Newbie DAR/AAR: ncc1701e vs JoMc67D

[Falaise]

no ! I check every day to read more

[ncc1701e]

MINUTE 17

One MG42 is firing at the sound contact still available on the house where shots were coming.

Meanwhile, my troops are once again advancing.

I am experimenting the Hull Down command on the house for some direct fire support later.

[ncc1701e]

MINUTE 18

MG42 continues its suppression work while my troops are moving.

I do not know what the armored car is doing but appearently it has some difficulties to respond to my Hull Down command.

Finally, it ends there spotting the enemy armored car.

Next turn, my armored car will area fire near the enemy armored car not to violate our house rules...

Edited November 7, 2018 by ncc1701e

[Oliver_88]

6 hours ago, ncc1701e said:

I am experimenting the Hull Down command on the house for some direct fire support later.

 

6 hours ago, ncc1701e said:

I do not know what the armored car is doing but appearently it has some difficulties to respond to my Hull Down command.

Finally, it ends there spotting the enemy armored car.

I tend to use the Hull Down command combined with the Target command. Because then where the Hull Down commands node is placed kind of determines the limit of movement. And the Target command determines the position to be hull down to, and therefore stop their movement once they can see it.

So take a tank behind an ridgeline, and you want them to go hull down to a enemy position somewhere. You can place the Hull Down command near the top of your ridgeline. And give that node a Target command onto the enemy position. The tank would move forward to that node and stop once it sees the enemy position. But should he not see the targeted enemy position during the movement then no problem he's going to stop near the top of the ridgeline anyway. But not using the Target command and just placing the Hull Down node onto the enemy position your tank might move over the ridgeline and continue downhill moving right onto the enemy position if needs be.

I reckon that's probably got something to do with the reason he's acting strange in your situation. It's being told to move to the ground in front of the house (and only stop once it can see that terrain). And for some reason takes that route towards the house as it considers it would take the least effort (maybe because of the nearby road and lack of brush compared to the direct route). And it only then ends up stopping once it passes through the fence because it now can see the terrain in front house.

Edited November 8, 2018 by Oliver_88

[A Canadian Cat]

9 hours ago, Oliver_88 said:

I tend to use the Hull Down command combined with the Target command.

Yes, this!!! All of what @Oliver_88 said but I'll add two things:

1) if you use the target command method then the worst thing that can happen is your vehicle moves to the top of the ridge. Which might not be good but its way better than driving out in the open towards enemy lines with no support.

2) to prevent the worst case in #1 make sure the location where the hull down command starts has no LOS to the location. The Hull Down command works best if the vehicle has no LOS to the area of interest at the beginning and a clear blue LOS line at the end.

[ncc1701e]

Thanks guys for these tips!

[ncc1701e]

MINUTE 19

My armored car is starting its area fire while my men continue to push forward.

The enemy armored car shoud take few bullets I hope.

But, it is firing on my Panzerschreck team.

Finally, the enemy armored car is falling back.

But, this is too late. Even if two squads are advancing toward the village, they won't reach it before the end...

Edited November 8, 2018 by ncc1701e

[domfluff]

Yeah, Hull Down is best used like this:



The above example is still a little risky (a little over-emphasised for effect) - if the target point can't find a hull down position along the move path, then the tank will move to the end of the Hull Down command regardless - so in this case this would include cresting the hill and over the other side, which could be dangerous. Probably sensible to try to stick the Hull Down waypoint on your side of the hill, so in the worst case it'll either not get LOS, or it'll be partially covered.

(The "Target" command in this case will not cause the tank to fire.)

Without the target command, the Tank tries to find a Hull Down to that point, and if it can't then it will just complete the move. With the above you can control where your vehicle ends up significantly more accurately.

End result of the above: 


 

[ncc1701e]

Thanks @domfluff. Will try next time. Does it work the same between Target, Target Light and Target Briefly?

Edited November 9, 2018 by ncc1701e

[ncc1701e]

MINUTE 20

My armored car is on its way for a risky move. I hope to contest the objective before the end. I hope The British in the house are suppressed enough and won't return fire.

My squad is still progressing well without return fires. If I had to retry this scenario, this was perhaps my best avenue of approach compared to the woods...

Armored car in danger now...

Ah ah! I am taking shots from my right. There are some guys on the second objective too. Finally, @JoMc67 has splitted his forces.

Hello there!

[domfluff]

1 hour ago, ncc1701e said:

Thanks @domfluff. Will try next time. Does it work the same between Target, Target Light and Target Briefly?

Yeah, is just using the target line as a LOS tool - there's no actual firing from the command.

Obviously the vehicle will have LOS to that square, so there may well be something there to fire at, but that'll be the vehicle's decision.

[patrykd]

By the way nice aar waiting for next one. Try to watch some tutorials

[ncc1701e]

On 11/11/2018 at 10:25 AM, patrykd said:

By the way nice aar waiting for next one. Try to watch some tutorials

Thank you - I am watching them. But, it is sometimes difficult to make them into practice ...

[ncc1701e]

MINUTE 21

My troops are assaulting for a last "baroud d'honneur".

While one squad is covering my right flank.

But, my hopes are gone. Third squad is falling back and the spotters, left behind, fail to see from where shots are coming.

 

Edited November 13, 2018 by ncc1701e

[ncc1701e]

MINUTE 22

My armored car is hunting its nemesis while another squad is progressing.

