Demo Feedback

[domfluff]

15 hours ago, Ch53dVet said:

just try putting a point target arty request on the bmp in the training mission and you'll be guaranteed multiple hits on the mosque and every else except for the bmp, SF1 & Black Sea, never had a problem with precise arty mission requests. 

(It's a BTR, but shrug)

In CMBS, both 120mm mortars and 155m artillery have access to "Precision" missions, since both have a limited amount of guided munitions (XM395 mortar rounds, M982 Excaliber). The Excaliber rounds were (just!) available in the 2007 timeframe of CMSF, but the mortar rounds were not deployed until 2012.

In the tutorial mission, you do not get the option for a Precision mission, just a Point mission, which is going to be as inaccurate as any mortar attack.

[Tuomio]

1. In alamo the Syrian tanks seem to be too good spotters, the can come up full throttle buttoned up and spot my antitank teams easily, faster than the veteran soldiers can spot the tanks (which would never be the case IMO)

2. Very often the soldiers lose sight of the tanks rolling around nearby, probably due to the small dust clouds, tank should not be lost easily after they have been sighted

3. Soldiers should not be eager to shoot 40mm HE rounds on syrian tanks. It causes them to lose cover quickly and die.

[Ch53dVet]

3 hours ago, domfluff said:

(It's a BTR, but shrug)

In CMBS, both 120mm mortars and 155m artillery have access to "Precision" missions, since both have a limited amount of guided munitions (XM395 mortar rounds, M982 Excaliber). The Excaliber rounds were (just!) available in the 2007 timeframe of CMSF, but the mortar rounds were not deployed until 2012.

In the tutorial mission, you do not get the option for a Precision mission, just a Point mission, which is going to be as inaccurate as any mortar attack.

It's just that when you are assigned a specialized unit I.E. Forward observation unit you'd expect them to hold off calling "Fire for Effect" until, at least, 2 of your spotter rounds, from your allotment of 28 120mm rounds, could bracket an area on two opposite sides of the bmp. In the demo, (twice played) every round for a point target mission fell in a perfectly close nit grouping, 1 click east of the compound, in the barren desert.

[Ch53dVet]

6 hours ago, holoween said:

I've tried that in my first playthrough and it didnt work. their tanks simply drove through them.

Well...that's a first, unless, that's scripted for enemy troops only, all my heavy vehicles (in other era CM games) either have to go around or are blocked completely from going forward over a bridge littered with heavy vehicles, go figure.

[Ch53dVet]

1 hour ago, Tuomio said:

1. In alamo the Syrian tanks seem to be too good spotters, the can come up full throttle buttoned up and spot my antitank teams easily, faster than the veteran soldiers can spot the tanks (which would never be the case IMO)

2. Very often the soldiers lose sight of the tanks rolling around nearby, probably due to the small dust clouds, tank should not be lost easily after they have been sighted

3. Soldiers should not be eager to shoot 40mm HE rounds on syrian tanks. It causes them to lose cover quickly and die.

I like it when your two man anti-tank team is set up in a building next to a road with a close range "armored target arc" and the assistant fires his rifle first as the tank enters the target area, or better yet if the team discharged it's anti-tank round successfully in an earlier engagement and go back to "wait for the next tank mode", then when the next one rolls into the engagement area the team then decides that now is the time to re-load the weapon, not while they were waiting for the next target to come along.

[RexSaur]

In "Breaking the bank" the on map mortar teams can only fire directly. Even the mortar is deployed it does not come up in the artillery menu and the whole point of using mortars is they can fire volleys without LOS.

In the same scenario there are some glitched building walls where soldiers inside the building position themselves outside. The enemy then fires a rocket and kills the soldier outside and inside of that building.

Same scenario I had problems with artillery fire when loading a savegame. The length and the location of the artillery fire drastically changes when loading a savegame. Same problem with helicopter attack. In one instance splash rounds were reported complete and fire for effect announced. I saved the game artillery kept firing for 2+ minutes. Then I loaded the savegame and I got message "rounds complete".

[Lethaface]

9 hours ago, RexSaur said:

In "Breaking the bank" the on map mortar teams can only fire directly. Even the mortar is deployed it does not come up in the artillery menu and the whole point of using mortars is they can fire volleys without LOS.

