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@Elcloudythanks for the praise, glad you enjoy the vids.

I would suggest just buy one of them. As a newcomer you won't notice the difference. It's only those who got used to playing 3.0 that noticed the differences in 4.0.

I play H2H via PBEM on 4.0 and am having a great time. Each battle is a fresh challenge and extremely immersive. My opponent is in the same boat as I am so neither of us are at an unfair advantage or disadvantage.

It doesn't really matter which bundle you buy. If you don't like it then so be it. If you do like it then in 12 months time you'll probably buy another bundle.

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One more thing that nobody mentioned yet: The quality of the singleplayer campaigns.

CMBN base game comes with Road to Montebourg, which I highly recommend (the version that comes with the game is quite easy, but I sure didn't feel it was easy when I just started out!) Then once you complete that, you can download an updated version that makes it more challenging.

If you get the Commonwealth expansion, there's the Scottish Corridor campaign which is also very good (and not easy).

The CMBN German campaigns were not bad I guess, but I hardly even remember them.

CMFB comes with the Kampfgruppe Peiper campaign which is also very good, and made me learn a lot about this part of the war, because I kept looking up details on the web as I went along.

The Allied campaign of CMFB ('Knock 'em All Down') is also worth playing, but didn't leave as much of an impression. It's tough city fighting and I kept getting frustrated with the way flamethrowers don't really work as the assault weapons they should be. But that's another story.

I don't know how the campaigns of the other games are. In the end, go with the setting that interests you the most, then I'm sure you'll have a blast.

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6 hours ago, Heirloom_Tomato said:

If you have never played CMx2, you will have nothing to compare things to, so when the bugs people are complaining about show up, they may bother you less. I have not stopped playing any of the games and have adjusted my playing to how the game currently works. 

An excellent point. I would say that the AI is the one that suffers most and the problem is most obvious when troops in good cover under artillery barrage abandon thier good locations and start running around. So attacking the AI in good positions is not much fun.

Human players can issue a pause command and force thier men to stay put. That helps alot and while not perfect pretty much sorts it out for head to head play.

6 hours ago, Heirloom_Tomato said:

4. At all times remember your opponent is playing under the same system and rule set. What caused your men to react funny, die a horrible death, and make you spew your cold beverage in a rage filled tantrum? Whatever it was, do it back to your opponent and he will see the exact same problems. The worst part is tho, and I swear it is true, my opponents never seem to have the same problems I do.....

I snipped out lots of good advice there to highlight this. Always remember this. Your opponent human or AI is always playing under that same rules and behaviour. Even after the bug is fixed this still applies.

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14 hours ago, Bulletpoint said:

CMFB comes with the Kampfgruppe Peiper campaign which is also very good, and made me learn a lot about this part of the war, because I kept looking up details on the web as I went along.

The Allied campaign of CMFB ('Knock 'em All Down') is also worth playing, but didn't leave as much of an impression. It's tough city fighting and I kept getting frustrated with the way flamethrowers don't really work as the assault weapons they should be. But that's another story.

Close but no cigar. There are two US campaigns in CMFB, Courage Conquers which deals with the actions of CCR 4th Armored Division in its drive to relieve Bastogne and and Knock 'em all Down dealing with 3rd Battalion, 26 Infantry Regiment's fight for Aachen. Both are excellent campaigns.

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Think of 'bugs grogs' this way. Imagine an automobile discussion site, posters complaining bitterly that the Toyota Avalon has no feature to keep a driver from driving purposefully off a cliff. Yes, they're right, the Avalon doesn't have that feature, but is that an unconscionable design flaw or is that simply how cars work. That being said, CMSF2 is on the near horizon and a new title release invariably means new patch updates for all of the other titles to keep the game engine current across the board.