Surprisingly, it seems no armored car is able to see each other !!? They did not fire at each other.

But, I have no time to investigate why. The logical conclusion just arrived.

Final enemy setup is below:

[Falaise]

Bonjour

Another officer sending men to death for a matter of honor
assassin !!!

" baroud d'honneur" is a very French term

[ncc1701e]

3 minutes ago, Falaise said:

Bonjour

Another officer sending men to death for a matter of honor
assassin !!!

" baroud d'honneur" is a very French term

Another junior officer far from being an officer, you should say... The definition of this French term is here:

https://www.defense.gouv.fr/actualites/articles/faire-un-baroud-d-honneur

I agree that my second game was far from perfect. 

[Falaise]

Je connaissais bien le sens précis du terme mais pas son origine merci pour cet article

and thank you for this AAR which always allows to discover the subtlety of the game

 

[ncc1701e]

MY CONCLUSION

I think I did not study enough the terrain. Okay fair, I have lost some time at the beginning of the scenario doing some scouting while approaching the village through the woods. But, even with this time lost, my mistake was to attack from the woods directly in his kill zone. The second avenue of approach with the little hollow would perhaps have been a better approach. I do not know what you guys think.

With @JoMc67, we will play the same scenario but with me taking the Canadians while he takes the Germans. This will be interesting for learning.

 

[ncc1701e]

18 minutes ago, Falaise said:

Je connaissais bien le sens précis du terme mais pas son origine merci pour cet article

and thank you for this AAR which always allows to discover the subtlety of the game

 

Merci à toi, la suite prochainement... 

[Wicky]

As Robert the Bruce is meant to have said to his troops  ""If at first you don't succeed try, try and try again." CM is like chess the more you play the luckier you'll get (or just bake into a game for your side some 155mm equaliser...) or use Enigma machine simulator to crack your opponents password  http://enigma.louisedade.co.uk

[domfluff]

Meeting Engagements in CM are frequently a problem - rushing to grab the centre is neither particularly authentic, nor particularly satisfying - attack/defend scenarios are often a little better.

The more interesting meeting engagement setups tend to have distinct "mine" and "yours" objectives - both sides then have to consider their attack and their defence, which produces something much more reasonable.

[JoMac]

And a Good Game Indeed, NCC...

As others have mentioned, playing 'Meeting Engagements' is a 'Who gets there faster" syndrome along with using the Game Mechanics to your benefit...Keep this in mind for future gaming.

I used my Mortar to Area-Fire a location next to enemy Icon (within 2x Action-Spots), and for most part tried to have my Infantry in Keyhole positions as to not fully engage head-on and keep casualties to a minimum...I indeed somehow lost 1x Casualty due to being too careless

The AC's  had a more or less 'CAMEO EFFECT' since being introduced in last quarter of game...I'm also not sure why these AC's didn't engage each other (had this situation many a times in past). My guess is that the MG's can't damage each other and so will not engage...However, I've never tried using the 'Target' Order against each other to see if they would indeed fire.

Next Game will be a 'Mirror version with NCC as Canukes...Oh, and the only Commonwealth forces I play are the Scotts, Irish & Canukes as the rest don't count :-)..The Game will be increased to 25+5, AC's will come on in 15 minutes, and the Green Infantry Soft Factors have been increased a little for slightly better staying power (All Green troops will retain High Motivation, increased leadership to 0, and CW HQ only will have a +1 Leadership). Think I also changed one aspect of the 'House Rules' a little.

 

[Warts 'n' all]

11 hours ago, JoMc67 said:

Oh, and the only Commonwealth forces I play are the Scotts,

 

Rab C. sits slumped at the bar of The Clansman with about an inch of lager left in his glass. Then all of a sudden he sits bolt upright. "Eey Jamesie, will youse liisshen to this pish. Hes doesnae knowse the difference between "Scot" and "Scott".

"Aye, yer right there, Rab. Who would yer have in an army full of Scotts?" ........

So let's answer his question.

Sir Walter Scott, who would go into battle dressed as Ivanhoe on a white charger, and promptly get shot .

Terry Scott, who would refuse to go into battle unless Joon Whitfield was holding his hand.

Cpt. Robert Falcon Scott, a man so stupid that he tried to reach the South Pole using pit ponies instead of huskies.

And, Sir Peter Scott who whenever given the binoculars to study the Jerries positions, would shout "Father, father, there's a falcon!" Only to be told, "That's me, you Stupid Boy".

 

[domfluff]

 

12 hours ago, JoMc67 said:

the Green Infantry Soft Factors have been increased a little for slightly better staying power (All Green troops will retain High Motivation, increased leadership to 0, and CW HQ only will have a +1 Leadership).

Worth mentioning that according to testing, the HQ's leadership will only affect the HQ unit itself - it doesn't filter down.

According to @Josey Wales''s work, the suppression resistance that commanders give troops is only reliant on having active C2 links, and not dependant on any Leadership stat. 

Since C2 can be broken by suppression, this does mean that a high leadership HQ unit will maintain C2 for longer under fire (since it will stay unsuppressed for longer) - so a high leadership HQ is better at leading from the front, whereas a bad leader is better left safely behind cover, letting the squads get on with it (but maintaining contact).

So it works out to being a similar effect, but backwards, and only if you are careful about maintaining command and control.