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Bil Hardenberger

CMSF 2 – US-SYRIA COMBINED OPS TACTICAL REPORT™ (BETA AAR)

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2 minutes ago, Bil Hardenberger said:

Now that amphibious vehicles can swim in game, this is definitely doable in CMSF 2.  We need LCUs and/or LCACs to deliver tanks to the beach though, eh?  ;) 

LOL, I guess I need to study up on the new mission of the Marine Corps. Our mission was "To seize and secure advanced naval bases ...." Our assaults were basically tracks, landing craft, and helo-bourne vertical envelopments. Armor would be brought in in an LST, usually after we secured a beach head.

The lack of a Jav team in every squad really doesn't bother me. We have them at a company or battalion level, and are usually deployed to formations. When I was in the Reserves in the 70's, I was a weapons section leader in a reinforced rifle platoon. We were detached from the company weapons platoon. We had a mortar section (three 60mm tubes), a machine gun squad (two M60 guns), and an antitank assault team with an M202-A1 multishot rocket launcher (the M202-A1 replaced the LAAW and the flamethrower). You can imagine how powerful that platoon was. Additionally, air support is an integral part of our TO (Super Cobra, AV-8B Harrier, and F/A-18 Hornet). Unlike the Army that has only attack helicopters an has to depend on the Airforce for the heavy stuff.

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Not to steal the show, but "Dam another former Marine" I served in the Marines from 72-76 then the rest in the Army. I was an 0811 then a 0861.

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Other than the extra men, Is there a more discernable difference in-game between Marines and Army? 

Eg, less likely to be suppressed at equivalent experience? 

I don't want to start a fisticuffs of Army Brats v Marine Jarheads, I'm curious from a strictly in-game, technical perspective. 

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37 minutes ago, kinophile said:

Other than the extra men, Is there a more discernable difference in-game between Marines and Army? 

Eg, less likely to be suppressed at equivalent experience? 

I don't want to start a fisticuffs of Army Brats v Marine Jarheads, I'm curious from a strictly in-game, technical perspective. 

Huge difference in how they perform in game... Marine squads are still attack effective after multiple casualties.

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2 hours ago, kinophile said:

Other than the extra men, Is there a more discernable difference in-game between Marines and Army? 

Eg, less likely to be suppressed at equivalent experience? 

I don't want to start a fisticuffs of Army Brats v Marine Jarheads, I'm curious from a strictly in-game, technical perspective. 

Ah no. The soft factors of training, motivation and leadership are what controls how soldiers perform - not the name of their branch. So, Veteran High motivation troops lead by +2 leader behave the same as any other troops so endowed. Weapons make a difference too of course - cannot forget that. The difference you experience in game will be due to the settings of those factors not because of the branch of service in the name in the UI.

I am seriously hoping that @c3k is doing what he does so well and yanking your chain.

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3 hours ago, kinophile said:

Other than the extra men, Is there a more discernable difference in-game between Marines and Army? 

Eg, less likely to be suppressed at equivalent experience? 

I don't want to start a fisticuffs of Army Brats v Marine Jarheads, I'm curious from a strictly in-game, technical perspective. 

I haven't sensed any difference other than by weapons or manpower. I usually manage my men as I did as a Rifle Platoon Sgt, so I might be managing Army units differently than an Army Plt Commander would. I just don't know Army tactics. Regarding weapons it the CMSF timeframe, Marines use M-16A? Rifles with a longer effective range than the Army M-4. Marine squads have three four-man fire teams. One Marine in each fire team has an M203 grenade launcher (or whatever the designation is now).

While I don't believe it's reflected in the game, Marines are definitely trained differently than Soldiers because in reality, they have different missions, just as Marine Riflemen and Marine Recon are trained differently because of their different missions. Marines don't split off two man scout teams if the have Recon around, and Recon Marines avoid engaging in combat unless they are Scout/Snipers. You should play Marines to their strengths.

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3 hours ago, c3k said:

Huge difference in how they perform in game... Marine squads are still attack effective after multiple casualties.

I haven't experienced that yet. Of course, I also don't use them as "Chesty Puller" C3K might🤕

 

5 hours ago, JohnO said:

Not to steal the show, but "Dam another former Marine" I served in the Marines from 72-76 then the rest in the Army. I was an 0811 then a 0861.

Holy Crap, 1/9! That's impressive. I was actually a mechanic on F4's at that time, but we all heard about 1/9 and the bounties they had on them.