Its death to over-think a game purchase.
Its a game. Buy the game! The basegame is the price of a single big city restaurant meal (If you have to pay to park then its cheaper). No, you don't need to buy all of the modules and packs at once (or at all) in order to enjoy the game. Players were perfectly happy playing the basegame for years before the first module showed up. If you want 'more' then purchase more as your mood and finances allow. Instead of overanalyzing just think "Blowin' up Shermans/IS2s/T-64s/Renault FT-17s on a 3-d battlefield!

And finally... the DEMOS. Download the free demos and play the crap out of 'em. Play until you experience tunnel metacarpal syndrome. Then purchase the full game.

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8 hours ago, MikeyD said:

Download the free demos and play the crap out of 'em. Play until you experience tunnel metacarpal syndrome. Then purchase the full game.

Indeed. By the time a newcomer has played all the demos everything should be patched or at least SF2 will be released! 

I'm coming at this from a position like most players (I would suppose) where personal spending funds are not inexhaustible  - most people cannot just buy everything. Information about the game's "limitations"  (including any issues) is overwhelmingly important in the process of making a choice. I rarely purchase games straight off the bat for this very reason.

Anyway I digress... so where are the demos at?

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On 8/27/2018 at 2:48 AM, MikeyD said:

Think of 'bugs grogs' this way. Imagine an automobile discussion site, posters complaining bitterly that the Toyota Avalon has no feature to keep a driver from driving purposefully off a cliff. Yes, they're right, the Avalon doesn't have that feature, but is that an unconscionable design flaw or is that simply how cars work.

Actually, in this case, the car manufacturer has come out and said 'yes, actually our cars are not meant to drive themselves off a cliff'. So they will fix that issue and that's what we are patiently waiting for. Meanwhile, it's still fun to drive the car in places where there are no cliffs.

There ARE issues with 4.0. But even I don't think they make the game unplayable - and I'm one of the worst nitpickers on this forum.

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2 hours ago, Bulletpoint said:

 So they will fix that issue and that's what we are patiently waiting for.

Aye, like millions of car owners are waiting for the fix of faked exhaust gas concentrations.

But you are right, a beginner won’t notice the difference between V3 and V4.

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On 8/27/2018 at 1:48 AM, MikeyD said:

And finally... the DEMOS. Download the free demos and play the crap out of 'em. Play until you experience tunnel metacarpal syndrome. Then purchase the full game

Great advice! And then you can decide which Theatre of War you prefer before a possible purchase. And remember the big +1 that the CM series has over it's competition is it's WeGo mode.

Once you get used WeGO mode, you'll never look back to the RTS mode. Sometimes I can spend 30 minutes watching the same juicy 1 minute action turn  from different perspectives!

Edited by Kuderian
grammar

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1 hour ago, StieliAlpha said:

But you are right, a beginner won’t notice the difference between V3 and V4.

I've always had a pet peeve with tracers in games/movies (all ammunition in all guns is orange/yellow tracers). Even though I started with V3, once I read that V4 was going to have proper tracers -- I was converted. 

Even that annoying crazy infantry bug is peanuts compared to beautiful, accurate and most importantly colourful tracers that are in-game. Something I really missed when playing CMSF1/CMA. The muzzle flashes and guys shooting from corners are also desired additions.

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8 minutes ago, DerKommissar said:

Even that annoying crazy infantry bug is peanuts compared to beautiful, accurate and most importantly colourful tracers that are in-game.

Except when those lovely tracers are coming out of Brens and BARs one at a time. 😉 (Or from Bredas, but I barely notice the difference between the white tracers and the generic old yellow ones.) I agree on corners, it's really fun to have that in urban fights.

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Tracers haven't been one color in the game for awhile. Even Steve didn't realize that. He recently complained about a Beta tester using a 3rd party mod for screenshots and was told no, those green tracers are really from the game. ^_^

Tracers are game aids to help the player SEE what the heck is going on. No tracers, you see occasional puffs of smoke, your men fall down and you don't know what's happening. Tracers give you a lot of information. They tell you the number of rounds it the air, the direction of travel, the velocity and path arc. No tracers, you know none of that. Tracer's may not be 'real-world accurate' but neither is pausing time and pulling down a drop-down menu, or re-winding time and watching stuff happen.

