no armor, i think there is some US made armored cars? alot of the new countries have infantry only rosters.

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1 hour ago, Cobetco said:

they are basically just US forces with 1903's and 1917s instead of garands. no armor, i think there is some US made armored cars? alot of the new countries have infantry only rosters.

It's the nature of this game that little things make quite a difference - at least they do to me.

I'm playing a QB with Free French at the moment. They have US equipment and some similarities in force structure, but also some real differences. It's not all like playing as US.

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5 hours ago, Majestic12 said:

I kind of want to pick this up if only to play as the Brazilians in Rome to Victory. How do they play in quick battle and what Brazilian assets do you get to play with? 

Brazilian Army - per R2V release notes

  • Engineer Battalion 44

  • Infantry Battalion 44 (lorried)

  • Regimental Antitank Company 44

  • Antiaircraft Battery (field)

  • Cavalry Troop

  • Bunker- M1 57mm

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There's a couple proper scenarios featuring Brazilians in the module. One takes place during Operation Encore when the 10th Mtn Division and Brazilian F.E.B. were cooperating in opening a route through the Apennines.

 

Brazilians.jpg

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11 hours ago, MikeyD said:

There's a couple proper scenarios featuring Brazilians in the module. One takes place during Operation Encore when the 10th Mtn Division and Brazilian F.E.B. were cooperating in opening a route through the Apennines.

 

Brazilians.jpg

Ouch, Brazilians in snow! That must have been horrible for soldiers from a subtropical country.

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Meh. Fixation with the Garand has led to misleading ideas about the firepower of US infantry, which mainly emerged from the many kinds of Browning machine guns which were often detached to Platoons to make use of. The Garand is great....but if you try to treat as your chief source of firepower I believe you'll find it's out its league against the most likely opponent...the MG34/42. In fact belief in the Garand's superiority turned out to be a dangerous illusion that the war broke hence all those panicked attempts to push the M1919 into use as a SAW and why US infantry tended to horde BARs in excess of authorization. Luckily the M1919 and M1917 were so plentiful that Officers frequently let Platoons or Squads have em. The Garand definitely had a role to play in the "Typhoon of Steel" American troops were often known for...but the majority of that was plentiful allotments of assets normally reserved at the Battalion or Regimental level in most armies. Only the German Army tended to be as cool about releasing very heavy equipment to very low ranks. 

I personally use rifle infantry for screening my heavy weaponry...and little else. I guess much of it is playstyle but tbh I don't find much difference between the Garand and Springfield the way I play. I don't expect rifle infantry to achieve much outside of grenade chucking range and usually task them with that in mind. Screen my mortars and machine guns and trench raid enemy positions once close enough for which the grenade is the tool of choice. The boys could be armed with pitchforks or claymores for all I care. 

 

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Well, the way I see is the following. US Army infantry squads firepower is lacking especially when compared with that of countries equipping their infantry squads with organic, real LMGs. Indeed, not a huge difference since you are already at a disadvantage.

So if I look at the Brazilians I will be like "okay, let me plan for this attack and make sure I have light mortars and HMGs from the Weapons company attached. Four squads will be more than enough for the task".

And that will be possibly wrong. By having the vintage rifles possibly I will need 4.5 or 5 squads to do the same job. That half team worth of weight of fire may or not prove useful, but I would rather account for it than cutting corners. 

 

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2 hours ago, BletchleyGeek said:

That's a significant reduction in squad firepower.

its also something you can experience in base FI by setting your troop equipment in the editor to poor. it'll replace all those m1's with 1903a3's. still works with the US in R2V. though it doesn't replace the grenade launcher m1's.

Edited by Cobetco

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There's no need for theorizing. Hop on the game and try them out! :lol:
 You could place a US squad next to a Brazilian and give an area fire order. See if you can note any difference in out-going volume of fire between the two.

 I'm interested in hearing back from a player after giving R2V Riva Ridge a spin. Fair warning, its pretty bloody.

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I find the Garand is a pretty hard hitting weapon. A couple of squads of Armoured Infantry can unleash a lot of firepower - a lot more than the equivalent number of British troops.

It's fun playing with troops that have less modern rifles - it changes the whole feel of the battle.

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If you have a clear line of fire for all of your men and are about 200ish meters then yeah all those Garand's fusillading an individual target will work about as well as a machine gun, I just don't think those are the circumstances my infantry find themselves in most of the time in CM. 

Certainly though, in urban environments and/or defense the Garand's ability to pour out fire is more important than individual marksmanship. If you're going for marksmanship there's not much difference between the Garand and the Springfield. If what you need is suppression though than you'll need the Garand. 

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On 12/2/2019 at 3:48 AM, SimpleSimon said:

I personally use rifle infantry for screening my heavy weaponry...and little else. I guess much of it is playstyle but tbh I don't find much difference between the Garand and Springfield the way I play. I don't expect rifle infantry to achieve much outside of grenade chucking range and usually task them with that in mind. Screen my mortars and machine guns and trench raid enemy positions once close enough for which the grenade is the tool of choice. The boys could be armed with pitchforks or claymores for all I care. 

My experience is very different. The Garand is great until about 150-200m. The LMG42 could be expected to dominate the Garand from 300-600m, but it doesn't, really, as far as I can see. It's very imprecise in this game, and only becomes really dangerous at ranges where the Garand also shines.

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On 12/2/2019 at 4:21 AM, MikeyD said:

I'm interested in hearing back from a player after giving R2V Riva Ridge a spin. Fair warning, its pretty bloody.

Really challenging.....The terrain is properly tricky and timing your moves is very important. 

In my first attempt things went very wrong on this front and my units were cut down piecemeal fashion.....I'll do better next time.

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On 12/3/2019 at 4:30 PM, Bulletpoint said:

My experience is very different. The Garand is great until about 150-200m. The LMG42 could be expected to dominate the Garand from 300-600m, but it doesn't, really, as far as I can see. It's very imprecise in this game, and only becomes really dangerous at ranges where the Garand also shines.

Main thing for me when attacking is just that the men spot what's shooting at them. I don't care if they shoot back and would mostly prefer they didn't until I can sortie up an M1917/19/M2/Forward Observer to their position. Once I have a weapon that can overmatch or at least meet the peer-German weapon it's facing off against then the guys can join in. This isn't always what I do and it's mostly dependent upon the timidity of the defense. It isn't always preferable to divide up weapons elements and it isn't always preferable to leave them on overwatch. I'm crazy enough to see M2 teams as mainly assault troops/w a mortar than a mortar team with assault weapons, you know? Potato-poh-tah-to. 

22 hours ago, Sgt.Squarehead said:

Really challenging.....The terrain is properly tricky and timing your moves is very important. 

In my first attempt things went very wrong on this front and my units were cut down piecemeal fashion.....I'll do better next time.

I'll be giving that scenario a swing soon since im really drawn to the Brazilian scenarios more than I thought i'd be. I love the idea of American-style ToEs….but minus the Garand. I can imagine i'm probably about to pay for my preference for the M1903 in a Meeting Engagement with German forces though. 

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"Potato - poh-tah-to".. As it would have sounded to the boys at the sharp end on their wind-up gramophones. (If you don't know what one of them is ask a ... oh just google it).

 

Edited by Warts 'n' all

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