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Marines in the game carry the full-length M16, not the M4 carbine. Theoretically their firing accuracy would be better and engagement range be somewhat longer. Though if anyone had tested this out to confirm it was years and years ago.

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Bigger Marine squads. More resiliency.

Three teams per Marine squad. More flexibility.

Marine squads on the attack perform better than Army squads. 13 men fight better than 7 or 9.

(Apologies... I did not mean to spam this thread.)

Edited by c3k

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5 minutes ago, c3k said:

Bigger Marine squads. More resiliency.

Three teams per Marine squad. More flexibility.

Marine squads on the attack perform better than Army squads. 13 men fight better than 7 or 9.

partially correct there are ToEs that offer other units the same 3 team tactical flexibility.  If you are going up against armor , one of the Mout options would offer a nice flexible unit with a lot of Javelins. ;)  When it comes to an infantry fight though those extra 3-4 rifles per Marine squad adds up very quickly to some serious punch.

Bradley/Stryker/Infantry squad- 9 men/2 teams

Bradley Mout - 9 men/3 teams

Stryker MOUT - 10 men/3 teams

Marines - 13 men/3 teams

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In CMBS "Bradley/Stryker/Infantry squad- 9 men/2 teams" is a real PITA since the Ukr can field three teams from only 7 men(!).  Playing the US, if one splits off a two man scout one is left with an unwieldy 7 man team.  And in the game that makes the Ukr much more capable/useful tactically.  

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12 hours ago, sburke said:

partially correct there are ToEs that offer other units the same 3 team tactical flexibility.  If you are going up against armor , one of the Mout options would offer a nice flexible unit with a lot of Javelins. ;)  When it comes to an infantry fight though those extra 3-4 rifles per Marine squad adds up very quickly to some serious punch.

Bradley/Stryker/Infantry squad- 9 men/2 teams

Bradley Mout - 9 men/3 teams

Stryker MOUT - 10 men/3 teams

Marines - 13 men/3 teams

Thanks. I was typing off quick answers in a hurry and didn't have time to dig in. Appreciate the detailed info.

Back on topic: How many men/teams are left to post in Baneman's thread???  ;)

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6 hours ago, Bil Hardenberger said:

I am officially calling this game over.  Sorry we couldn't finish it, or move it further along.

Bil

Ach.

I really enjoyed (as usual and as expected) watching your approach and reading your AAR.

Thanks for doing this.

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I suspect the 'real world' intervened, as it unfortunately tends to,  combined with the saved game 'baking-in' earlier Beta equipment and models than the title has currently. Which made publically showing off the infantry problematic. Infantry is very much prettier currently than their baked-in savegame infantry showed, and infantry will eventually be even prettier than it is currently. ^_^

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Hate to hear this one is being called...and I hope everything is ok with Baneman...I know awhile back my laptop went down and I lost everything and had to do an entire reinstall. It knocked me out of cm for a while! I also look forward to starting my rematches again with IanL...aka Canadian Cat! So IanL be looking for an email soon! He is a tough opponent Bill...be careful...look forward to seeing this one play out!

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6 hours ago, jpratt88 said:

 

Hate to hear this one is being called...and I hope everything is ok with Baneman...I know awhile back my laptop went down and I lost everything and had to do an entire reinstall. It knocked me out of cm for a while! I also look forward to starting my rematches again with IanL...aka Canadian Cat! So IanL be looking for an email soon! He is a tough opponent Bill...be careful...look forward to seeing this one play out!

 

In case anyone is wondering what he is talking about: 

Bil Hardenberger said:

If the current AAR dies Ian (which sadly, is very possible) perhaps you and I need to showcase a little Red v US action in the current BETA.

On 7/13/2018 at 9:24 AM, IanL said:

I hope your AAR doesn't get stalled out but if necessary I'm up for taking a beating 🙂

@jpratt88, rest assured that I try to not take anyone lightly... and I know @IanL has some skills.  I will be taking redfor in this action, so I'll probably lose.. but I promise to give him a tough fight (time to flex some of my NTC OPFOR muscles).  We are still working through the preliminaries so it'll be a few days before we can kick it off.

Bil

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I'm sorry that the current one has ended, but excited about the new one! I will be very interested in the tactics you will use as red force. Hopefully casualty percentage/ other victory conditions will give you a fair chance. 

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