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1 hour ago, MikeyD said:

Tracers haven't been one color in the game for awhile. Even Steve didn't realize that. He recently complained about a Beta tester using a 3rd party mod for screenshots and was told no, those green tracers are really from the game. ^_^

Tracers are game aids to help the player SEE what the heck is going on. No tracers, you see occasional puffs of smoke, your men fall down and you don't know what's happening. Tracers give you a lot of information. They tell you the number of rounds it the air, the direction of travel, the velocity and path arc. No tracers, you know none of that. Tracer's may not be 'real-world accurate' but neither is pausing time and pulling down a drop-down menu, or re-winding time and watching stuff happen.

So, 3.0 had yellow and green tracers? I wonder which weapons got which one.

I think with 4.0, tracers have become much more authentic. I think they could still be more "mixed" into the ammunition. With different weapons having different frequencies of tracer, maybe some get tracers at the end of a mag/belt. I think that's already partially implemented, isn't it?

1 hour ago, General Liederkranz said:

Except when those lovely tracers are coming out of Brens and BARs one at a time. 😉 (Or from Bredas, but I barely notice the difference between the white tracers and the generic old yellow ones.) I agree on corners, it's really fun to have that in urban fights.

Aye, I shed a tear for the Commonwealth infantry. I found that BARs kinda fulfill their intended purpose -- they weren't really designed as LMGs. Ha! When I saw those white tracers, I was stupefied. At first, I thought something GODLY was producing those white bolts towards my foxholed GIs. Turns out it was one of the crappiest LMGs in the war-- but, hey, at least it had style.

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4 hours ago, DerKommissar said:

I think with 4.0, tracers have become much more authentic. I think they could still be more "mixed" into the ammunition. With different weapons having different frequencies of tracer, maybe some get tracers at the end of a mag/belt. I think that's already partially implemented, isn't it?

Nope. V4 added a colour and a better look but the frequency, which is 100%, remains the same.

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18 hours ago, Kuderian said:

 Sometimes I can spend 30 minutes watching the same juicy 1 minute action turn  from different perspectives!

^^^This.

And sometimes something truly magical happens in the field and I need to see it ten times to actually believe it. 

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WeGo is great. I sit there, gnashing my teeth, as that ONE idiot does NOT follow the rest of his squad. Instead of going THROUGH the breach, he goes AROUND. ARRRrrrgggghhh! And I am powerless to do anything but watch...and then sit amazed as his squad gets pinned and it is he who saves them by opening up on the enemy from the flank.

In RTS I would've stopped the action and adjusted the squad's orders. Or, I would have never seen it at all.

 

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2 hours ago, c3k said:

WeGo is great. I sit there, gnashing my teeth, as that ONE idiot does NOT follow the rest of his squad. Instead of going THROUGH the breach, he goes AROUND. ARRRrrrgggghhh! And I am powerless to do anything but watch...and then sit amazed as his squad gets pinned and it is he who saves them by opening up on the enemy from the flank.

In RTS I would've stopped the action and adjusted the squad's orders. Or, I would have never seen it at all.

 

Yep, something like that drew me into CM, back in 99. A point blank shoot-out between a StuG and a Sherman. The question was: Would the StuG reload faster, than the Sherman turns it’s turret. Nail biting! 😎

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I started with RTS-mode, because I was more familiar with it in the genre. I liked it well enough, when I started out. I generally find that games take less with RTS-mode and I mostly played macro. Currently, I play with WEGO, I think it's the definitive way to play the game. Tactics games are usually either turn based or real-time pausable -- WEGO is fairly rare. Really giving you time to make elaborate plans and keep track of many units, while still boasting lively action during replay.

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On 8/28/2018 at 10:10 AM, Kuderian said:

Sometimes I can spend 30 minutes watching the same juicy 1 minute action turn  from different perspectives!

Yes, I too am guilty of that. Guilty! Guilty! Guilty!

:D

Michael

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