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You have no tank or smoke support. If pined down by enemy mg far away, would you rather have troops crawl into a house avoiding all casualties and go through their exhaustion time (5 min or more!) or move them fast across the field into the house risking the men to the mg fire, but not being exhausted when they get there?

Edited by user1000

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If you mean Pinned in an Arbitrary sense, and since the MG is far away, then I would use 'Quick' (in hopes CM gives a slight Moral boost for using 'Quick' vs 'Fast') to the House...However, if you mean 'Pinned' in CM terms, then it would be hard to move at all until recovered.

Joe

 

Edited by JoMc67

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4 hours ago, JoMc67 said:

If you mean Pinned in an Arbitrary sense, and since the MG is far away, then I would use 'Quick' (in hopes CM gives a slight Moral boost for using 'Quick' vs 'Fast') to the House...However, if you mean 'Pinned' in CM terms, then it would be hard to move at all until recovered.

Joe

 

If I recall correctly:  Quick vs Fast also depends.  Fast troops don't hesitate as soon as Quick ones might.

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Movement tends to become FAST whether you order MOVE or QUICK (unless suppressed).

Perhaps the question should be what would YOU do in the circumstances?  That is generally what I ask myself to attempt to make things as realistic as I can.  (Not what YOU would do, but what I would do.  Maybe I should also consider what YOU would do.  But, I don't know you very well.  Hmmm...  something to think about...)

Edited by Erwin

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4 hours ago, user1000 said:

hmmm.. seems you would all just sit  with your tail between you legs or run back to friendly lines...

Wargame players are known to be smarter than yer average person.  ^_^

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18 hours ago, user1000 said:

You have no tank or smoke support. If pined down by enemy mg far away, would you rather have troops crawl into a house avoiding all casualties and go through their exhaustion time (5 min or more!) or move them fast across the field into the house risking the men to the mg fire, but not being exhausted when they get there?

Distance between house and initial position?

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17 hours ago, weapon2010 said:

exhausted men can recover and fight, casualties cant

but then the clock is ticking and you have to wait for your men to come back down form fatigue level to aim or move normal again.

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14 hours ago, Erwin said:

Wargame players are known to be smarter than yer average person.  ^_^

Spock: "He is intelligent, but not experienced...His pattern indicates two dimensional thinking"...Kirk: "Tee Minus 500 meters" ;)

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On ‎11‎/‎11‎/‎2017 at 10:07 AM, user1000 said:

You have no tank or smoke support. If pined down by enemy mg far away, would you rather have troops crawl into a house avoiding all casualties and go through their exhaustion time (5 min or more!) or move them fast across the field into the house risking the men to the mg fire, but not being exhausted when they get there?

Order 'em to move fast/quick, whichever is available. Hard to hit a laterally moving target. If they get hit, well, it'll motivate the rest to move faster. Win, win.

If they're so out of shape that they can only go Normal, then send them at the distant enemy's position as punishment for their laziness. Perhaps being a bullet sponge would be the most useful role they could perform.

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On 11/11/2017 at 9:07 AM, user1000 said:

You have no tank or smoke support. If pined down by enemy mg far away, would you rather have troops crawl into a house avoiding all casualties and go through their exhaustion time (5 min or more!) or move them fast across the field into the house risking the men to the mg fire, but not being exhausted when they get there?

In theory they would have an overwatch that would suppress the MG.  But if something happened to the overwatch.............  I would split into teams.  (Maybe you only have one team? Don't know)  If they can avoid casualties by crawling they can probably avoid casualties by staying prone Hide and waiting on an overwatch unit to come to their aid.  If things are so FUBAR that this is not an option........................   I would have them use their own smoke grenades (if they have them).  Then with or without smoke grenades I would have them Quick for 24 meters Pause 10 seconds and Hide - then Quick for 24 meters Pause 10 seconds and Hide - etc. until in cover. If I had multiple teams they would alternate their Quick moves.  The Pauses should disrupt the OpFor aiming process.  Of course you may wind up with a Casvac situation before this is over. :o   

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Moving for a short distance (10m-20m) then pausing and hiding has worked well in my experience in most situations where one's troops are moving in sight of enemy (if not already being shot at).  Recommend to move FAST for a short distance in this situation however.  If you use QUICK, the AI could make your troops stop and return fire.

eg:  I had an AT team move QUICK and while moving they spotted an enemy tank.  The AI had them stop and shoot the tank.  In this case it was a pleasure to watch.  In the situation described above, you would not want them to stop and return fire.