In the same scenario there are some glitched building walls where soldiers inside the building position themselves outside. The enemy then fires a rocket and kills the soldier outside and inside of that building.

 

The brit platoon CO does have the 51mm direct fire only mortar, which is intended in that role (look it up IRL). It's not a mortar team, more like a grenade launcher. They are different from 'normal' on map mortar teams, that can fire indirectly. You also have 81mm off map mortars available in this scenario.

Regarding the building glitches: yes I noticed those too.

Edited November 4, 2018 by Lethaface

[c3k]

On ‎10‎/‎31‎/‎2018 at 3:52 PM, Ch53dVet said:

I like it when your two man anti-tank team is set up in a building next to a road with a close range "armored target arc" and the assistant fires his rifle first as the tank enters the target area, or better yet if the team discharged it's anti-tank round successfully in an earlier engagement and go back to "wait for the next tank mode", then when the next one rolls into the engagement area the team then decides that now is the time to re-load the weapon, not while they were waiting for the next target to come along.

 

On ‎10‎/‎31‎/‎2018 at 1:59 PM, Tuomio said:

1. In alamo the Syrian tanks seem to be too good spotters, the can come up full throttle buttoned up and spot my antitank teams easily, faster than the veteran soldiers can spot the tanks (which would never be the case IMO)

2. Very often the soldiers lose sight of the tanks rolling around nearby, probably due to the small dust clouds, tank should not be lost easily after they have been sighted

3. Soldiers should not be eager to shoot 40mm HE rounds on syrian tanks. It causes them to lose cover quickly and die.

 

Hmm. Good points. Any savegames?

[Cambronne]

Chinstraps missing for syrian infantry (both regular and special forces). The bmp and mdr files are there but the chinstrap is not visible in game.

[absolutmauser]

On 10/31/2018 at 3:52 PM, Ch53dVet said:

I like it when your two man anti-tank team is set up in a building next to a road with a close range "armored target arc" and the assistant fires his rifle first as the tank enters the target area, or better yet if the team discharged it's anti-tank round successfully in an earlier engagement and go back to "wait for the next tank mode", then when the next one rolls into the engagement area the team then decides that now is the time to re-load the weapon, not while they were waiting for the next target to come along.

It takes a while to high five everyone after you destroy the first tank, so maybe they were still working through their touchdown celebration dance routines when the second one showed up? 

[RexSaur]

One feature that would really come in handy would be to restrict the use of certain weapons with a tick box/toggle or something like that. For example I want to order a bradley to suppress the enemy in a building with its machine gun. If I use the target command the bradley fires TOW, 25mm and machine gun. If I order target light it still fires 25mm. If the UI had a way to "turn off" a weapon system that would make the whole targeting a lot easier because you would not need to use different commands target and target light and it would prevent units firing precious AT ammo while overwatching.

Same situation applies for infantry squads. If there would be a toggle to prevent the use of weapons like RPG/AT4/Javelins etc. it would be easier to control squads so they don't fire precious Javelin missiles at buildings or RPGs at light vehicles.

[Erwin]

Firing a main gun like the 25mm when one only wants MG fire to cover one's attacking inf can be fatal to the inf.  So, yes, this is an issue one hopes will be addressed.

 

[IICptMillerII]

10 hours ago, RexSaur said:

Same situation applies for infantry squads. If there would be a toggle to prevent the use of weapons like RPG/AT4/Javelins etc. it would be easier to control squads so they don't fire precious Javelin missiles at buildings or RPGs at light vehicles.

For infantry, use the Target Light command, and they will not use Javelins/RPGs/etc.

[Thewood1]

Its weird, I have never had an ATGM team not reload immediately.  In fact, now and then, they will reload when the better action would have been to hoof it because there is a 125mm response on the way.

[RexSaur]

1 hour ago, IICptMillerII said:

For infantry, use the Target Light command, and they will not use Javelins/RPGs/etc.

Sometimes I want them to use the AT4 against buildings but not the Javelins. The commands "target" and "target light" unfortunately don't allow for such detail.

