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Fire suppression from small arms discussion

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What makes items obscenely expensive is the servicing and maintenance that the contractors ensure that they build into the products.  Like when your fridge goes bad after a couple years use and it costs $600 to change a circuit board - and of course you have to get a contractor to do that - god forbid they make a fridge so that a customer could service it.  Cars are going the same way now...

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On 1/8/2019 at 3:31 PM, Erwin said:

Cars are going the same way now...

From what I have heard from car owners, they began doing that 20-30 years ago. And every computer I've ever owned has come with a proviso that it must be serviced by an authorized service representative or the warrantee is voided.

Michael

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1 hour ago, Erwin said:

How long b4 hospitals start doing the same thing?   "Sorry, you went to an unapproved doctor, your insurance is now void at this hospital."

Insurance has been that way for 20-30 years now too.  Not Hospital specific per say but managed care limited you to a set list of doctors - which is the same thing.

As for cars, I remember when changing a headlight involved unscrewing the old one and putting a new one in.  Now it requires special tools and usually taking apart half of the bumper.

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1 hour ago, Dynaman216 said:

As for cars, I remember when changing a headlight involved unscrewing the old one and putting a new one in.  Now it requires special tools and usually taking apart half of the bumper.

Every year manufacturers are adding more model specific tools to automobile components not to mention locking down the software needed to what was once thought of as routine diagnostics. It's progress I guess...

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4 hours ago, Erwin said:

Obviously it's a question of who decides what is interesting.  Reminds me of the happy old days of the Soviet Union.  Good times.

Oh, shove it. If someone sees that the topic is about suppression from small arms, that's the discussion they should see when they open the topic - not a bunch of grumblings about health insurance and car repairs. 

Edited by LukeFF

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6 hours ago, LukeFF said:

Oh, shove it. If someone sees that the topic is about suppression from small arms, that's the discussion they should see when they open the topic - not a bunch of grumblings about health insurance and car repairs. 

Get em, Luke. 😃 

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On 1/8/2019 at 6:31 PM, Erwin said:

 

I apologize. I had replied to this thread and didn't realize it is an old thread. I want to withdraw my remarks, I dont want to make anyone mad. Thanks

Edited by J Bennett

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On 1/13/2019 at 1:55 PM, LukeFF said:

Oh, shove it. If someone sees that the topic is about suppression from small arms, that's the discussion they should see when they open the topic - not a bunch of grumblings about health insurance and car repairs. 

There are many topics that go off in weird directions, but only certain ones that upset certain people seem to get criticised.  Some people get irritated. Others find em interesting.  I'll start keeping a better look out for the other off topic threads and bring them to your attention so as to help you make sure you can police them as well.  Thank you for your service.

Edited by Erwin

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Back on topic a little, the second-order consequence of fatigue is that you won't be able to move Quick or Fast when you really need to - in situations where you need to move up to support a fight, to get the hell away from incoming spotting rounds or when you've gleefully wandered into a kill zone. It doesn't directly hinder your shooting, but it can certainly degrade your ability to fight, albeit indirectly.

In a similar vein - the Leadership stat of the HQ unit doesn't help your subordinate squads recover from suppression (counter-intuitively for wargamers), only the active C2 link matters. On the other hand, a high leadership HQ unit will itself stay unsuppressed longer, meaning that it will keep C2 links active for longer under fire, so the second-order effect is more or less the same thing.

 

Edited by domfluff

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21 hours ago, domfluff said:

the second-order consequence of fatigue is that you won't be able to move Quick or Fast when you really need to

Couldn't agree more.  Am always surprised that many seem to FAST move most of the time.  It seems to work for them(?)  If not under fire, I use MOVE mostly.  Then QUICK... with FAST reserved for emergency situations or when crossing a dangerous area of ground when you definitely do not want troops to stop and fire at targets.  

The wonderful thing about QUICK for AT teams, is that if close enuff to enemy armor they will often stop and fire and kill a tank at short range b4 continuing to the final waypoint.

HUNT has become the least used or useful (for larger formations) as many times you do not want troops to stop when fired upon.  I find that HUNT is mostly useful for recon teams since you usually want them to stop and HIDE if fired upon.

Uh oh...  Just realized... this topic is about fire suppression not movement issues.  Apologies for being off-topic.

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On 1/8/2019 at 6:31 PM, Erwin said:

What makes items obscenely expensive is the servicing and maintenance that the contractors ensure that they build into the products.  

Not part of a nuclear submarine design and construction contract. The vast majority of submarine maintenance is done at government shipyards by government employees. The private shipyards do some small minor or emergent jobs. These aren't big bucks by any means. In addition a VIRGINIA submarine costs in the ballpark of $3.2B. The "contractor's" part of that is in the neighborhood of $1B+. That includes subcontracting for CFE (contractor furnished equipment), like valves and pipe.  There is a LOT of GFE in a sub. (government furnished equipment). Of course, for much of that equipment, other contractors build them and supply them to the shipyard. The Navy, however, drives a hard bargain, and for nuclear subs, they are being delivered ahead of schedule (on an ever decreasing schedule) and under budget. It's a program where taxpayers are getting their money's worth, with good accounting.

Circuit board replacements are done by the crew. From spare parts they stock and carry on the ship. 

I don't know about other weapons systems contracts.

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