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5 hours ago, Erwin said:

<Snip> Moving for a short distance (10m-20m) then pausing and hiding has worked well in my experience in most situations where one's troops are moving in sight of enemy (if not already being shot at).  Recommend to move FAST for a short distance in this situation however.  If you use QUICK, the AI could make your troops stop and return fire. <Snip> 

That's a good point.  I was thinking of the fatigue effect.  @user1000 said it was 200 feet distance to cover.  Not sure if he meant 200 feet (61 meters) or he meant 200 meters.  I am guessing 200 meters since meters is the in game measurement.  But Fast might work or Quick with a 360o  Target Arc.    

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On 12/11/2017 at 10:45 PM, user1000 said:

but then the clock is ticking and you have to wait for your men to come back down form fatigue level to aim or move normal again.

As fatigued units have no penalty to accuracy then crawl would be the logical option so as to minimise casualties and combat stress. 

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"...fatigued units have no penalty to accuracy..." 

That surprised me.  When one thinks "fatigued", one visualizes breathing heavily, adrenalin and high blood pressure affecting eyesight etc.   You sure about that?

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5 hours ago, Erwin said:

"...fatigued units have no penalty to accuracy..." 

That surprised me.  When one thinks "fatigued", one visualizes breathing heavily, adrenalin and high blood pressure affecting eyesight etc.   You sure about that?

I realise it's counter intuitive but the only factor shown to affect accuracy is experience. Exhausted regulars will shoot better than rested conscripts. This was tested on upgrade 4.0 so I can't say if the case was different for earlier versions.

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On ‎11‎/‎12‎/‎2017 at 6:57 PM, c3k said:

Order 'em to move fast/quick, whichever is available. Hard to hit a laterally moving target. If they get hit, well, it'll motivate the rest to move faster. Win, win.

If they're so out of shape that they can only go Normal, then send them at the distant enemy's position as punishment for their laziness. Perhaps being a bullet sponge would be the most useful role they could perform.

actually you are almost correct, I would do as you and get them the heck out of there but I would use the evade command for my movement.

Evade button is the best tool in the game. Not only will the troops run to cover, but they will resist the urge to drop and get pinned again. I have found evade to be one of the best movement commands in the game.

 

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4 minutes ago, slysniper said:

actually you are almost correct, I would do as you and get them the heck out of there but I would use the evade command for my movement.

Evade button is the best tool in the game. Not only will the troops run to cover, but they will resist the urge to drop and get pinned again. I have found evade to be one of the best movement commands in the game.

 

Good point. I very often forget about using the Evade button. Good reminder on its use.

Edited by c3k

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+1 for using the evade button. It is also *the* way to get pinned troops to actually move. Just giving them a regular order might just be cancelled but using the evade button it will not. At least I have never seen it.

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Of course, but the flip side is that they're pinned for a reason more often than not. I use evade habitually as well but sometimes you gotta wait for the fire to slacken or you're going to feed the enemy casualties even faster. 

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4 hours ago, Rinaldi said:

Of course, but the flip side is that they're pinned for a reason more often than not. I use evade habitually as well but sometimes you gotta wait for the fire to slacken or you're going to feed the enemy casualties even faster. 

Mmm, casualties.

Delicious.

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5 hours ago, c3k said:

Good point. I very often forget about using the Evade button. Good reminder on its use.

And since I know how you love to run your men to bloody glory.

Evade can also be used as a assault command.

 

Just think of it as the button to make you a Russian commissar

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