[IICptMillerII]

2 hours ago, RexSaur said:

Sometimes I want them to use the AT4 against buildings but not the Javelins. The commands "target" and "target light" unfortunately don't allow for such detail.

Split off the anti-tank team in a squad. That separates the Javelin and his assistant. Then you have the rest of the squad free to fire AT-4s into buildings and more. 

[Erwin]

5 hours ago, IICptMillerII said:

Split off the anti-tank team in a squad.

Exactly. 

The only issue is that the 9 man US squads can only be split into 2 teams.  So, if 2 guys are in one team, that leaves an unwieldy 7-man team.  I suppose if this reflects RL, that's ok.  But, it doesn't make much sense. 

In CMBS the 7 man Ukr squads can be split into 3 teams (2+2+3) and that makes them tactically much more useful than the US - which again is counterintuitive.

[domfluff]

Yeah, splitting off scout teams or AT teams from US squads is something I'd only do temporarily.

More and more recently I'm finding myself *only* using "Split Squads" - the outcomes are predictable, and the resulting units tend to be self-sufficient if needed.

[Erwin]

Sometimes it's hard to decide whether to simply do a SPLIT or ASSAULT split.  With a SPLIT each team's firepower is fairly even.  With ASSAULT split the longer range support firepower stays in one team while the assault team only has rifles and grenades.  If you get the split wrong it takes time to recombine and redo the split.

[domfluff]

Sure. The "Split squads" button also divides them very predictably, and usually by doctrine - they divide into the columns that appear in the UI:



This Syrian squad from the CMSF 2 demo will always split into two elements with a Split Squads command - one base of fire element with the PKM, and one manoeuvre element with three men and the RPG (so in practice this implies something more like a modern French squad, or a WW2 Commonwealth one).

Modern US squads are built symmetrically, as are WW2 Panzergrenadiers, but that's not the case for every nation, formation and time period.

Part of the reason for me using "Split Squads" more is that there's no chance of getting the split wrong - you know precisely what you're getting.

[RexSaur]

16 hours ago, IICptMillerII said:

Split off the anti-tank team in a squad. That separates the Javelin and his assistant. Then you have the rest of the squad free to fire AT-4s into buildings and more. 

True but this doesn't work if I have split the team already.

[Erwin]

13 hours ago, domfluff said:

This Syrian squad from the CMSF 2 demo will always split into two elements

It is interesting that in CMBS one can split a 7-man Ukr squad into 3 teams.  Was hoping we could do similar in CMSF2.

[domfluff]

It is. It's also interesting that the CMSF 2 Syrian TO&E is very different from CMSF 1 - in CMSF 1 the same squad would have nine men with two RPK's, not seven with a single PKM.

Technically the driver and gunner of the BMP are the other two squad members (and the third "team"), but since they should stay mounted that doesn't really count.

[Michael Emrys]

On 11/8/2018 at 12:52 PM, domfluff said:

More and more recently I'm finding myself *only* using "Split Squads" - the outcomes are predictable, and the resulting units tend to be self-sufficient if needed.

That's what I've been doing for the last couple of years or so. Having a couple of extra armed men along to handle anything the team might flush can be a real life saver sometimes.

Michael

[Pandur]

i played and won all demo scenarios and i like what i see. i honestly think this will be the best CM game yet. there is so much included, you can create all type of scenarios with the kits and vehicles in the game. i am fired up!

 

some small problems i see are;

- soldiers seem to be more "creative" when selecting which door to use and they not always use the same door. in "the passage at wilcox" i had a squad behind a house and ordered a quick move into the house. half the squad use the close back entrance, the other half run around to the side and us another door? it seems in engine v4 they are more inclined to split up a use different doors, i did  not see that in the old games so much.

 

- building wall segments without windows, where the troops can fire through the solid wall. seen in the wilcox and breaking the bank scenario. it looks perfectly solid, no visual damage to the wall, but the enemy can see and shoot at you, and you can fire back through the solid wall.

 

- holes made with the "blast" command, sometimes are ignored by squads. the squad blasting the hole usually always uses the blasted hole, but if i try to send other squads after them, one may decide to run around the long way and often gets shot.