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markus544

M-26 Pershing..Super Pershing ??

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That 76 Jumbo picture is VERY late. See that mesh screen for foliage? That's from an assembly line modification program that took place in... March(?), I believe (my sources aren't handy).

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9 hours ago, MikeyD said:

That 76 Jumbo picture is VERY late. See that mesh screen for foliage? That's from an assembly line modification program that took place in... March(?), I believe (my sources aren't handy).

You sure about that fella?  I've got the photo series that one is from somewhere (IIRC it's Creighton Abrams' unit) and I'm pretty sure the pictures are earlier than the date you suggest for the modification (not 100% though).  Could that be a field expedient example?

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Where is that darned reference on late war modifications? It detailed the modification program, provided units, dates, methods, photos and drawings. I searched high and low, from the top of the stack to the bottom. but it didn't fall into my hands, Oh well...

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I know that feeling!  ;)

Sometimes it really is possible to have to much stuff squirreled away isn't it.  :D

PS - IIRC the images with the unit in question feature prominently in one of the Armour At War titles.....Not sure which one off hand (and again, I could be wrong).

Edited by Sgt.Squarehead

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21 hours ago, MikeyD said:

Where is that darned reference on late war modifications? It detailed the modification program, provided units, dates, methods, photos and drawings. I searched high and low, from the top of the stack to the bottom. but it didn't fall into my hands, Oh well...

If you think that is bad, a decade or so ago I gave up being a moderator over on 'Axis History Forum' when I realized I couldn't even remember where I had read a certain piece of information. I knew I had read it, and I was confident that I remembered the gist of it right, but I could no longer quote chapter and verse.

:(

Michael

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or worse, being sure you remember something and when you do check the actual reference, you realise you remembered it completely wrong.

A problem as you get older. For example when I did the "Battle of Chaumont" scenarios, I had found a source listing the exact types, i.e. 75mm, 76,mm, Jumbo fielded by the U.S. forces, but now I cannot find the source or even remember what it was...

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23 hours ago, Sgt Joch said:

or worse, being sure you remember something and when you do check the actual reference, you realise you remembered it completely wrong.

A problem as you get older. For example when I did the "Battle of Chaumont" scenarios, I had found a source listing the exact types, i.e. 75mm, 76,mm, Jumbo fielded by the U.S. forces, but now I cannot find the source or even remember what it was...

They were good scenarios though - I enjoyed testing them, so I wouldn't be too hard on yourself.

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Am about to purchase a copy of Hunnicutt’s book on the Pershing. Having a deucedly difficult time trying to determine the “best” publisher and edition. 

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5 hours ago, c3k said:

Am about to purchase a copy of Hunnicutt’s book on the Pershing. Having a deucedly difficult time trying to determine the “best” publisher and edition. 

I have the 1996 2nd edition. It is the same as the original with the glossy pages and the white cover. It is published by Feist Publications. The newer ones are the Echo Point reprints. I have the Echo point reprint of Firepower. From what I can tell the originals are better quality especially the photos. They're also quite a bit more expensive and hard to find. I would say if money isn't an issue, look to get a good used copy of the Feist 2nd edition. Hope this helps.

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1 hour ago, jtsjc1 said:

I have the 1996 2nd edition. It is the same as the original with the glossy pages and the white cover. It is published by Feist Publications. The newer ones are the Echo Point reprints. I have the Echo point reprint of Firepower. From what I can tell the originals are better quality especially the photos. They're also quite a bit more expensive and hard to find. I would say if money isn't an issue, look to get a good used copy of the Feist 2nd edition. Hope this helps.

Yes, it did help. Thanks.

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The original plates for the Presidio Press 'Pershing' book were lost in a fire. The second edition (which I have) was a heroic undertaking by Feist to reproduce the original down to the smallest detail. They did a commendable job

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The 2nd edition of Sherman is just as good. I jumped on them when they were reprinted. The 2nd editions are excellent. Sherman is a 1994 Presidio Press reprint same as the 1st edition. Again I would look for these used before the Echo Point new copies.

Edited by jtsjc1

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1 hour ago, MikeyD said:

The original plates for the Presidio Press 'Pershing' book were lost in a fire. The second edition (which I have) was a heroic undertaking by Feist to reproduce the original down to the smallest detail. They did a commendable job

 

50 minutes ago, jtsjc1 said:

The 2nd edition of Sherman is just as good. I jumped on them when they were reprinted. The 2nd editions are excellent. Sherman is a 1994 Presidio Press reprint same as the 1st edition. Again I would look for these used before the Echo Point new copies.

Just picked a copy of "Pershing", published by Feist. "Like new" condition was an understatement. Off to hunt a good copy of "Sherman". Thanks for the pointers.

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On ‎2‎/‎19‎/‎2018 at 12:14 AM, General Jack Ripper said:

If you do find it, I'd love to see it, but don't beat yourself up over it.

Here's the closest thing I've found since:

9fee19e40e.png

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Posted (edited)
On 1/11/2018 at 12:40 PM, markus544 said:

Does anyone think that these battles might be in our future...Crossing the Rhine,  Cologne tank fights where Panther was knocked out by a Pershing.  I hope we get to see some of stuff.  

You must be referencing the YouTube video of that confrontation.  Although a Pershing could indeed knock a Panther, the one at Cologne took all of it's hits in the side.

Edited by transporter

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Super Pershings were in CM1 along with a plethora of other vehicles and weapons.  Historically accurate, maybe not but then this is a game and sometimes it is fun to throw in some stuff to  make the game interesting.

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4 hours ago, General Jack Ripper said:

150mm - 460mm penetration of steel-lined concrete?

I think the liner refers to the metal lining inside the shaped charge warhead.

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Posted (edited)

As at @Bulletpoint suggests, those figures represent the composition and design of the shaped charge, however the final two columns (IIUIC) give you the comparative penetration of the same weight of identical explosive driving shaped charges of various compositions (into a concrete target).

Edited by Sgt.Squarehead

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If interested in the Super Pershing, please refer to Belton Cooper's Death Traps, for he was an ordnance officer in 3 AD and is quite knowledgeable (really gets into it) regarding how the Super Pershing was put together. My recollection is the additional glacis armor was really from a boiler and that the mantlet armor was indeed from a Panther glacis plate. The additional gun weight, plus the add-on mantlet armor, exceeded the capacity of the existing elevation drives, forcing the fitting of the two equilibrators to compensate. Would expect a lot of counterwieght had to be added to the rear of the turret, too. For its use in combat, be sure to read John Irwin's phenomenal  Another River, Another Town. Irwin arrived at the repple depple in Germany, was sent to 3 AD and thought he'd be an assistant gunner (loader?) to learn the combat ropes, but instead found himself in practically the lead tank of the AD's about to commence offensive, for a gunner with a whole six weeks of training! In fairly short order, he wound up in one of two Super Pershings and had quite the adventures in it. He briefly comments on the other one, too.

Regards,

John Kettler

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