Artkin Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 What? We bought T80s? Also to confirm - T84M are the ones represented in the game. They have the same hull and a new turret? As opposed to the T80 which is pictured above? I knew only the UK verson had shtora which added to my confusion. I was under the impression Ukraine kept the T84M's at least. They seem a little overrepresented in the game all of a sudden. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artkin Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 (edited) 14 hours ago, DerKommissar said: I am sure those are T-84s, but not Oplots. No thermals, and no bustle. I want my money back. Also, What's up with the turrets anyway? These look like theyre straight off the T-90A. I thought T80 turrets were similar to T72, sharing the boob shape. Thanks guys. Edited April 20, 2018 by Artkin 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c3k Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 I always thought I was fairly decent at tank recognition...until the Soviets/Russians started with the whole T-72 family and the various offshoots. Sigh. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerKommissar Posted April 20, 2018 Author Share Posted April 20, 2018 2 hours ago, c3k said: I always thought I was fairly decent at tank recognition...until the Soviets/Russians started with the whole T-72 family and the various offshoots. Sigh. The ERA just makes their silhouettes even more confusing. I have a Jane's tank identification book from the 2000s lying around somewhere, with really good photos. So, my knowledge of the Ukranian T-80 variants is from that, and could be outdated. So I decided to do some research: This is a diesel T-80U that entered production in Ukraine a few years prior to the collapse. After the collapse, these could not be made because they relied on parts from other ex-republics. So, around 320 of these were exported, in the 1990s, to Pakistan. That is when the new RF began exporting its T-90s, a customer of which, was India. The T-84 was designed as a completely domestic T-80. On this one, it is hard to see, but the new domestic T-84 had a all-welded turret. Each vehicle now had Shtora modules, as opposed to just the K (command) variants previously. Armament remained the same and the diesel engine was slightly improved. This one entered service in 1999, and saw further modifications (ie. diesel engine, armour modules). An Oplot is a T-84 with all-welded turret, Shtora, and new ERA. The new ERA are the distinguishing feature. The T-84s originally posted are T-84 Oplots. The question is: if you take a non-Oplot T-84 and slap new ERA on it, is it an Oplot? 10 hours ago, Artkin said: Also, What's up with the turrets anyway? These look like theyre straight off the T-90A. I thought T80 turrets were similar to T72, sharing the boob shape. Thanks guys. The development of the T-84 and the T-90 happened in parallel, and both competed for international sales. Who thought up the welded turret first, T-90A or T-84 Oplot? I do not know. This is the T-84 Oplot-M that we know and love. This one was first unveiled in 2008, and was ordered by Thailand and Pakistan. The first big difference is the panoramic thermal sight for the Commander, including new gunner sights, ballistic computer and FCS. It also has new ERA, new stabilizer (apparently) and "new" Shtora (Varta). Every source, including the Ukranian state exports site, say that they use a carousel type autoloader like the older versions and do not mention a turret bustle. In the early 2000s, Turkey was looking for a new MBT. When they stuck a 120mm "NATO-compatible" smoothbore gun and put the ammunition in the turret bustle -- it became the Yagatan or T-84-120. This prototype was not selected by Turkey, and that was that. New 120mm ammunition was developed specifically for this new 120mm gun, it also worked with standard NATO 120mm ammunition. That, my friends, is the tale of the T-84. Most info was taken from Military-Today, as you probably guessed. The RF will most likely shelf their T-80s, sooner or later -- but the UKR are moving forward with the design. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 (edited) The easy way to identify the diesel engine T-80UD (as opposed to gas-turbine T-80U, T-80UE & T-80UA) is the absence of the whopping great air filter on the back of the turret. This model of the T-80U shows the filter clearly: Whereas on the T-80UD it is absent: 3 hours ago, DerKommissar said: The RF will most likely shelf their T-80s, sooner or later Not for the time being fella.....At present older T-80BVs are being refurbished, a number of them will then be upgraded to the T-80BVM standard: Edited April 20, 2018 by Sgt.Squarehead 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted April 20, 2018 Share Posted April 20, 2018 (edited) 7 hours ago, c3k said: I always thought I was fairly decent at tank recognition...until the Soviets/Russians started with the whole T-72 family and the various offshoots. Sigh. Amen to that fella, with a few exceptions, T-80 identification is a doddle compared to T-72 identification.....Even before the locals start messing with them: T-72 Adra: T-72 'Gillette': And let's not even get started on the T-55s! Edited April 20, 2018 by Sgt.Squarehead 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerKommissar Posted April 20, 2018 Author Share Posted April 20, 2018 I usually identify the diesel version by the strange engine deck. Is this T-80UM upgrade scrapped? Yeah, we shared those improvised Syrian modifications on a different thread. I am under the impression most of them are lucky charms, born of desperation. On the other hand, they're responding to their own needs as operators -- and perhaps providing inspiration, and demands, for innovation. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted April 21, 2018 Share Posted April 21, 2018 Yeah, TBH that one seems to have been a technology demonstrator aimed at export customers, along the same lines as the T-90MS.....Many of the technologies it exhibits can be seen in one form or another on more recent designs. Both of those Syrian designs apparently seem to have some merit on the battlefield (but there are plenty of others that don't), I believe they are both 'mass produced' (by Syrian Civil War standards). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjkerner Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 Okay, grogs, have at it! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danfrodo Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 omg omg omg omg omg omg wheere can I see this???? They just don't make movies like that, I thought. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerKommissar Posted April 24, 2018 Author Share Posted April 24, 2018 18 hours ago, mjkerner said: Okay, grogs, have at it! Those are some pretty convincing P. 3's by movie standards. It's also really good to see a model '41 T-34, most you see in movies are the 85s. Camouflage is a bit crazy, like CoH 2 micro-transaction specials. Much like actors and actresses in movies, tanks need their make-up. I am also glad that the Russian film industry doesn't shy away from certain historical symbols that are often associated with Germany of this time. I like that they got they used the right sights for the German and Soviet gun optics. A pet peeve of mine are how tiny battles are in these movies. This one feels kind of silly, in that regard. Soviet village in the middle of nowhere, and everything happens within 50 square feet. A single T-34 by itself? Not part of a platoon or company? Lame. Tanks facing off like Nick Cage and Travolta within 5 meters of each other, and getting ricochets from the looks of it? I see we have Brad Pitt returning as bedraggled tank commander. I'm guessing this is going to be a lone T-34 taking on an entire division? Nice infantry costumes, though! I probably won't see it, unless I have absolutely nothing to do. I saw White Tiger -- much of mystical nonsense and a few good tanks. Why can't they make movies like Liberation, or that film about the SU-100s? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 Trying to figure out what the running gear on the pseudo-Pz.IIIs is.....BMD with holes drilled in the roadwheels maybe? They should have rented this: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerKommissar Posted April 24, 2018 Author Share Posted April 24, 2018 M728 Combat Engineering Vehicle: Centurion AVRE: Both got the 165mm demolisher cannon, lobbing big ol' HESH. ??? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 You can't do AVREs without including the granddaddy: 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerKommissar Posted May 1, 2018 Author Share Posted May 1, 2018 Recently, I've been running into the MBT-70 (Kpz. 70). I have to say, I really like the design: Why put the gunner and commander in the hull, when you can put the driver (partially) in the turret? I can imagine the 152mm works wonders in CS. The 20mm AA gives the commander something fun to play with. It seems to have been ahead of its time with the dynamic suspension -- something the Type 10 and others have taken on. Another story from development hell. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerKommissar Posted May 1, 2018 Author Share Posted May 1, 2018 A baby Abrams. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanir Ausf B Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 Awwww, how cute! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted May 1, 2018 Share Posted May 1, 2018 2 hours ago, DerKommissar said: A baby Abrams. It doesn't seem to have any TOWs. Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt.Squarehead Posted May 3, 2018 Share Posted May 3, 2018 What is that thing? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 A partially emasculated Bradley? Michael 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerKommissar Posted May 4, 2018 Author Share Posted May 4, 2018 (edited) It's a powerwheels. You know? For Kids! Woops, accidentally posted the new Armata family vehicle. In all seriousness, that's the BAE Black Knight unmanned ground vehicle. Word on the street is that the project was canned. Not surprising, considering its turret is jammed up against its engine deck. How is it supposed to turn? If it's a fixed gun, why is there an obvious structural weakness of a gap between casemate and hull? WHAT WERE THEY THINKING? So, pretty much, a modernized teletank with a 30mm and an GPMG. Except the 1930s Soviets got the rotating turret thing down. Edited May 4, 2018 by DerKommissar 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerKommissar Posted June 5, 2018 Author Share Posted June 5, 2018 (edited) Looking for pakwagen oddities. I found this: Description is: "SdKfz.250 - Sfl 5cm Pak 38 L/60, Belgrade Military Museum, Serbia." Was this a last ditch frankenstein or a post-war invention? Some more oddities: Edited June 5, 2018 by DerKommissar 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerKommissar Posted September 21, 2018 Author Share Posted September 21, 2018 Not all Hetzers are made equal. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erwin Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 Love the buried hand... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyD Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 (edited) I have a pet theory that the M47 tank turret is basically an Americanized cast Panther Schmalturm turret. I think the design came out in '47, just two years after the allies laid their hands on Panther Schmalturm. I've never seen anyone note the resemblance in a publication but c'mon. you can see it, can't you? Can't you? Edited September 21, 2018 by MikeyD 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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